Warlocks dont use demons

Posts: 8
In my opinion the core gameplay of the warlock which is the use of demons is seriously weak. The cost of the demons or their abilities is too high. If you discard cards your giving the card advantage to your opponent, that is fine but why is it random. Let us choose the cards to discard at least. The random chance makes no sense and holds the class back to being used for nothing but murloc decks.The felguard will never be picked up by me cause losing a mana crystal early sets you back the whole game, and if you play it late than its mediocre. Pit Lord is awesome looking but its only slightly stronger than other 4 drops plus 5 damage is alot when to take into consideration how warlocks enjoy killing themselves. I think doomguard is the best demon by far, and that is only because it has charge so its a guaranteed 5 damage, and thats barely okay cause two random cards is so risky I would only play it with no cards in my hand.Oh and Void Terror is actually awful, like 1 big minion compared to two smaller ones is so dumb, if anything it makes it easier to kill. I am aware that power overwhelming plus void terror is okay, its another risky play which is all warlocks have right now.

Warlocks are my class in WoW and Id like to see them get some love. Jerraxxus is a sick card with an awesome concept but still risky. Id like to be able to make a good demon deck that isnt so outclassed that I need the planets to align for me to win.
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Posts: 19
I use tons of demons in my Masters 3 aggro deck, they are awesome (except Fel Guard, what were they thinking?!).

However, demons are all about getting a short term advantage (bigger, badder minions) with horrible consequences in the long term (life and card loss).

If you want to play shiny big-cost minions like Jaraxxus late in the game, most demons obviously don't fit. That doesn't make them bad though, just not suited for what you want to do.
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Posts: 8
You have a point, but choosing the card to discard would be a big improvement I think
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Posts: 233
The demons i feel arent very strong right now, except a few like the imps and voidwalker and jaraxxus.

We could use some cost changes to demon to allow more demon based aggro decks to be more viable (i hate cards like succubus and doomlord which makes you discard cards at random)

or We could just use more demon cards
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Posts: 4
  • Not enough demons available at base.
  • Lack of neutral demons, compared to the abundance of beasts.
  • Random discard too risky.
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    Posts: 1,131

    However, demons are all about getting a short term advantage (bigger, badder minions) with horrible consequences in the long term (life and card loss).


    I think the problem is at the point at which you bring these "Bigger, badder minions" out, when they cost 4-5, etc mana, your opponent already has various means of swiftly destroying these cards, leaving you at a severe disadvantage, because often you paid for this card, which just got wiped away, with several of your own cards or a lot of health.

    If there weren't so many means of destroying single cards even early on, yes, they would be strong, but since there are, they are pretty low on the power totem pole.
    Edited by Greywind on 11/5/2013 12:16 PM PST
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    Posts: 8
    Yes, the point of the matter I wanna make is that, for the sake of fun I would like to make a demon deck that uses mostly demons but that cant happen because of the lack of coverage offered by some of the more terrbile demons. The mana range of 4-5 are weak points, since the good demons come at a high price, they are thus more vulnerable to simple removal with the warlock left with nothing to show for it.

    Cards like sacrificial pact and sense demons seem useless to me simply because there are no demons worth getting out of my deck and if they are on the field I already payed the extra cost for them so why would I sacrifice them for 5 health?? It is actually bizarre, I realize every class has certain cards that for arguments sake will probably never see that much play, but were talking about a core gameplay mechanic for warlocks. Mages can freeze like nobody's business and priests can steal everyone cards and heal and mind control, but warlocks demons are rather lack luster compared to other minion archetypes.
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    Posts: 4,041
    Yeah, me and Takkyon have beat this issue to death. Between us we have posted several threads both here and in general forums so hopefully our plea will be heard.

    I dont think demons need a whole lot but just a little better balance on certain ones, like succy, fel, etc...
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    Posts: 243
    I feel like warlock synergy in general is just really bad.

    Life Tap
    Take Damage->Draw a Card

    Demons
    Take more Damage/destroy the card you just drew-> Get a "powerful" minion

    Hellfire
    Kill all your minions and take MORE damage->Do the same thing to the other person, except you now have an empty field and your turn is over.

    It seems like the only thing warlocks are really good at is killing themselves.
    Edited by BowStrings on 11/6/2013 11:51 AM PST
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    Posts: 4,041
    11/05/2013 06:45 AMPosted by Rinchman
    In my opinion the core gameplay of the warlock which is the use of demons is seriously weak. The cost of the demons or their abilities is too high. If you discard cards your giving the card advantage to your opponent, that is fine but why is it random. Let us choose the cards to discard at least. The random chance makes no sense and holds the class back to being used for nothing but murloc decks.The felguard will never be picked up by me cause losing a mana crystal early sets you back the whole game, and if you play it late than its mediocre. Pit Lord is awesome looking but its only slightly stronger than other 4 drops plus 5 damage is alot when to take into consideration how warlocks enjoy killing themselves. I think doomguard is the best demon by far, and that is only because it has charge so its a guaranteed 5 damage, and thats barely okay cause two random cards is so risky I would only play it with no cards in my hand.


