UTH is gamebreaking

Posts: 6,561
04/08/2014 05:11 AMPosted by Garn
if HS is a game that's fun only if you're really good at it, it'll die.


That describes most MMO's, StarCraft 2, chess, (for the most part) the Dark Souls series, among a lot of other contenders.
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Posts: 94
04/08/2014 05:06 AMPosted by Kero
UTH is fine, 1-1 charge hound per minion on the board is OP? Lol.


Its the combo is can do off other cards that make it silly. All they have to do is drop a minion buff card and drop 1 UTH and you will most likely see 20+ hp gone on turn 4. Happens a lot more then you might think.

The issue is the card costs 1 mana and the costs makes it the broken card it is today. If it costs say 3 mana it would limit the amount of rush a hunter can do say on turn 3-5. Seeing 6 hounds on your board and 2 wolfs that buff beats on turn 4....good luck with that. Thats 18 damage for 4 mana :P

Sadly blizzard is known for not knowing or really wanting to take the time to balance their games anymore. Its why hearthstone will never be a legit competitive game. Its too RNG based and the balance is way off right now.
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Posts: 5,608
04/08/2014 05:24 AMPosted by Bazeleel
All they have to do is drop a minion buff card and drop 1 UTH and you will most likely see 20+ hp gone on turn 4.
If they charge every single hound into your face, what you described is 12 damage, so not exactly 20+. A single taunt lowers that a fair amount too.

04/08/2014 05:24 AMPosted by Bazeleel
The issue is the card costs 1 mana
It costs 2 mana

04/08/2014 05:24 AMPosted by Bazeleel
Seeing 6 hounds on your board and 2 wolfs
is impossible, you can only have 7 minions on the board

04/08/2014 05:24 AMPosted by Bazeleel
on turn 4
That means you yourself had 5+ minions on the board; why aren't you killing the Hunter next turn?

04/08/2014 05:24 AMPosted by Bazeleel
Thats 18 damage for 4 mana
It's 15 damage, and three cards, none of which are replaced
Edited by masters66 on 4/8/2014 5:34 AM PDT
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Posts: 1,273
04/08/2014 05:12 AMPosted by Meldwyn
Never place more than 2 minions in play at a time. Once one dies, replace it. Hunters usually get very impatient with this strategy and waste their hounds on cheap minions earlier than they should. Run a control deck and you will eat hunters for breakfast! :)


I never play more than 1 minion against Hunters and the Unleash Combo with Leeroy and Timberwolves still gets me from time to time since it does almost 20 damage with Timberwolves.
Edited by Serp on 4/8/2014 5:49 AM PDT
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Posts: 1,118
04/08/2014 05:12 AMPosted by Meldwyn
Never place more than 2 minions in play at a time. Once one dies, replace it. Hunters usually get very impatient with this strategy and waste their hounds on cheap minions earlier than they should. Run a control deck and you will eat hunters for breakfast! :)


I never play more than 1! minion against Hunters and the Unleash Combo with Leeroy and Timberwolves still gets me from time to time since it does almost 20 damage .

I am also a person who think UTH is a bit too strong but playing nothing but one is a bad choice.
you should have 2-3 minions (strong taunts like druid of claw is the best!) on the board with good amount of health on your hero.

and thats why I gave up shaman :'(
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Posts: 1,273
<span class="truncated">...</span>

I never play more than 1! minion against Hunters and the Unleash Combo with Leeroy and Timberwolves still gets me from time to time since it does almost 20 damage .

I am also a person who think UTH is a bit too strong but playing nothing but one is a bad choice.
you should have 2-3 minions (strong taunts like druid of claw is the best!) on the board with good amount of health on your hero.

and thats why I gave up shaman :'(


Control Warrior doesn't need more than one . I usually chip away at him with my 1 minion and armor up. I still mostly win but from time to time a big supercombo kills me . Alot of times the turns are he heropowers and passes while i attack with my 1 minion and armor up. When traps are up i only attack when i can eliminate his bow afterwards or i don't care.
Edited by Serp on 4/8/2014 5:53 AM PDT
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Posts: 147
04/08/2014 05:06 AMPosted by Kero
UTH is fine, 1-1 charge hound per minion on the board is OP? Lol.


It's more about synergy with other cards like buzzard, hyena and wolf. Plus Shamans and paladins get screwed over for using token.
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Posts: 57
actually UTH card itself is not OP it is how you play against it. thats why people join the hunter bandwagon because it is annoying to play against. but I insist not to use those boring classes.
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Posts: 1,610
04/08/2014 05:06 AMPosted by Kero
UTH is fine, 1-1 charge hound per minion on the board is OP? Lol.


It's not the card in and of itself, it's the synergy with the rest of the hunter deck.
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Posts: 132
The problem with the Buzzard/UTH combo isn't the cards...It is that you want to be able to play your deck the same way vs every class/deck, without making any adjustments to your deck or play style, which makes you lazy which means you are the problem. Wanting Blizzard to help you solve the problem to a card or cards is not the answer. There are plenty of folks that have found solutions to dealing with it. The Huntard forces you to play differently. In that way I think it is good for the game.

No, I don't lay Hunter. I hate Hunters, more specifically I hate people that play Hunter thinking it is a easy button to rank up.

I have beaten Hunter by flooding the board early and often, let them draw out of cards. If they use the combo when your life total is still in the 20s and your board is full, they will usually use the combo as intended, which is to balance the board. If this happens a lot of their burst is gone. I have beaten Huntard with fatigue. As a Shaman!

