The Problem With Priests

Posts: 37
Hello priests, I know you guys love your class, I have played it myself and is fun to play...

But playing against a priest? Not fun, like ever.

Most Priest decks are built EXACTLY the same and are really predictable. Though you can't really do anything about it unless you made you made sure your deck is anti priest. These are a few, A FEW examples of the problems with priests.

I'm sorry to say but you guys are to good. Northshire Cleric HAS to be one of the best cards in the game with a cost of one mana and draw whenever A minion is healed? They are cheap, impossible to remove on turn one, and is pretty much mandatory on every priest deck since priests have accessibility to eight healing cards in total. Three in which are aoes, one which damages the enemy for 2 damage as well. It ALSO blocks the enemy player from healing because if they healed the priest gets free card draw. Sorry paladins, druids, and shamans.

The Priest has very easy removal without any drawbacks whatsoever. Silence is 0 cost, Shadow Word: Pain and Holy Smite for 2, and Shadow Word: Death for 3. cards like sap or corruption are cheap but actually have a drawback, with sap the card can be removed from play, but may be played again the next turn. Corruption takes a full turn to take affect, allowing the player to use that card for one last turn. Corruption can also be silenced from a minion to remove the debuff. Holy Smite is a bit to cheap as well but would be OK if the other removal was nerfed.

MASS DISPEL TRADES WAY TO WELL. every buff, every creature's ability is rendered useless, really removes the fun from the game ya know? while the priest is free to do whatever.

WHY BLIZ<(O_O<

Both Shadow words also force most players to put a 4 damage minion into their deck, removing a certain level of choice to player's decks.

Buffs are waaay toooo goood...

Have you not seen the Divine Spirit, Inner Fire combo? Any card used with this can be buffed to ludicrous numbers for only 3 mana. A shield Bearer can become a 8/8 on turn 3, turn 2 with coin. Power word: shield gives 2 health for one mana, AND CARD DRAW. They have so much card draw already why would you put card draw and +2 health on the same card? They already have allot of card draw no need to add anymore.

It's very easy for a priest to make ridiculous cards very early in the game, and then having many bigger cards later on with no drawbacks, and even if they don't do some crazy stuff like that they can always buff the bigger minions.

MIND CONTROL SUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCKSSSSSSSS....

ANY MIND CONTROL IS TO GOOD, it removes the opponents minion, and uses it against them. It is brutal, painful, unstoppable, and just a terrible thing to do to anyone. There is no counter.

Please leave your comments bellow, please note that these are just a few of the things that I feel suck about fighting against a priest.

Also note, that Priests are the only class people will concede before the end of the mulligan, because of the fact they are a priest. I don't mean to be whining but I am just trying to give feedback.
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Posts: 32
03/19/2014 11:40 PMPosted by Alex
The Priest has very easy removal without any drawbacks whatsoever. Silence is 0 cost, Shadow Word: Pain and Holy Smite for 2, and Shadow Word: Death for 3. cards like sap or corruption are cheap but actually have a drawback, with sap the card can be removed from play, but may be played again the next turn. Corruption takes a full turn to take affect, allowing the player to use that card for one last turn. Corruption can also be silenced from a minion to remove the debuff. Holy Smite is a bit to cheap as well but would be OK if the other removal was nerfed.


2x shadow word pain, 2x shadow word death, and than we still dont have any solution to cards like yeti, malygoss, ysera and other 4 attack minions. every class just takes their basic hard removal cards like execute, polymorph, hex, deadly shot, assassinate etc. but we have to take 4 and then some. you have no idea how much of a disadvantage that is in a 30 card deck.

holy smite is the same as hunter arcane shot and somewhat the same as rogue backstab. but are these to strong?

corruption should not be used as removal unless you use it on a non silenced ragnaros or that 2 mana 4/5 that cant attack anyway. you should use this to make your minion stronger so it can take down that stronger minion or to shadowflame. or combo it with void terror or something.
Edited by McStab on 3/20/2014 5:34 AM PDT
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Posts: 540
1. nortshire cleric is far from op
2. who the hell runs mass dispel?
3. high ranked priests don't even run sw:p
4. go past rank 15 and you'll never see a priest running inner fire and divine spirit
Edited by Helghast on 3/20/2014 6:39 AM PDT
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Posts: 4,420
03/19/2014 11:40 PMPosted by Alex
I'm sorry to say but you guys are to good. Northshire Cleric HAS to be one of the best cards in the game with a cost of one mana and draw whenever A minion is healed? They are cheap, impossible to remove on turn one, and is pretty much mandatory on every priest deck since priests have accessibility to eight healing cards in total. Three in which are aoes, one which damages the enemy for 2 damage as well. It ALSO blocks the enemy player from healing because if they healed the priest gets free card draw. Sorry paladins, druids, and shamans.