    Well said, I agree 100%.

    I and a few other members of the Warlock community have been very vocal about these exact points and have been trying to raise awarness of this to Blizzard and the community at large.. In fact, there should be a few thread in the Warlock forums as well as the main forums about this exact topic.

    11/05/2013 06:45 AMPosted by Rinchman
    .Oh and Void Terror is actually awful, like 1 big minion compared to two smaller ones is so dumb, if anything it makes it easier to kill. I am aware that power overwhelming plus void terror is okay, its another risky play which is all warlocks have right now.


    I also staunchly agree with this statement as well. Some folks like Void Terror, and it's not completely terri-bad(like several other demon cards are) but I personally would never run it becasue Warlocks are already 2 for 1'ing themselves at every turn why would I want to play another car that is going to 3 or even 4 and 5 for 1 me?! lol

    Granted we have our hero power(which is amazing) but that takes time, mana and life and doesn't justify having so much discard(much less running Void Terror and risking such a huge tempo and card advantage loss)

    11/05/2013 06:45 AMPosted by Rinchman
    Warlocks are my class in WoW and Id like to see them get some love. Jerraxxus is a sick card with an awesome concept but still risky. Id like to be able to make a good demon deck that isnt so outclassed that I need the planets to align for me to win.


    I also agree with this. Warlocks have always been my favorite class and (except for when we ran wild in Season 1 with SL/SL builds) it seems like they never get no love. Of course I haven't played Wow since the Blizzard decided to take away the Drain Tanking style of play(they coulda just toned it down) but I don't want the lack of attention and consideration that my favorite class seems to always get to carry over into Hearthstone as well.

    I have a tried and true Tier 1 Warlock deck but it runs VERY few Warlock cards(especially demons) and I find it unacceptable that Blizzard seems to be balancing our awesome Hero Power by giving us undesirable and borderline useless class cards.

    TL;DR-I agree and also think that the Warlock class should be revisited and further balanced to promote not only a well-rounded class but one whose cards actually hold synergy(like all the other classes).

    Thanks for bringing this important topic up again! Warlocks have to look out for our own!
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    Posts: 4,041
    11/05/2013 07:50 AMPosted by Rinchman
    You have a point, but choosing the card to discard would be a big improvement I think


    Yes please. It would have to be tested to ensure it is properly balanced but I think this would be a good place to start.

    I don't want Warlocks to be OP, I'm just looking to have them a little bit better balanced and synergize a little better.
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    Posts: 4,041
    11/05/2013 08:30 AMPosted by Petatoullie
    The demons i feel arent very strong right now, except a few like the imps and voidwalker and jaraxxus.


    This^^^

    Not enough demons available at base.
    Lack of neutral demons, compared to the abundance of beasts.
    Random discard too risky.


    And this^^^!

    *Triple post FTW!
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    Posts: 34
    Personally I run a deck with 2X Succubus and I win about 7-8 in 10 games. Succubus is very underrated, turn 2 succubus or turn 1 coin succubus gives you tremendous board advantage, except maybe vs a mage who can just frost bolt you.

    The discard is not really a problem, you have thirty cards for a reason, if losing one of them and the entire deck cease to function something must be wrong.
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    Posts: 4,041
    Personally I run a deck with 2X Succubus and I win about 7-8 in 10 games. Succubus is very underrated, turn 2 succubus or turn 1 coin succubus gives you tremendous board advantage, except maybe vs a mage who can just frost bolt you.

    The discard is not really a problem, you have thirty cards for a reason, if losing one of them and the entire deck cease to function something must be wrong.


    Its not that loosing a Succybus(sic) cause the entire deck to "cease to function" it is just the simple fact that she is SO easy to 2 for 1 your opponent. And while it is easy to Lifetap to make up for the negative card advantage she provides you, you also have to consider that you are probably not gonna be life tapping until at least turn 4 maybe 5(because aggro decks that would run Succy are generally going to be more concerned with dropping threats in the early turns and attempting to maintain board advantage, hence they wont have the mana to Lifetap til later turns) and by this point you are going to be put further behind on board advantage.

    There is also the simple fact that she dies to nearly all the other common 2 drops(Ooze, Dragon, etc...)

