Auction house "camper" with a twist

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Talked with a GM... In general it's legal to run scripts that mass cancel and mass list auctions. It's allowed.

However, if blizzard cared about anything, they'd make it so you could only do like 20 auctions a day, more than enough for any player to do without obviously scripting the crap out of stuff to cheat.


How did I miss this?

This is stupid. First, I routinely have over 1000 auctions running at a time between my three bankers. No cheating involved. I do use TSM to post, but I've yet to have an explination as to why that's worse than raiders using DBM.

Second, it'd hurt consumers even more. Can you imagine how much prices would skyrocket for what you would find?
I'm just a very casual player, and when I decide to increase my funds a bit (AH empty, prices up, weekend, etc.) its not uncommon for me to have 200+ auctions up at a time.

I can understand the frustration of undercutting. I have someone on my server who started doing this a couple months ago on the engineering items I used to list- Ghost Iron Dragonling and the gears that go with them. No matter what I would list at, he would undercut quickly. If I put up an auction, he would undercut within an hour. If I tried undercutting him, he pulled his auctions and relisted under mine. He would do this over and over until I gave up after several weeks. It was at the point where he was losing a ton of money because his prices were so low, but he continued. I eventually gave up...he can do battle with someone else who has enough gold to fight him with.

As for the bots, like I said, I'm just a very casual player, but even I have a banker alt with her own guild to do my auction listings. I use my phone at odd hours to list what I have mailed her, relist what didn't sell, and buy cheap stuff to relist higher. Having lots of auctions up, or even them camping the AH doesn't mean much. I have insomnia, so its not uncommon to see me logged in at any time of the day or night if I can't sleep. Right now is a good example...6:30 am and I'm still up.

Its also not that uncommon for one person to have a couple accounts. I usually have a laptop open next to me when I'm playing so its easier to check the web if I need help with something. It wouldn't be difficult for someone to have a 2nd account just to use as their banker, to handle all these things while they are playing with their main account. That 2nd account could be in the AH as long as the person is awake. Mail stuff to that toon with their main account whenever the bags get full, just like when using a regular alt banker, except this way they can both be logged in at the same time, constantly checking the AH and taking care of business.
02/09/2013 12:01 PMPosted by Tsillah
Talked with a GM... In general it's legal to run scripts that mass cancel and mass list auctions. It's allowed.

The GM was talking about the TradeSkillMaster addon. That is allowed. That is the LIMIT of what is allowed.

The authors of TSM are very good at AH trading, but they work directly with Blizzard and make SURE they are within the rules.

If you are not using TSM, you should play with it, it will give you a very good understanding of what is allowed, how others play, and what isn't a bot.

02/10/2013 10:22 PMPosted by Consortium
How did I miss this?

You didn't.

This is stupid. First, I routinely have over 1000 auctions running at a time between my three bankers. No cheating involved. I do use TSM to post, but I've yet to have an explination as to why that's worse than raiders using DBM.

You know how TSM works so you understand the limitations. It will auto-select, auto-scan and auto-price, but your human finger must still bang a button for EACH ITEM (or stack) listed or canceled.

You CANNOT use a G15, bot, or sippy bird to bang the button for you, or to autostart TSM scans. In fact, TSM has some specific features to make it hard for bots to use.
'm just a very casual player, and when I decide to increase my funds a bit (AH empty, prices up, weekend, etc.) its not uncommon for me to have 200+ auctions up at a time.

I can understand the frustration of undercutting. I have someone on my server who started doing this a couple months ago on the engineering items I used to list- Ghost Iron Dragonling and the gears that go with them. No matter what I would list at, he would undercut quickly. If I put up an auction, he would undercut within an hour.

An hour? That's not botting. That's TSM.

If you're not using TSM, the frustration is that you have to manually type the name of, check, cancel, re-price and re-list each thing individually and it's very tedious. Meanwhile that guy is just banging a button 100 times, running to his mailbox and banging the button 100 more times. It feels like you're fighting a bot.

