Tell me why this deck sucks. :)

Posts: 49
2x Leper Gnome
2x Lightning Bolt
2x Rockbiter
2x Stormforged Axe
1x Bloodmage
2x Feral Spirit
2x Hex
2x Unbound Ele
2x Lava Burst
1x Acolyte Of Pain
2x Lightning Storm
1x Leeroy
2x Ogre Magi
2x Azure Drake
2x Nightblade
1x Doomhammer
2x Fire Ele

Basically the deck revolves around lots of direct damage via LB, LitB, gnomes, nightblades, and Fire ele, buffed up by spell damage minions and totem.

Unbounds benefit from the high amount of overload to become threats.

Minions prioritize face damage over everything else till you get the opponent down low enough to fire off a nice spell damage combo or a leeroy/rockbiter finisher, or even a leeroy/spell damage/rockbiter combo. There's lots of ways to get it done.

Ferals for stall/protection, and lightning storm for board clear with or without Bloodmage or another spell damage minion.

So tell me why it sucks... or how you would improve on it.

Or if it's just not viable to begin with.
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Posts: 263
Simple. You use shamans removal spells as finishers which leave you nothing to deal with the board apart from 2 storms and hoping for favourable trades. The deck is not viable in my opinion to be honest.
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Posts: 288
Mind you, I am only rank 5:

Not enough draw. Personally I think a mana tide totem would be better than an acolyte; its 1 damage does not really justify the fact that you have (as opposed to mages, warriors, priests (through buffing and healing), etc.) no reliable way of getting more than one card off it - and even that is not guaranteed. At least with mana tide you are sure to get at least one card, and you might even get two. If not there are always those who are willing to use good removal on it. You do not have the ability to cycle through the deck fast enough to keep the pressure up when you fire everything at face.

Not enough taunt (though I guess that is optional). I suspect that you are higly vulnerable to all sorts of rush decks, and most classes do it better than shaman, truth be told.

The minions you do have (chosen for their spelldamage or face damage) do not have any real board pressence - fire elementals aside. What will not remove an ogre magi, azure drake or nightblade? They do not trade well, which means that they will never stay alive long enough to get any serious spelldamage combos going.

In particular I dislike the nightblades. At least the extra spelldamage can be used for board control when needed, but the nightblades give you no such options

I like the effort, though. I have a very generic deck at the moment.
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Posts: 1,224
For starters remove Leper Gnomes and Nightblades, those things are useless in Shaman decks. - Replace Leper Gnomes with Earth Shock (trust me, you're gonna need these).
- Instead of Nightblades pick something that actively benefits your deck/board advantage, such as Sen'Jin Shieldmastas/Chillwind Yetis.
- I'd also consider dropping Ogre Magis, while 4/4 & SP ain't bad for 4 Mana you already got Azure Drakes that'll do essentially the same thing.
- Add some 2-3 Mana minions, 1x Flametongue would be great addition and Harvest Golem usually trades favorably vs cheap minions.

06/23/2014 08:15 PMPosted by MrTwopence
Mind you, I am only rank 5:

Not enough draw. Personally I think a mana tide totem would be better than an acolyte; its 1 damage does not really justify the fact that you have (as opposed to mages, warriors, priests (through buffing and healing), etc.) no reliable way of getting more than one card off it - and even that is not guaranteed. At least with mana tide you are sure to get at least one card, and you might even get two.


Honestly, Mana Tide isn't that good either. It's a !@#$ty 0/3 for 3 Mana which is huge tempo loss if played early, you practically HAVE to have board control to get value out of Mana Tide. Even then Mana Tide gets removed instantly 9 times out of 10, leaving you with 1 card for 3 Mana. At least Acolyte hits back when it gets attacked and doesn't get bumrushed by 1-2 Atk minions.
Acolyte can also discourage AoE spells (Concencrate, Holy Nova) while MT does no such thing.
Most higher ranked Shamans prefer Gnomish Inventor over Mana Tide simply because of better tempo.

At the moment it seems like 1x Auctioneer & 2x Azure Drake & 1-2x Gnomish Inventor (and maybe Thalnos, if you count it as card cycle) is the way to go: They're all 4 Health minions, they can knock down most 1-2 Mana minions in one hit and not die immediately.
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Posts: 49
06/23/2014 07:35 PMPosted by Supreme89
Simple. You use shamans removal spells as finishers which leave you nothing to deal with the board apart from 2 storms and hoping for favourable trades. The deck is not viable in my opinion to be honest.


