Nerf Zoo cancer

Posts: 44
To everyone saying he should have run Tazdingo or Wraths. He's drawn through what 7 of his cards at this point? That's why there is no real counter for agro decks. You can't rely on getting your cards in time when you lose before you can even draw through a third of your deck.

Also I love to see the idiots saying get past rank 20. Watch the top streamers in the game lose to these decks if they don't get perfect draw. Playing against agro decks has nothing to do with you or your deck it's all about the opponent getting unlucky and you getting lucky with draws and that's why it's broken.
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Posts: 1,637
06/05/2014 05:10 PMPosted by osea101
That doesn't make it easy to beat.

I beat zoo decks all the time. And I'm definitely nothing special.

Maybe adjust your deck?

Better yet: adjust your attitude.
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Posts: 202
My Grandfather smoked his whole life. I was about 10 years old when my mother said to him, 'If you ever want to see your grandchildren graduate, you have to stop immediately.'. Tears welled up in his eyes when he realized what exactly was at stake. He gave it up immediately. Three years later he died of lung cancer. It was really sad and destroyed me. My mother said to me- 'Don't ever smoke. Please don't put your family through what your Grandfather put us through." I agreed. At 28, I have never touched a cigarette. I must say, I feel a very slight sense of regret for never having done it, because your post gave me cancer anyway.
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06/05/2014 06:02 PMPosted by Alone
That's why there is no real counter for agro decks.


That is why they have the highest win rates in the game, right?
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Posts: 897
06/05/2014 05:37 PMPosted by Con
...

Since you seem so keen on harassing me and flame baiting me every time let me ask you this. What is the highest rank you have achieved? And do you play Zoo yourself?


In the current structure rank 5, 2 time 3*M when it was the old way. And no I don't play a zoo deck.


Thank you for that information. See the problem is; and please correct me if I'm wrong, but people like you probably argued that UTH was fine back when it was only 2 mana. Playing against UTH hunter was a miserable experience. Just like playing against Zoo, in particular Zoolock is an absolute miserable experience.

It feels cheap and unfair which it is objectively. You flood the board with FOTM power minions that are hard to remove while the Warlock provides an endless swarm of said entities.

I'm playing mostly decks that have a power a curve that spikes at around the 7-8th mana curve. I don't want to be forced to play these FOTM divine shield minions.
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06/05/2014 06:10 PMPosted by Con
06/05/2014 06:02 PMPosted by Alone
That's why there is no real counter for agro decks.


That is why they have the highest win rates in the game, right?


06/05/2014 01:13 AMPosted by Bosskiller

Warlock win rate vs classes

53.14% Druid
50.26% Hunter
53.91% Mage
52.75% Paladin
58.34% Priest
52.58% Rogue
54.49% Shaman
53.03% Warrior


If most low rank/legend are using Hand and the average player win % drops at those ranks as competition toughens, would you agree Zoo is getting a pretty solid run for warlock to have percentages like this?
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Posts: 659
06/05/2014 05:12 PMPosted by UrukEnkidu
don't play with stupid watchers. yetis are far better 4/5's.


Disagree for a Druid watcher deck, those 2 mana 4/5's that can't attack become 6/7 (or better) with taunt and attack for little more mana than a yeti.
Edited by Winstiford on 6/5/2014 6:43 PM PDT
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Posts: 1,208
The problem with the warlock zoo isn't that it works sometimes - it's that it works every time.

Because of their ability to draw as needed, they can always pump out multiple minions every round, whereas no one else can.

Yes, you can drop a card-draw type card and pump something out, but those can be countered - warlock free card draw ability lets him literally drop 2 cards/turn, every single turn, while the rest of us can only drop 1.... so unless you structure your deck just to beat that 1 strategy, you're screwed unless you're very, very lucky.
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06/05/2014 06:36 PMPosted by osea101
Thank you for that information. See the problem is; and please correct me if I'm wrong, but people like you probably argued that UTH was fine back when it was only 2 mana.


Or we probably said we should wait and see and that it would likely not be given the absurd nerfs people asked for.

06/05/2014 06:36 PMPosted by osea101
Just like playing against Zoo, in particular Zoolock is an absolute miserable experience.


So you don't like rush in particular. Would this be because it counters your decks and the easiest solution in your mind is to change the game?

One played no minions the other plays all minions yet they are similar, legit.

06/05/2014 06:36 PMPosted by osea101
It feels cheap and unfair which it is objectively. You flood the board with FOTM power minions that are hard to remove while the Warlock provides an endless swarm of said entities.


06/05/2014 06:36 PMPosted by osea101
I'm playing mostly decks that have a power a curve that spikes at around the 7-8th mana curve. I don't want to be forced to play these FOTM divine shield minions.


Oh so you get countered during your rank farming and think you should be entitled to win every game with as little effort as possible.

Zoo does not have a high win rate, it is not a top tier deck. It is however cheap and popular, especially at lower ranks. Sorry but this is something you will have to learn to deal with as the criteria for changes go zoo is nowhere close to on the radar for a change.
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Posts: 117
06/05/2014 06:36 PMPosted by osea101
Thank you for that information. See the problem is; and please correct me if I'm wrong, but people like you probably argued that UTH was fine back when it was only 2 mana. Playing against UTH hunter was a miserable experience. Just like playing against Zoo, in particular Zoolock is an absolute miserable experience.