If you're facing a lot of Hunters, add a little more taunt and some farseers. It is just enough SOMETIMES to slow them down. Or switch to a class/deck that has a better % vs them.

Changing your play rather than crying on the forums is a much better and immediate solution.

P.S. Sometimes you simply have to ick your poison. Which class/deck type do you want to lose to so you can win the majority of your games. No deck in the game has a above 50% vs everything. At least to my knowledge.
Edited by Bellumvinco on 4/8/2014 7:17 AM PDT
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Posts: 2,569
04/08/2014 07:13 AMPosted by Bellumvinco
The problem with the Buzzard/UTH combo isn't the cards...It is that you want to be able to play your deck the same way vs every class/deck, without making any adjustments to your deck or play style, which makes you lazy which means you are the problem.


More ignorance. The problem isn't being shoehorned into a certain playstyle (because while frustrating, that's still legitimately how this game can and should work) but the fact that the Hunter deck PUNISHES you for doing it. Honestly, how do most Hunter spells work? They target 1 or 2 minions. Multi-shot, Deadly Shot, Hunters Mark, Snipe, Freezing Trap, that's just a few cards that will ruin someone for playing less than 3 minions. But if you play 3 or more? UTH Buzzard Timber Wolf Hyena combo'd into the ground. Honestly, can't you see the problem there? UTH would be fine if the counterplay didn't involve shooting yourself in the foot by making yourself an easy target for the rest of the Hunter deck. What other card in the game does this to people? None. And that's excluding the fact that while you're playing slow to counter UTH the Hunter shoots you in the face almost every turn.

It's not UTH that is the sole problem, it's just the catalyst that forces you to play the Hunters game right from turn 1. No other class has this level of control right from the get go. It's not interactive gameplay. It's not interesting or fun. It's braindead, it's forced, it's frustrating, and despite it's predictability you can't do anything about it.
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Posts: 132
Not saying the combo isn't stupid OP though. Sometimes getting better than 3-1 value AND increasing your hand size is just crazy! Any one that defends this is a Huntard. Just saying it can be managed. Don't try to play around it though...it plays into the Huntards hands.
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Posts: 1,551
I wouldn't call it gamebreaking, sure it can change the outcome of a game, but so can flamestrike, ragnaros, deathwing, polymorph and whatnot.

I would like to see it nerfed to 3 mana cost to make it less cost-efficient. It's not too strong, but it's too strong for 2 mana imo.

At 4 mana, no one used it. At 2 mana, everyone fears it. What will 3 mana bring?
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Posts: 132
04/08/2014 07:23 AMPosted by Dishrack
It's not UTH that is the sole problem, it's just the catalyst that forces you to play the Hunters game right from turn 1. No other class has this level of control right from the get go. It's not interactive gameplay. It's not interesting or fun. It's braindead, it's forced, it's frustrating, and despite it's predictability you can't do anything about it.


Your trapped by your way of thinking. Break yourself. GO ALL IN A COUPLE TIMES, I think you'll find that your fear of what they can do is worse than what they can do.

Besides, it is their Bow and Hero ability that kills you, the combo just looks so devastating that it sticks in your brain. Can't do anything about the Hero ability but a couple Oozes can hurt their feelings. More 3 health creatures...a couple more taunts...I do strongly believe Silence should be able to target Secrets!
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Posts: 5,608
04/08/2014 07:23 AMPosted by Dishrack
you can't do anything about it.
other than beat them 49.4% of the time
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Posts: 2,569
04/08/2014 07:29 AMPosted by masters66
other than beat them 49.4% of the time


Dismissing the criticism not by refuting it, but by relaying an inaccurate statistic that doesn't specify level or rank of the class nor distinguish the win-loss ratio across said ranks and levels. Nice. Might as well say control Warrior isn't strong because Warrior only wins a fraction of a percentage point more than Hunters.
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Posts: 5,608
04/08/2014 07:46 AMPosted by Dishrack
04/08/2014 07:29 AMPosted by masters66
other than beat them 49.4% of the time


Dismissing the criticism not by refuting it, but by relaying an inaccurate statistic that doesn't specify level or rank of the class nor distinguish the win-loss ratio across said ranks and levels. Nice. Might as well say control Warrior isn't strong because Warrior only wins a fraction of a percentage point more than Hunters.
People repeatedly state that every hunter useas UtH, so it's not the same as picking a specific deck-type of a class. Based on the posts by the children on this forum, every hunter uses (and abuses) UtH and earns cheap wins doing it. Thus, when Hunters have a win-rate of around 50.6%, you've got to question how OP it is.

Why do you say it is inaccurate? As to the level of the players, people tracking their win-rate on a site like that are going to be above average.
Edited by masters66 on 4/8/2014 7:51 AM PDT
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Posts: 1,972
UTH so OP, Hunters win half their games now
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Posts: 501
It's not surprising to me at all that warlock and hunter would be top tier according to this poll.

It has to do with only one thing: card draw.

Actually, hunter is pretty easy to beat if you can limit their buzzards to draw less than 4 cards. If they draw more than that, well that's GG.

Same with Warlock, if you can force him to use his mana every turn and not lifetap it is an easy game for you. It doesn't matter if he is murloc, handlock, or zoo, it's the lifetap that wins these games.

UTH is not OP on its own. It's a great card.

Card draw is what wins games.

Remember when you were new to the game and a priest played a cleric on turn one? Kept drawing all game long? Yeah...card draw...
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