Idealy they'd be used as finishes, but no I'm not opposed to using them to take out problem minions too. I just prioritize minions to kill minions, and more importantly face damage to whittle the health away.

With the right combos you can take a good chunk of life away in a single turn. The way I have them set up each combo is designed to take 1/3 of the opponent's life, maybe more.

However if I do set it up to be able to use the full spell combo. BM + 2LB + 2LitB = 20 damage for 10 mana, leaving only 10 face damage minions have to do while LS and other minions keep the incoming damage on their end from piling up.

I feel like the deck has a lot of bursty potential with the right combos. Leeroy double rockbiter for instance. Doomhammer double rockbiter, etc etc.

I know the Ogre Magi might be redundant with the Azure Drakes, but they do come out faster, and they pretty much assure I always have a least 1 spell power minion on the board at any given time. In fact in the few games I played to test things out it wasn't uncommon for me to have 2 on the board to let me fire off some nice spell damage combos.

I've been a bit iffy about the nightblades too, yeah, but I just like the idea of having an (almost) guaranteed 10 face damage between those and the lepers. In theory if everything works out I'd cast 2 lepers, 2 nightblades, and then baring any healing I fire off the BM, LB, LitB combo to finish it off. Or the Doomhammer double rockbiter, or Leeroy double RB to take another 1/3 of life away.

I do agree the deck could use more card draw, but I'm not sure where to fit it in. Maybe replace the lepers or nightblades with loot hoarders? Or -1 leper/NB for a hoarder?

Mind you I'm not married to this deck, just something I came up with I thought might work in theory and be a style of play not many people would expect from a shaman
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Posts: 475
2x Leper Gnome
2x Lightning Bolt
2x Rockbiter
2x Stormforged Axe - I'd only run one of these. They're great against Zoo and can deal some damage to the face, but you'll be taking too much damage over the course of the game by running two Axes and Doomhammer. You'll be outraced too easily.
1x Bloodmage
2x Feral Spirit
2x Hex
2x Unbound Ele
2x Lava Burst - I'm not a huge fan of Lava Bursts myself, but they just might work in an agressive deck.
1x Acolyte Of Pain - He's neither providing huge amounts of draw, nor does he offer a solid body. Shamans don't have the same options to abuse him, unlike Warriors or Mages.
2x Lightning Storm - Storm's great, but I wouldn't run two in a deck that's supposed to be the aggressive one. It doesn't fit that well with your game plan, imho. I'd drop one.
1x Leeroy
2x Ogre Magi - They're supbar. Yes, the spell power is nice and the body not bad, but you'll want stuff that can trade better, at the very least.
2x Azure Drake
2x Nightblade - Just, no. Direct damage is all well and good, but if fails the Yeti test (as well as Cairn, Argent Commander, and a few others). Not worth the but of damage, really.
1x Doomhammer
2x Fire Ele


Now, with the Lava Bursts still in, that leaves you seven cards to replace.

I'd go with the staples. 2 Chillwind Yeti, 2 Argent Squire and either a combination of three Harvest Golems and Argent Commanders, depending on how you curve out.

You want to be aggressive, that means commiting to the board. It's better to sacrifice some spell damage or direct damage to be able to sustain your minions on the board better and to trade favourably. Argent Squire, Harvest Golem, Argent Commander and, to a lesser extend, Chillwind Yet, are all relative annyoing to deal with, can trade well and still dish out enough pain.

Makes the deck a bit more focused, in my opinion.
Edited by Luminis on 6/24/2014 3:13 AM PDT
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Posts: 1,005
Your deck sucks because Overload isn't a mechanic that goes well with an aggro deck. If you have played this deck, you have probably sometimes noticed how you have to end your turn with 1 spare mana and overloaded on your next turn. Control decks can get away with this, but aggro cannot. You need to be really lucky with your draw to make effective use of your mana and gain the tempo an aggro deck needs to succeed.

In order to improve your deck, you need to make it more controlling. You'd have to remove the Leper Gnomes and Nightblades because their main value is to rush the opponent down as fast as possible, and your deck just doesn't excel at that. You should also replace the Ogre Magi because they're underbudget and replace the Acolyte of Pain because you have no real way of dealing damage to it for several card draws.