    I'm not calling the card "garbage" but I am saying that it could use some work and at least for myself(and most other serious Lock players) running her is undesirable at best, and can be outright detrimental to the success of your deck. She just hurts the early game too much and is less valuable in the late game.

    Edit: I will say though, that she can be great versus Priest atm.
    Edited by Intoshadows on 11/10/2013 8:53 AM PST
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    Posts: 3
    When you say hellfire 'kills all your minions' you should probably consider that in an agro deck, your minions will probably be doing the killing for you. In a control deck, you'd depend more on spells for minion killing.

    Helfire is more of a board control spell. I often use my last one or two minions to drop a powerful minion's health down before clearing it all with hellfire, and then quickly dropping a minion or two to retake control of the field.

    I feel the warlock deck, in hand with the riskiness of its cards, is also about good timing. You've gotta be really precise with all of your plays.
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    Posts: 50
    If you think the Void terror is a bad card then you're not using it right.
    In combination with power overwhelming it can be phenomenal. You can stick down one or even two power overwhelmings onto one minion, attack with said minion, then eat the minion with the void terror. Using this on even a 1/1 minion gives you 9 damage to dish out and then a 12/12 minion on the board for either your opponent spend his turn dealing with or suffer the incoming consequences. Unless you're playing against a priest it's fab
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    Posts: 1,131
    No one who plays this game for more than 2 days will let you keep that stacked void terror.
    Remember, you can only use it -next- round, which means your opponent can use this round to wipe it out and away.
    And with the abundance of single target and aoe removal, that is as easy as pie.
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    Posts: 653
    No one who plays this game for more than 2 days will let you keep that stacked void terror.
    Remember, you can only use it -next- round, which means your opponent can use this round to wipe it out and away.
    And with the abundance of single target and aoe removal, that is as easy as pie.

    That's true (if they have removal left), but when you consider that Void Terror is a 3 Mana creature it's not too shabby of a trade.

    If you Power Overwhelming a minion and attack with it then that's a minion that's gonna die next turn anyway.
    For 3 extra mana your opponent then needs to spend mana and a card to remove it or get hit really hard.

    It's usually not that amazing when used without Power Overwhelming, though.
    Generally I feel it's best to consume things that are gonna get destroyed next turn or have been rendered useless due to Silence or some such.
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    Posts: 676
    If you feed Void Terror with 2 minions and power overwhelming, you're wasting 4 Cards for a 3/3 Monster that will just got silenced, OP
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    Posts: 648
    Hi, sorry for my written english, it's really bad.

    I make the same post in the spanish forums.

    My proposal is the next:

    Change some existing minions:

    -Soulfire, Sucubus and Doomguard: I change the effect to: Select a card on your hand and discard it.

    -Felguard: Overload (1)

    -Hellfire: Deal 3 damage to all enemy characters (Paladin have a Consecration, Mage have Blizzard, Priest have a Holy Nova). Why the warlock need to destroy all her pets to deal 3 damage to enemy characters?.

    -Pit Lord:Epic creature, 4 managem, 5 damage to my hero, for a creature 5/6? Yea is a epic... Epicfail... It Need a Deathrattle: Deals 5 damage to you oponent hero...
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQ6OWGmtgBc

    -----------------------0--------------------

    Create new Demon minions:

    Warlock Class:

    -Kilrogg Eye: Stealth, Spellpower 1.

    -Felhunter: Charge, Spellpower 1.

    -Doomguard: Spellpower 2.

    -Soulwell: 0/5, This creature cant attack, At the start of your turn restore 2 Health points to a damaged hero.

    Neutrals:

    -Felboar: Beast/Demon 4/2 Charge, Battlecry: 2 Damage to your hero.

    -Wrathguard: Demon: 4/5, Windfury, Battlecry: Select a card on your hand and discard it.

    -Eredar Warlock: 4/8, Spellpower 1, Battlecry: Discard two cards from the top of your Deck., Battlecry: Give adjacent minions Spell Damage +1.

    -------------0-------------

    The idea is create a solid warlock Demon minions and give a chance to create a competitive deck stacking spellpower and make it viable.

    Warlock needs a spell AoE Without this kill most creatures in the table: Sucubbus 4/3, Voidwalker 1/3, Flame Imp 3/2, Blood Imp 1/1, and all the spell damage creatures die with Hellfire: Blodmage 1/1, Kobold Gromancer 2/2, Dalaran mage 1/4(Hellfire damage3 +1 Spelldamage), Ancient mage 1/5 (Hellfire 3 +2 spell damage), Ogre Magi 4/4 and Azure Drake 4/4...
    Edited by Dannwolf on 12/11/2013 10:16 PM PST
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