It's a miserable experience for you because of your slow deck. have you ever seen a miracle rogue trying to beat a handlock(?) that drops a giant they can't kill or a freeze burst mage trying to beat a warrior. both are miserable experiences that happen because a deck can't be built to deal with everything.

Also Zoo while strong is not omgwft unbeatable, if it wasn't the crapload of people using it at rank 20 wouldn't be at rank 20 now would they. Now can zoo be played to legend of course, but it's not in the manner of brainlessly dropping minions its knowing what you're opponent might have or not have to deal with your minions.

This is coming from a guy that plays Shaman/Druid/Rarely miracle rogue. that can beat and also can lose to Zoo. Secondly this is a card game meaning if you don't want to adjust your deck to beat other decks then you have no right to complain about something beating you so keep on losing to those zoo locks mate....

P.S. UTH was nerfed due to it basically negating shaman from the ladder while also hard countering any decks that played to many minions).
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Posts: 1,637
06/05/2014 06:44 PMPosted by Died
Because of their ability to draw as needed, they can always pump out multiple minions every round, whereas no one else can.

You realize it's like they've let you hit for a free 2 every time they do that, right? And that a Warlock who is drawing that often is constantly missing its drops? Any of that computing?

Jesus, sometimes I wonder if anyone around here actually plays the game. Zoo is so, so beatable.
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Slow Watchers Druid complains about a deck that counters his. Priceless.
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06/05/2014 05:05 PMPosted by striker9936
Running taunts and AOE is hard work.

Paladins don't get any AoE, taunts or weapons until turn 4 and by then you're already dead.
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Posts: 659
06/05/2014 06:53 PMPosted by Bosskiller
Slow Watchers Druid complains about a deck that counters his. Priceless.


I play both Zoolock and Watcher Druid, in my (limited) experience rng has a far bigger impact on watcher than zoo, only once has rng screwed my Lock by giving me 3+ cards for the first 4 rounds negating its strength, watcher in my experience gets screwed far more often...

Still love Watcher though, I'm not gonna complain when rng bites me 'cos when it comes together it works like a charm :)
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06/05/2014 06:39 PMPosted by Cthulhu
If most low rank/legend are using Hand and the average player win % drops at those ranks as competition toughens, would you agree Zoo is getting a pretty solid run for warlock to have percentages like this?


This is the first time that data has shown any class to be winning above 50% of the time vs all other classes, in any season since Test Season 1. There has always been a minimum of 2 classes that had higher win rates vs any class. This is cause for concern to me, although I would like to see data that separates Casual and Ranked data.
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Posts: 9,668
06/05/2014 07:08 PMPosted by Winstiford
I play both Zoolock and Watcher Druid, in my (limited) experience rng has a far bigger impact on watcher than zoo, only once has rng screwed my Lock by giving me 3+ cards for the first 4 rounds negating its strength, watcher in my experience gets screwed far more often...


Anyone that plays Watcher or Ramp Druid knows that the Druid will have a difficult time vs a fast deck, if they do not draw their ramp cards quickly, hence why my statement. Fast decks counter slow decks. If you want a favorable matchup, with less RNG determining the outcome vs Zoo with Druid, Token Druid is your best bet.
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Posts: 1,876
06/05/2014 06:52 PMPosted by TheDukester
06/05/2014 06:44 PMPosted by Died
Because of their ability to draw as needed, they can always pump out multiple minions every round, whereas no one else can.

You realize it's like they've let you hit for a free 2 every time they do that, right? And that a Warlock who is drawing that often is constantly missing its drops? Any of that computing?

Jesus, sometimes I wonder if anyone around here actually plays the game. Zoo is so, so beatable.


If you really do beat the zoo ALL THE TIME, maybe you can post your deck and enlighten us.

I know you won't, or ''can't'', I can see you would say something like ''Hurr Durr can't you just google it? I don't want to waste my time for you bad players, if you can't find ones, you deserve to lose''
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Posts: 992
In the current meta Zoo isn't actually that good . It can still beat almost anything with bad draws of the opponent but it's not as strong anymore. Once you manage to hold Zoo small for long enough the Warlock will tap himself soo low that he'll just die to burst . Sometimes though you can't deal with the big board of small guys zoo will have before he's out of a hand. I mean the 2 minions per turn are irrelevant in the later turn when they throw out the crap they want early on.
Edited by Serp on 6/5/2014 7:59 PM PDT
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Posts: 1,208
Just ran into another murlock... this one got his perfect draw, I had both forked lightnings, 1 lightning storm - played all 3 by turn 5, by turn 6 he hit me for 20 in 1 round.

Murlock is still ridiculously overpowered.
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Posts: 1,208
06/05/2014 07:56 PMPosted by Serp
In the current meta Zoo isn't actually that good . It can still beat almost anything with bad draws of the opponent but it's not as strong anymore. Once you manage to hold Zoo small for long enough the Warlock will tap himself soo low that he'll just die to burst . Sometimes though you can't deal with the big board of small guys zoo will have before he's out of a hand. I mean the 2 minions per turn are irrelevant in the later turn when they throw out the crap they want early on.


You're under the mistaken impression that it's possible to hold it. It isn't. The only way you win is if he draws badly off the start. If he draws well, you will always lose, no matter how well you play.

That's why it's broken.
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