Granted, the latest agregate numbers I have seen are from January, but they are still relevant since the game saw little change since the last priest nerfs:

Paladins: They have two heals that can target a damaged minion, one for 6 and one for 8. If they have a Norshire Cleric you can't get to and you have a minion that could benefit from 6 or 8 HP beign restored then you are probably not winning

Shamans:With the +1 spell attack totem out they have 6 removal spells that can kill it, not even including minion buffs, weapons or buffed totems. They are the only ones with a minion specific heal, the healing totem. Priests also have the worst win rate of any class vs anouther class against shaman at 39% wins so im not going to shed any tears about one very specific and unlikely scenerio

Druids: only one heal that can target minions, Nourish and it heals for 8 HP. They have 6 removal cards that can take care of it not including buff cards like bite, claw, savage roar and savagery
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Posts: 10
If the power rankings are to be believed, Priest is the worst (or second worst) class in the game.
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Posts: 29
03/19/2014 11:40 PMPosted by Alex
Both Shadow words also force most players to put a 4 damage minion into their deck, removing a certain level of choice to player's decks.


Sadly it doesn't really affect the deck building because there're way too many strong minions with 4 attack.

Argent Commander
Yeti
Azure Drake
Twilight Drake
Gadgetzan Auctioneer
Injured Blademaster
Druid of the Claw
2/3 Animal Companion
Cabal Shadow Priest
Ysera

I'd gladly give away both Power Words if I got Hex or them
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Posts: 161
03/20/2014 07:48 AMPosted by Fzoid
Both Shadow words also force most players to put a 4 damage minion into their deck, removing a certain level of choice to player's decks.


Sadly it doesn't really affect the deck building because there're way too many strong minions with 4 attack.

Argent Commander
Yeti
Azure Drake
Twilight Drake
Gadgetzan Auctioneer
Injured Blademaster
Druid of the Claw
2/3 Animal Companion
Cabal Shadow Priest
Ysera

I'd gladly give away both Power Words if I got Hex or them


you forgot Cairn, the best legendary in game atm. I have yet to run into a deck that doesn't use it today =/
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Posts: 36
03/19/2014 11:40 PMPosted by Alex
Northshire Cleric HAS to be one of the best cards in the game with a cost of one mana and draw whenever A minion is healed? They are cheap, impossible to remove on turn one, and is pretty much mandatory on every priest deck since priests have accessibility to eight healing cards in total. Three in which are aoes, one which damages the enemy for 2 damage as well. It ALSO blocks the enemy player from healing because if they healed the priest gets free card draw. Sorry paladins, druids, and shamans.


Your post is very typical for a very new and unexperienced player. They are almost all exactly like yours.

So do you think the Northshire Cleric is OP?

Well, first of all, if you see a Priest playing it on turn 1 don't play a minion with 2 or less attack against it, as simple as that. Play a 3-attack minion with 2 mana, or a 3 damage attack spell. I'm sure you'll find plenty.

Secondly, investing two mana or another card to get card draw instead of placing another minion on board makes you lose tempo at the cost of card advantage. Not always very good. My experience is also that the NSC usually draws 0-1 cards at most, then it gets relentlessly derstoyed. Unless a new player makes the mistake of letting it live, in which case it can draw many, many more cards.

If anything, the NSC is a very unreliable way to draw cards, especially for a class that doesn't have a dedicated card draw mechanic like most other classes (Nourish for Duids, Sprint for Rogues, Mana Tide Totems for Shamans, etc). So, not only it's not OP, it's Under-Powered, if anything.

03/19/2014 11:40 PMPosted by Alex
The Priest has very easy removal without any drawbacks whatsoever. Silence is 0 cost, Shadow Word: Pain and Holy Smite for 2, and Shadow Word: Death for 3. cards like sap or corruption are cheap but actually have a drawback, with sap the card can be removed from play, but may be played again the next turn. Corruption takes a full turn to take affect, allowing the player to use that card for one last turn. Corruption can also be silenced from a minion to remove the debuff. Holy Smite is a bit to cheap as well but would be OK if the other removal was nerfed.