There are a number of good cards you can fill your deck with, such as Feral Spirit, Flametongue Totem, Earth Shock, Defender of Argus and Argent Commander (replaces Leeroy). My recommendation for cuts would be:

-2 Leper Gnomes
-1 Stormforged Axe
-2 Lava Bursts
-1 Acolyte Of Pain
-1 Leeroy
-2 Ogre Magi
-2 Nightblade

+2 Earth Shock (alternative: Argent Squire)
+2 Flametongue Totem
+2 Feral Spirit
+1 Mana Tide Totem (alternative: Gnomish Inventor)
+2 Defender of Argus (alternative: Chillwind Yeti or Sen'jin Shieldmasta)
+2 Argent Commander (alternative: Al'Akir)
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Posts: 49
Hmmm, I like the suggestions alot, thanks for that.

Lots of things to think about and make changes on.

Oddly enough I feel like the overload wasn't holding me back because of the cheap cost of 70% of my cards, and the fact that my Unbounds were able to get at least 2 or 3 buffs out of them.

I know the Nightblades suck, but they did sorta fit in with the flavor theme of the deck. The ogres too, but you guys are probably right about replacing them with Yetis and whatnot.

I'll let you know what I come back with. :)
Edited by Pharcyde on 6/24/2014 8:52 PM PDT
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Posts: 49
Okay so so far I settled on:

-1 LS
-1 Axe
-1 Acolyte
-2 Ogre
-2 Nightblade

+2 Argent Squire
+1 Mana Tide
+2 Yeti
+2 Argent Commander

Seems to be runnin smoother already

I'm already thinking of ditching the squires for golems though because I have plenty of 1 drops already- however I do have a ton of 3s too.
Edited by Pharcyde on 6/24/2014 9:23 PM PDT
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Posts: 32
If you are having problems with this deck I suspect that it is because you have 5 spell damage minions and a comparatively low number of direct damage spells, only 6. I would suggest replacing the Ogre Magi with something else, perhaps Yetis. Also the Nightblades don't really do enough damage to justify a place in this deck. You see you're not set up to hit his face early, you need smaller minions for that. I would replace these with Harvest Golems to shift the mana curve lower.

If you're committed to a spell damage Shaman I've had a lot of success with the Zeus deck, which includes all the direct damage cards (yes, even frost shock) a Thalnos (Geomancer for budget version), Azure Drakes, and Malygos for making Lightning Bolts and Frost Shocks and Lava Bursts hit for a ton of damage.

Also, a Shaman can't use that many weapons. We don't have enough healing to make it worthwhile. I've never had much success with more than 1 weapon in a deck. Either Stormforged axe for early removal or Doomhammer for late game Rockbiter combo plays. The weapons have very different purposes and you have to be careful about how you use them. So get rid of two of those.
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Posts: 49
06/26/2014 12:42 PMPosted by Bullrath
If you are having problems with this deck I suspect that it is because you have 5 spell damage minions and a comparatively low number of direct damage spells, only 6. I would suggest replacing the Ogre Magi with something else, perhaps Yetis. Also the Nightblades don't really do enough damage to justify a place in this deck. You see you're not set up to hit his face early, you need smaller minions for that. I would replace these with Harvest Golems to shift the mana curve lower.

If you're committed to a spell damage Shaman I've had a lot of success with the Zeus deck, which includes all the direct damage cards (yes, even frost shock) a Thalnos (Geomancer for budget version), Azure Drakes, and Malygos for making Lightning Bolts and Frost Shocks and Lava Bursts hit for a ton of damage.

Also, a Shaman can't use that many weapons. We don't have enough healing to make it worthwhile. I've never had much success with more than 1 weapon in a deck. Either Stormforged axe for early removal or Doomhammer for late game Rockbiter combo plays. The weapons have very different purposes and you have to be careful about how you use them. So get rid of two of those.


Yeah I made some changes in the post above yours. Maybe you missed it, but like I said in there I did ditch the Ogres for Yetis, and the Nightblades for Argent commanders. So I am relying a lot less on the spell power minions now.

I do kinda disagree about the weapons though. Mostly the doomhammer is there as a finisher /w rockbiter so I'm not too worried about face damage from it, and since I want to ideally use the direct damage spells to the face the axe helps a bit more in cleaning up early game to allow me to do so.

Plus both of them buff up my unbounds who, aside from the fire eles, are the only other real threat minion-wise I have in the deck.

I totally get what you mean though.

I don't really have Maly yet unfortunately, but he would be a good addition to this deck, yeah... and is also what's keepin me from being able to play Zeus in the first place.

The deck is goin a lot more smoothly with the yetis and squires and such now too.
Edited by Pharcyde on 6/27/2014 2:59 PM PDT
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