Running without TSM is like fighting an air war without radar. You can do it, but you'll lose bad to someone who has it.

If I tried undercutting him, he pulled his auctions and relisted under mine. He would do this over and over until I gave up after several weeks. It was at the point where he was losing a ton of money because his prices were so low, but he continued. I eventually gave up...he can do battle with someone else who has enough gold to fight him with.

That is called "walling" (verb: to wall). Posting to force the market price at or below a certain point. Likely near the cost of making it, so you can't make any money. A few weeks of that and you were gone. After you left, prices went back up, yet you didn't come back.

Its also not that uncommon for one person to have a couple accounts. I usually have a laptop open next to me when I'm playing so its easier to check the web if I need help with something. It wouldn't be difficult for someone to have a 2nd account just to use as their banker, to handle all these things while they are playing with their main account. That 2nd account could be in the AH as long as the person is awake.

That's allowed.

Heck, once I had a second account selling the same stuff as this account. I used the other account to "wall" to deal with another problem lister, but without them knowing it was me doing it.
Maybe the other person is real and you're the bot.

-M. Night Shamlalablammoban

This. A real bot would be online for 24hours at a time, not 12. Of course it always could be a bot, but more likely it was someone laid off of work, on summer break, or who just enjoys playing the AH.


I monitored a bot for a long time, undercutting then watching it travel the SAME EXACT path back and forth from the mailbox, keyboard turning and jerky movements...

He was only on for 1/2 the day too.
I have a bot on my server that has dominated the glyph market for about two years straight now. He always posts glyphs for barely over mats cost, and never lets them run out of stock. About 6 months ago I actually found him on the undermine journal and saw his AH activity map. If he were an actual human he would be either dead or insane due to lack of sleep, especially after years of that much sleep loss.

I linked the graph chart on another site, and many fellow Goblins agreed with me that he could not be human. I sent multiple tickets each with pictures of the graph data, which is undisputable and 100 percent accurate, as the data is drawed from the World of warcraft servers officially. I never saw any results from my reports.

Everytime there was a bot nuke or major patch he would be gone for like 2 days, and the glyph prices were amazing during that time. I made so much gold and I wished it could be like that all of the time.

I eventually dropped my maxed scribe for another alchimist, as the effort was NOT worth the time spent crafting glyphs and battling him for the measly leftover profits. I quit WoW for 4 months and just returned 2 days ago.....He's still here.

It's so sad seeing that. I wonder how much real life money he's made from ruining the glyph market for YEARS on my server. Oh and also, I talked to one of his friends a while back.....apparently he uses the ''goldenbuddy'' bot program. LOL.

Oh and the bots name is Eyees. Yeah, I named a player on the forums, but you know what? As this is a robot and not an actual player/human being, one would think that the rule would not apply in this case ;)
I have not seen the AH camper/ bot for a couple weeks nor have I seen a new low level toon from that same guild. It's nice to have my stuff selling again.

I've also started talking to the other cut gem sellers. They are very happy that the bot has left... but for how long?
After 6 days the bot is back. New level 1 toon but in the same guild. The guild is the only reason I know it's the same person. I dont know if it's the same account or if he create a new account.

I wish Blizzard would tell us their actions on these players.
Separare, looking at his posting activity in no way screams bot to me, I'm almost certain that's just a dude using tsm. Spending a lot of time on the AH? Sure. Botting? Absolutely no proof. Just because someone posts on a low level toon and spends a lot of time on the AH does not make them a bot.
02/20/2013 08:25 AMPosted by Chigurh
Separare, looking at his posting activity in no way screams bot to me, I'm almost certain that's just a dude using tsm. Spending a lot of time on the AH? Sure. Botting? Absolutely no proof. Just because someone posts on a low level toon and spends a lot of time on the AH does not make them a bot.


I'm not just using his posting activity. I have him on my buddies list and I can see that he is in SW the whole time I'm online and he was still there when I logged on the following morning.

