Pyroblast NO !!! for 8 mana !!!

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Posts: 11,716
01/02/2014 01:41 PMPosted by Zed
It would also be fair to point out that a priest doesn't have a follow up or a ramping up of direct damage to the opponent's face prior and after casting both mind blasts. It's the culmination of all the other direct damage spells mage has at it's disposal that seems to be what enrages the masses. It may not be by itself imbalanced, but it is perceived as the straw that breaks the camels back after everything else the mage can do.

I'm not really one of those people that thinks it needs nerfing, I don't have problems with mages because I love druid which has access to healing. But, I can see to some degree why it would enrage others.

Agree on all points, which is why I don't run Mind Blast in my Priest deck. Like I said though, people keep asserting that "Everytime I play a mage I have to be ready to take 10 damage to the face out of nowhere!" as if basically every class doesn't have access to the ability to do that well. Pyroblast is unique in the sense that it does it for a single (albeit expensive) card, but the fact that you could lose 10 health out of nowhere is closer to the norm than the exception amongst the classes.
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Posts: 3,043
Originally from Sar, who I can't quote for some reason:
Wow... you're really bad at this. You even listed a bunch of spells that are actually right on curve... are you blind or something? First of all, we're talking about direct damage spells, so I'm not sure why you're referencing cards like Blade Flurry, Avenging Wrath, etc. Beyond that, hero damage spells are on a different curve (look at Sinister Strike and Mind Blast). Lastly, recognize that cantrip spells take a 2 mana cost penalty for the draw, following the curve of damage = cost -1 (Shiv, Hammer of Wrath, Starfire).
In every example category you list, there are exemptions to the rule. Given the incredibly low number of cards that justify the rule, the exemptions are almost as common.

As for the ones you listed that actually are direct damage spells:
1) Starfall. Several "choose one" spells take a penalty in exchange for the choice (otherwise they'd be flat out better than their alternatives). Starfall takes a +1 cost penalty to its direct damage for the choice, and it loses the secondary effect that 5-damage aoe's like Holy Nova have (i.e. the healing).

2) Wrath is a falls right on the curve; they didn't put a penalty in for the choose 1 on it.
Several do. Several don't. Why is starfire penelised and not wrath? For something to be a rule, it has to have some consistency over the course of a number of examples. When the exceptions outnumber the rule, or even come close to as such, it isn't a rule.

3) Lava Burst, like many overload mechanics, takes a net mana cost penalty in exchange for the benefits of Overload. You can see this same penalty when you look at cards like Forked Lightning vs. Cleave or Stormforged Axe vs. Fiery Waraxe. Either way, as per the curve, it should be a cost of 4, but the overload penalty puts it at 5.

4) Lightning Bolt is actually on curve, not sure why you'd try to list that as a counter-example...
Repeat above. You can't say that Lightning bolt is on the curve despite overload, then say that lava burst takes a hit for being overload. Which is the rule, and which is the follower?

5) Moonfire is also exactly on curve, which is why I don't understand why you'd want to list that as a counter-example.
I wasnt listing counter examples - I was listing damage spells. You accuse me of not being able to read, yet apparently did not read my conclusion in which I specifically listed moonfire as one of the only two examples that follows the damage=mana+1 curve without any caveat (such as an inconsistent costing on overload, or an aoe element, or a choice element). I said that _SPECIFICALLY_.

Beyond that, every single other option you listed isn't a direct damage spell; it's either an aoe or some other weird thing, so I don't know why you'd be so incompetent as to even attempt to list them. It's like trying to say how awesome Knife Juggler is when comparing 5-drops, they're completely unrelated.

As for a list, incase you're wondering, of the curve, look at Smite, Shadowbolt, Moonfire, Wrath, Eviscerate, Arcane Shot, pre-buff Fireball/Pyroblast, Lightning Bolt, and Mortal Strike.

P.S. When trying to make a compelling argument, the ability to read can be very helpful.

Shall I re-post my conclusion paragraph which you left off your post?

I mean, I could go on. There is no "standard" damage formula for direct damage. The vast, vast, VAST majority of direct damage spells are not simply "do x damage for y mana". In fact, fireball, pyroblast, holy smite and moonfire are the only examples I can think of that don't have some sort of qualifier, aoe component, card draw, or other reason for an altered cost. That leaves 2 spells (both mage) following the damage=mana+2 formula, and 2 following the damage=mana+1 formula.

Of the differences between the spells I _SPECIFICALLY_ mentioned in the conclusion that you failed to quote (and I can only assume failed to read), you listed shadowbolt (minion only), eviscerate (doesn't follow curve in either combo or non-combo usage), arcane shot (I missed it, straight up), lightning bolt (is an overload spell that doesn't follow any particular pattern) and mortal strike (is either a 4:4 or 4:6).

So, to reiterate your very astute quote:
P.S. When trying to make a compelling argument, the ability to read can be very helpful.
Edited by Pathologic on 1/2/2014 11:17 PM PST
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Posts: 19
I`m glad that Blizzard agree with my arguments :) THX

Pyroblast for 10 mana at last in new patch !!!!
Edited by szefol86 on 1/14/2014 12:58 AM PST
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Posts: 7
that argument that pyro is the same like mindcontrol is ridculous.
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Posts: 210
01/01/2014 02:12 PMPosted by szefol86
And of course FLAMESTRIKE .... 8 mana i think. :)

So Flamestrike 7 mana for 4 dmg versus Equality - Wild Pyromancer for 4 mana and total board clear. Yeah seems pretty fair isnt it?? LOLOLOL im a noob cant past rank 25 pl0x nerf flamestrike t00 OP cant ween vs NPC
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Posts: 48
01/14/2014 12:57 AMPosted by szefol86
I`m glad that Blizzard agree with my arguments :) THX

Pyroblast for 10 mana at last in new patch !!!!

yea! and after this we should make mage hero ability cost 3 right, cause mages still beat you after this nerf. (just like they still beat you after freeze nerf, you and the other bads called for) if you cant beat a mage, changing pyro is gonna save u one loss outa ten games. gratz u still suck. i rly wish blizzard would stop trying to appease the forums....the forums community is the smallest of all games but its always the loudest.

im totaly fine with these nerfs as long as they come with a presence of mind buff added to the card. "when you cast pyroblast, your 2nd pyroblast is free for this turn only"

that buff makes about as much sense to me as the 10 mana nerf
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