Here it seems you are using selective memory to block out things like:

Soul Siphon (warlock), Execute (warrior), Assassinate (rogue), Deadly Shot (Hunter), Naturalize (druid), Polymorph (mage), Hex (Shaman), just to mention a few on the top of my head. Some have limitations, but Priest's Shadow Words have limitations too.

Also, Holy Smite OP? Seriously? What about the Hunter's Arcane Shot (2 damage for 1 mana), Arcane Missiles (3 damage for one mana), wrath (3 damage or 1 damage +1 card), etc, etc, etc?

Again, your selective memory didn't make you consider any of those cards, it seems.

03/19/2014 11:40 PMPosted by Alex
MASS DISPEL TRADES WAY TO WELL. every buff, every creature's ability is rendered useless, really removes the fun from the game ya know? while the priest is free to do whatever.


It doesn't trade at all, since it doesn't remove any minion. Plus it's useless agains Silent Watchers (makes them more powerful), Yetis Ogres, etc, etc, etc.

03/19/2014 11:40 PMPosted by Alex
Both Shadow words also force most players to put a 4 damage minion into their deck, removing a certain level of choice to player's decks.


A priest can have only 2 of each and, to be honest, the best minions out there have 4 attack, and 4-attack minions are also the most prevalent and useful (Yetis, Cairne, Azure Drakes, Gadgetzan Auctioneer, Twilight Drakes, etc, etc, etc).

Also, against aggro, removing 2 minions with 3 attack or less is way to little since most minions will run that way. And against aggro the SW:D are mostly useless.

03/19/2014 11:40 PMPosted by Alex
Have you not seen the Divine Spirit, Inner Fire combo? Any card used with this can be buffed to ludicrous numbers for only 3 mana. A shield Bearer can become a 8/8 on turn 3, turn 2 with coin. Power word: shield gives 2 health for one mana, AND CARD DRAW. They have so much card draw already why would you put card draw and +2 health on the same card? They already have allot of card draw no need to add anymore.

It's very easy for a priest to make ridiculous cards very early in the game, and then having many bigger cards later on with no drawbacks, and even if they don't do some crazy stuff like that they can always buff the bigger minions.


Make a deck like this, play at least 20 games with it in ranks above 15, and let me know how many times you win. I will give you a hint, not many.

MIND CONTROL SUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCKSSSSSSSS....

ANY MIND CONTROL IS TO GOOD, it removes the opponents minion, and uses it against them. It is brutal, painful, unstoppable, and just a terrible thing to do to anyone. There is no counter. .


It takes 10 mana to use and, if you don't have board control, taking control of a good minion is useless. What, you think an 8/8 Giant is good against 5 minions that are 3/2? The 5 minions will just go for the face for 15 damage each turn, while the giant will try to kill them in 5 turns....guess what will happen....the guy with the giant loses.

So, do you want a counter? Simple. If it's turn 10, don't play anything powerful unless you have in your hand a good counter against it. So you wanna play Ragnaros but you are afraid that it will get MC? Wait for your Faceless Manipulator, class removal, or Big Game Hunter to be in your hand, then play it. Plus, most priests nowadays only run 1 MC in their decks.

Also note, that Priests are the only class people will concede before the end of the mulligan, because of the fact they are a priest. I don't mean to be whining but I am just trying to give feedback.


Yes, you are whining. So let me give you some advice. Try to learn what Priest cards do, and think about ways to counter them. If you concede every time you see a priest, you will never learn anything. And no, people don't auto concede against priests, just some "unexperienced and unpatient players" do.

Also, consider that in constructed play Priest is the second worst class! So do you think it's really OP as you think? No, it just has some mechanics that are annoying but that most players have found how to work around by not "auto-conceding" all the time.
Edited by VanTrellen on 3/20/2014 8:52 AM PDT
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Posts: 17
I main priest and I love the class, and also going against cause its free win. Every other deck I play completely stomps priest. Hunter, Druid, Warrior, and Paladin.
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Posts: 856
03/19/2014 11:40 PMPosted by Alex
Most Priest decks are built EXACTLY the same and are really predictable.
It's funny when you don't have a clue what type of priest deck he's talking about. Judging from attitude it's probably about those inner fire priests? Never occurred to you there is a world outside of your immediate surrounding, has it?
Edited by Yagami on 3/20/2014 9:43 PM PDT
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Posts: 981
The only cards you mentioned that top end priests actually use are SW:D and maybe MC(only 1 at most)
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Posts: 104
I will confess (appropriate, given the class) that I am not yet skilled enough to beat Priests, even with a deck that other have used against them to much success.