He keeps creating new low level toons and has been doing this before the end of Cata. I'm only able to track him because he is in the same guild. Is he trying to hide from the system by creating new toons?

For the length of time he has been playing the AH, he should have already gold capped many times over. What is he doing with all that gold?

Yeah, I can see a someone playing the AH short term to have some gold or to see how much they could make.... but for this long?
You honestly DO NOT know 100% for sure if those people were bots. @ 3am when I am tired who knows... I could look like a bot to other people.

I'm not just using his posting activity. I have him on my buddies list and I can see that he is in SW the whole time I'm online and he was still there when I logged on the following morning.

He keeps creating new low level toons and has been doing this before the end of Cata. I'm only able to track him because he is in the same guild. Is he trying to hide from the system by creating new toons?

For the length of time he has been playing the AH, he should have already gold capped many times over. What is he doing with all that gold?

Yeah, I can see a someone playing the AH short term to have some gold or to see how much they could make.... but for this long?


So he plays a lot. Probably has a lot of gold. This does not scream bot to me.

I play a lot too. I have two accounts, and if I'm online my level 1 banker alt is almost always on as well. I have several million gold and still see no reason to stop playing the AH because *gasp* I enjoy doing it. It isn't just about becoming WoW-rich, it's also about having fun. Besides, there's always ways to use gold (i've blown well over a million on the BMAH, and the only reason it isnt more is a few mounts I want havent shown up yet).

If you want to know if it's a bot camp yourself near him and watch. Does he always take the *exact* same path from AH to mailbox? Are his movements jerky? If so, then he's very likely a bot. If not...he probably isn't and just plays a lot.

People need to stop throwing that word around so carelessly.


So he plays a lot. Probably has a lot of gold. This does not scream bot to me.

I play a lot too. I have two accounts, and if I'm online my level 1 banker alt is almost always on as well. I have several million gold and still see no reason to stop playing the AH because *gasp* I enjoy doing it. It isn't just about becoming WoW-rich, it's also about having fun. Besides, there's always ways to use gold (i've blown well over a million on the BMAH, and the only reason it isnt more is a few mounts I want havent shown up yet).

If you want to know if it's a bot camp yourself near him and watch. Does he always take the *exact* same path from AH to mailbox? Are his movements jerky? If so, then he's very likely a bot. If not...he probably isn't and just plays a lot.

People need to stop throwing that word around so carelessly.


You are right. I dont know if he is a bot. Or maybe AH camper would be a better word to use.

If he is doing something against Blizzard's rules, it's up to Blizzard to investigate. The only downside to this investigation, Blizzard does not tell us the outcome. I would be happy with just a little note from Blizzard saying he is a player and has done nothing against the rules.

On another note, he has once again changed his name. I've also checked his activity on theunderminejournal.com. This guy has is selling from every crafting profession: JC, Tailor, LW, BS, and inscription.

You are right. I dont know if he is a bot. Or maybe AH camper would be a better word to use.

If he is doing something against Blizzard's rules, it's up to Blizzard to investigate. The only downside to this investigation, Blizzard does not tell us the outcome. I would be happy with just a little note from Blizzard saying he is a player and has done nothing against the rules.

On another note, he has once again changed his name. I've also checked his activity on theunderminejournal.com. This guy has is selling from every crafting profession: JC, Tailor, LW, BS, and inscription.


I have a competitor that does the same thing. Every week or two he'll change bankers. The only reason I know it's him is I see the same players trading items to him, and he's the only guy that undercuts me by 2c.

