I'm really enjoying SEF.

Monk
I am a new monk, I have less than 24 hours /played @ 90, (but I'm almost iLvl 480 thanks to the new drop rates!)

Doing LFR was a lot of fun with SEF, even as a fresh 90 with joke gear I was in the top 5 DPS for a few fights, namely Will of the Emperor (I put a clone on each giant for the duration of the entire fight while I just attacked adds) and the trio in the Terrace.

I've also had success with insane AoE damage on 10+ targets using 2 clones. I ran a daily heroic, which turned out to be Stormstout brewery, and in the monkey room I hit 290k DPS just by AoEing with 2 clones up.

I also like the ability because it makes for a great way to pull mobs when grinding or questing. I used to use crackling jade lightning to pull, now I just roll around and throw a clone on an enemy and it makes it a lot faster.
you used to be top-ish dps, then blizzard nerfed us 15%, now you are middle of the pack at best
blizzard nerfed us 12% It's not 15 since RSK didn't increase auto damage. We're still not middle of the pack either.
I would disagree Sickbeard, after I did my reforging and before any raid i enter I go get my enlightenment, once you stack all that mastery I am in the top 3 dps of any raid I have been in since the patch and nerf, maybe L2play?
Invection, I have a question for you, how is the two piece set bonus on the new tier?
I would disagree Sickbeard, after I did my reforging and before any raid i enter I go get my enlightenment, once you stack all that mastery I am in the top 3 dps of any raid I have been in since the patch and nerf, maybe L2play?


this. I was really upset at first too, but after reforging and all that my dps started picking back up

it's still a little lower than before, but is perfectly fine. I blame it on my lack of gear
SEF is Cluuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuunky.

I absolutely love the concept and the spell effects. On paper, I adore SEF. Using it in practice, however, leaves something to be desired.

In a raid, trying to actually set up your clones is a nightmare. There's often way too much chaos (or even other windwalkers) for you to be able to use visual queues. Sometimes I don't even know if the spell fired when I'm trying to summon a clone. A good solution here would be a numeric indicator on the spell hotkey showing how many clones were active.

So the process goes like this. Target something, press the hotkey. Target something else, press the hotkey. Then target the third thing and start attacking it. Trying to do this from the middle of a melee pack is awful. God forbid you mistakenly end up attacking the same target as a clone and accidentially nerf your own dps.

Doing Will of the Emperor last night (a fight tailor made for SEF), I had no clue whether or not my clone died to AOE at some point. (I think they're immune to AOE, and would have to pull aggro?). If he was alive, he was buried in a pile of other melee, and impossible to see.

Let's assume you and your clones are successfully set up on 3 different targets. If one of those clone targets dies, your clone goes away as expected. But if your target dies first, then what happens? You can't easily dispel a clone, but if you switch to a target that already has a clone on it, you nerf your own DPS. AFAIK, there's no easy solution. Dispel all the clones and and set up again? Clunky.

So I love the concept of the skill. It just needs better UI elements and a better implementation. I hope someone at Blizzard sees this feedback. :)
03/08/2013 09:38 AMPosted by Aztonishing
It just needs better UI elements


It gives you a buff. If that isn't enough use one of the myriad of addons like weakauras, ntk, etc.
It gives you a buff. If that isn't enough use one of the myriad of addons like weakauras, ntk, etc.


While this is true, and admittedly something I didn't think of and will use once I get home, the buff doesn't tell you if you're attacking the same target as your clone.

Maybe if there were some debuff or something on the target, or some kind of UI thing that let you know when your attacking something a clone is already on, it would be much much better.
03/08/2013 09:48 AMPosted by Foiblesqt
It just needs better UI elements


It gives you a buff. If that isn't enough use one of the myriad of addons like weakauras, ntk, etc.


Does it? Excellent. Does the mouseover tell you how many clones are active? That'd be a good step. I'll surely see what I can set up with WeakAuras.

Ideally, I'd like to see an even more robust implementation that showed the target of each clone - something that I suspect a mod won't be able to do well. My biggest questions when using the power are "Are my clones alive, and which targets are they attacking?" If the UI could convey this information, I'd be totally satisfied.
03/08/2013 10:06 AMPosted by Aztonishing


It gives you a buff. If that isn't enough use one of the myriad of addons like weakauras, ntk, etc.


Does it? Excellent. Does the mouseover tell you how many clones are active? That'd be a good step. I'll surely see what I can set up with WeakAuras.

Ideally, I'd like to see an even more robust implementation that showed the target of each clone - something that I suspect a mod won't be able to do well. My biggest questions when using the power are "Are my clones alive, and which targets are they attacking?" If the UI could convey this information, I'd be totally satisfied.

There are 3 different buffs you can receive depending on the "elemental type" you randomly summoned. Essentially if you have two buffs you have two clones. You'll never have 3 buffs because your character takes on the characteristics of one as well.

For example: You summon a clone and its the red "Fire" clone (shows Fire clone buff), you get assigned the Storm type and your character model changes to the blue clone, you summon the second clone and its the Earth type (now you should be showing a Fire and Earth buff).
Thanks Nasmira,

Ultimately, I think that SEF could be vastly improved by just being a little smarter. When I cast the spell, my clones should seek out up to 2 nearby enemies that I have tapped, excluding my current target.

This fix cleans up a LOT of the clunkiness with the spell. I no longer have to micromanage deployment of the clones. They'd actually be viable during trash clears. I wouldn't have to worry as much about accidentally self-nerfing my damage, and if I have to switch targets, I can recast the spell to make sure the clones are set up correctly. If the spell would then need a 12 second cooldown or something to prevent it from being spammable in PVP, I'm okay with that. It makes the entire power cleaner, easier to use, and more intuitive.

Again, I love SEF in concept. I'm just lobbying for some Quality of Life changes to make it less tedious to use. The monk class has enough little things to keep track of already, right? :)
I've been using SEF for a little while and I don't think it does anything but make us look flashy and cool. The only time I found it somewhat useful, was when Garalon mended a leg all the way in africa and inside the pheromones and all that stuff. Even though I was attacking 2 targets at once, the dps isn't noticeably different. Even during trash pulls I feel its useless because you cant move the ScK. It's just a stationary beyblade. You'd be getting more if you didn't use it.

TL;DR: SEF looks cool, but doesn't really provide any utility during common situations. Very very situational.
Again, I love SEF in concept. I'm just lobbying for some Quality of Life changes to make it less tedious to use. The monk class has enough little things to keep track of already, right? :)

Yeah I agree with you here. It feels a little clunky to use and in a large group its hard to tell which mobs already have a clone on them. Most likely these things will be fixed with time. its such a new type of spell that I can understand it not being perfect on the first implementation.

TL;DR: SEF looks cool, but doesn't really provide any utility during common situations. Very very situational

I think that was pretty much the idea behind it. If it was an actual DPS increase we would do too much damage on fights with multiple targets and/or would feel gimped on fights without them.
2 piece is interesting as it lets you pool energy for later with the orbs if you run at lower haste values or get a bad chain with no combo breaker procs & FoF is on cd,

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