I will further confess that I HATE playing against them - because of self frustration in not yet knowing how to counter them. (I'm old... probably too old to be playing this kind of game, but at least it's not as speed demanding as Starcraft ;) )

All that said? When a Priest deck works - and there are many ways for that to happen, it's dang annoying. Priests have a lot of tricks. But is it overpowered?

Nope.

Honestly, if I had to pick an 'OP' class... some of the tricks that Rogues can play feel WAY more overpowered than anything a Priest can do. But again, that's probably more due to my own lack of skill than any actual 'OP'-ness on the part of the class. They still get my pick though. ;)

I'd love to see the decks that are run above class 15, but I have yet to get and STAY there for any length of time. The nice thing is... There's always NEXT month! :D
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Posts: 10
With all of this said, I tend to run Inner Fire myself because I like the do-or-die chances I tend to have. I have won games against people without having even drawn Inner Fire or Divine Spirit, it's only slightly easier when I do have those because I have had it countered by either several taunts, an instant kill, a CC/Silence, even a Mind Control from another priest!

But I do have one thing to say as to why Inner Fire/Divine Spirit can be extremely over powered if you don't have one of those methods available. It's when that combo is used on a stealth card and the opponent either doesn't have the AoE to kill it, or they don't control the rest of the priest's minions that can break through your taunts.

Power Word Shield + Temple Enforcer on a Stranglethorn Tiger (5/5 now 5/10), then 2x Divine Spirit for a 5/40 with Inner Fire on top for a 40/40 that is -still- in stealth. The druid I was facing was trying every single turn since I put the tiger out to kill it, but it was in stealth. Then my Lord of the Arena killed his Goldshire Footman and I won. If he had one more taunt out I would've had to wait or reveal that card to kill one of them, but his Stormwind Champion would've killed my taunt, leaving me vulnerable to him tossing a taunt down and keeping my uber minion busy. And there are more ways I could've made it even stronger, but honestly it wouldn't matter unless he was at full health with a lot of armor built up.

It's only been players that have saved cards that can counter such a creature or AoE'd the stealth minion that I've had problems with, aside from just well built decks and bad draws.

I hope this helps people understand this tactic a bit better and what to watch out for/how to counter it. I'd also like to add that if a minion in stealth gets hit by an AoE spell, it should probably break it, otherwise they can be buffed and healed with impunity until they're ready to strike.
Edited by Deagroth on 3/20/2014 10:52 PM PDT
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Posts: 37
Thank you for all the feedback, and I am sorry if I angered any of you. The reason I made this thread was so I could put a few of the complains I could find from around the web had about priests and how they needed nerfs. Now whenever someone says crap like what I said I will link them to this ^_^. I think the actual problem that people are having is that when you loose to a priest it feels brutal but that's only a side effect of the playstyle. In truth I loose to priest just as much as I do to any class though based upon the severity of the loss it can feel pretty bad.

I again say that I am sorry for any stressed caused.
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Posts: 694
Dude, priests are probably the worst class in the game, and they have been since even before the Mind Control nerf 4 months ago. Once you get beyond the tier of players who only own basic cards priests are not that good at all. In the mid to high ranks of play where people actually know what they are doing Priests are rarely seen.

Sorry if you are a complete noob and lose to priests. It doesnt make priest too good, it just makes you very bad. If anything priest needs buffs and hopefully they will get it when the first expansion set launches.
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Posts: 1,051
03/20/2014 07:48 AMPosted by Fzoid
Both Shadow words also force most players to put a 4 damage minion into their deck, removing a certain level of choice to player's decks.


Sadly it doesn't really affect the deck building because there're way too many strong minions with 4 attack.

Argent Commander
Yeti
Azure Drake
Twilight Drake
Gadgetzan Auctioneer
Injured Blademaster
Druid of the Claw
2/3 Animal Companion
Cabal Shadow Priest
Ysera

I'd gladly give away both Power Words if I got Hex or them


I was gonna say, if someone chooses not to run some of the awesome 4 atk minions in the game, then they probably should have the ability to choose taken from them, barring some really good reason for it.
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