I've observed him closely and I'm sure he isn't botting, he just plays a lot. I suspect (can't say for sure, of course) that the name changes in both of our competitors cases is in an attempt to keep a low profile. As you become well known people will try to mess with you.
TSM is right on the line. Sure it requires a button press for each cancel or each post, but that button press can be from the scroll wheel on a mouse that allows free spinning it and the 'button presses' are buffered so a couple of swipes of one's finger can post hundreds or even thousands of items. It pretty well removes all need to think or plan. I never see individual auction listings. I just make sure my bags are full and give the wheel a spin. Occasionally some poor noob will show up trying to make a few gold from a few items and quickly gets whipsawed by those using TSM. They have no chance if they are trying to sell any commodity items. The only way those individuals can sell is if they price their items so low that one of the regulars snaps them up to resell.
02/09/2013 11:33 PMPosted by Protstate
Anyone that played games like drugwars understands the appeal.


Oh man... had this game on my Palm V back in the day. So epic.
Oh and the bots name is XXXXX. Yeah, I named a player on the forums, but you know what? As this is a robot and not an actual player/human being, one would think that the rule would not apply in this case ;)


Ok. Wow.

First, all you had to do was say that he was on your server. We can do the rest, thanks to Undermine Journal. The assumption would be that he's one of the first two or three listed under Busy Sellers.

Second, ARE YOU FREAKING KIDDING ME?

This guy has *at most* three hour spans of posting. Three. Not thirty. Not three hundred. THREE.

When I was on Illidan - Horde, there were MANY "people" who posted auctions literally every hour for FIFTY hours STRAIGHT. No break. Never offline. Never banned.

Your "proof" makes people who deal with actual bots look worse. Whoever said an experienced seller can tell the difference is right. But buddy, an experienced seller ain't you.

Here, check my server:

http://theunderminejournal.com/?realm=H-Mug'thol

You'll notice one of the Busy Sellers is usually online posting for 18-20 hours a day. That is more indicative of a bot than posting three times a day or so.

Here, check my server:

http://theunderminejournal.com/?realm=H-Mug'thol

You'll notice one of the Busy Sellers is usually online posting for 18-20 hours a day. That is more indicative of a bot than posting three times a day or so.


I've had stretches of continous posting on my bankers, where I am always posting, every hour, for HUGE stretches of time... 30+ hours. But, I also have a sleeping disorder, work nights, like the AH too much, and use the phone app.

I've had plenty of people assume I was botting because of the sheer amount of time I spent online/auctioning... but it was all lil ol me...

But, 3 hours of auctioning is absolutely nothing.
I have to agree i 100% think there are people botting ah on my realm. There is defiantly more than one but we got 1 guy that actually has 2 accounts both of the toons are lvl 1 they sit in ah 24/7 non stop. I have never seen him spam trade, i cant talk to him like iv tried wisping him to say that he can raise the price because he has the only items in ah and he is <busy> and has never responded. I can spend 2 hours putting up gems/chants/mats and when im done i go back to see and he has undercut everything i put (and everyone else) by 1 copper. Im talking like 250+ auctions and he undercuts everything. I could see maybe if he undercuts the popular stuff but he undercuts everything almost like hes following me as i put up the auctions. and yes before all you rage i know people use alts to put up auctions i do as well, but there is no way a human is looking up every auction he has up and looking to see if he's undercut AND rebidding. Also there is some easy ways to make gold in ah that he actually doesn't use and yet he puts up gems that are selling for 4g25s (25s over vendar price) which would honestly be easier to vender. so many people put in so much effort to make gold and cannot compete with 1 guy.
03/04/2013 05:48 PMPosted by Wickdkills
I can spend 2 hours putting up gems/chants/mats and when im done i go back to see and he has undercut everything i put (and everyone else) by 1 copper. Im talking like 250+ auctions and he undercuts everything. I could see maybe if he undercuts the popular stuff but he undercuts everything almost like hes following me as i put up the auctions. and yes before all you rage i know people use alts to put up auctions i do as well, but there is no way a human is looking up every auction he has up and looking to see if he's undercut AND rebidding.


He uses TSM. You, apparently, do not.

Nothing you have said screams bot. It just says he uses a very good AH addon that you do not, which gives him a huge advantage. I can cancel/relist 250 auctions in about 8 minutes, and the only reason it takes me that long is waiting for the mailbox.

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