Mage Rant

Posts: 3,223
I have been playing Hearthstone since early January. I do not claim to be the best player, but I am by no means a bad player. Playing as a Paladin with a high-dust cost deck, I just lost against a to-da-face Mage using a basic deck and this is by no means an isolated incident.

I hate Mages. Mages are seriously killing my enjoyment of this game. Losing against other classes at least I know either my deck was built poorly or I made a mistake somewhere. Losing against a Mage I know I lost because the class, even taking into consideration the nerfs to frost spells and Pyroblast, has been getting far too much special treatment by the developers.

Not only do they have an absolutely overpowered hero power (dealing 1 damage for 2 mana is far more powerful than it sounds), every Mage deck contains each of the following cards guaranteed:

x2 Frostbolt
x2 Fireball
x2 Polymorph
x2 Flamestrike

Why? Because these cards are seriously the best card in the game hands-down. Mages will apologetically humble-brag about how bad their class has it but, without any hyperbole here, you are bad at this game if you cannot do well playing a Mage. While most games I play are in constructed, every time I play an Arena run I pick Mage (when possible) solely for the raw power the class has.

Once I get Lotheb, he is going into every deck I build even if it doesn't make any sense. Perhaps in the future we will have more counters to Mage cheese so the listed cards can remain the same and maybe Fireblast will be toned down or replaced but for now Mages are anti-fun incarnate.
Edited by JohnKelly on 8/19/2014 6:39 PM PDT
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Posts: 121
Just to save you from the posts that are incoming:

-Mages are near non-existent at rank 3+;

-Any good mage runs at most 1 copy of Polymorph and 1 copy of Flamestrike (if any)

-And for the love of all that is left in you, why are you wasting your life posting weak yet punctuated arguments against a moderately 'ok' class in a video game?

I understand the angst that can come with losses in a videogame particularly when you feel you 'deserve' better but don't waste the lives of the people around you with this dribble.

If you truly believe mage is all powerful then you should be Legend rank by now with a mage deck. We both know you're response will be "I hate mage so I'll never play it", so until you actually try it and make it past rank 5 save the butt hurt charade for !@#$ that matters.
Edited by Pathology on 8/19/2014 8:06 PM PDT
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Posts: 3,223
08/19/2014 08:06 PMPosted by Pathology
If you truly believe mage is all powerful then you should be Legend rank by now with a mage deck.

I have been planning on doing this for some time now.
Edited by JohnKelly on 8/19/2014 8:18 PM PDT
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Posts: 330
08/19/2014 08:06 PMPosted by Pathology


-Mages are near non-existent at rank 3+;

-Any good mage runs at most 1 copy of Polymorph and 1 copy of Flamestrike (if any)

-And for the love of all that is left in you, why are you wasting your life posting weak yet punctuated arguments against a moderately 'ok' class in a video game?


THIS, 100 times THIS

If you truly believe mage is all powerful then you should be Legend rank by now with a mage deck.


this also

I have been planning on doing this for some time now


Good luck, because you'll need it... especialy if you're planning on running 2 flamestrike and 2 polymorphs.

Flamestrike is so bad against optimized deck, that's not even funny...

Against fast deck, you're already dead turn 7.

Against slow decks... you won't need it.. at best there will be 3 target on the board, all above 5 health. (I'm looking at you druids).
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Posts: 44
LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL !!!!!

I would like to say "L2P"... but you play since more than 6 months so... I don't know...

- try mage ?
- don't overextend all your hand on turn 6 ?
- put some minions who will get the polymorph instead of your ragna / tyrion ?

If nothing above looks like good for you maybe you could try :
- stop whining ?
- go play pokemon ?

Anyway, good luck too you, u'll need it :D
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Posts: 248
08/19/2014 06:38 PMPosted by JohnKelly
Not only do they have an absolutely overpowered hero power (dealing 1 damage for 2 mana is far more powerful than it sounds), every Mage deck contains each of the following cards guaranteed:

x2 Frostbolt
x2 Fireball
x2 Polymorph
x2 Flamestrike

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA
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Posts: 1,090
I'm pretty sure I've posted this on one of your threads before John but why not yet again...

08/05/2014 10:19 PMPosted by Peripatetic
I've said this a million times so why not repost it again.

let me paint a picture of early Beta for you. This is what an OP mage really looks like. Pyroblast used to be eight mana, and Cone of Cold, Frost Nova, and Blizzard were all one mana cheaper.

Turn 1: Mana Wyrm
Turn 2: Frost Nova
Turn 3: Frost Nova / Cone of Cold
Turn 4: Frost Nova / Cone of Cold
Turn 5: Blizzard / Frost Nova/ Cone of Cold
Turn 6: Blizzard / Frost Nova/ Cone of Cold
Turn 7: Flamestrike
Turn 8: Pyroblast
Turn 9: Pyroblast / Lepper Gnome (just to salt the wound)

So let me say this in terms of the game. Turn one you might field a creature but it’s not important, because on turn two he’s a block of ice thanks to frost nova. Turn two you field more creatures an they take a Cone of Cold or Frost Nova and are also blocks of ice. This continues for the next four turns, Frost Nova, Cone of Cold, Blizzard and there is nothing you can do about it. Meanwhile thanks to their low cost your opponent has drawn cards, thrown out a frostbolt here, a fireball there, and if you yourself are frozen they’ve probably ice lanced you once or twice. Turn seven rolls around and they finally are out of freeze spells, just in time for your damaged and weakened board to get flamestriked. Turn eight you get a pyroblast to the face and you’re probably less than ten health now. Your next turn is really just a formality because turn nine you know what’s coming the second pyroblast you’re already dead no matter what you do.

You think we’re OP now, you know nothing! Yeah Zoo and Handlock is dominant, Hunter UTH is annoying and efficient, Warrior control is aggravating as hell, but they have nothing on what Mages used to be capable of. What you say about not needing a brain was very true back then. It was a full nine turns of control and removal. We needed a nerf and we got one. Blizzard started by nerfing our Freeze and while that hurt us it wasn't enough, so Blizzard raised the cost of pyroblast. That set everything straight and brings us up to the present.

So since we’ve been nerfed whats the problem with us now? Allow me to unpack a lot of your grievances.

X (Opponent): It’s so cheap they nuked my 6/6 with a Fireball!
M (Mage): Getting hit by your 6/6 sucks as bad as getting hit by a fireball.

X: It’s so cheap they turned my 6/6 into a sheep!
M: Getting hit by your sheep sucks less than getting hit by your 6/6.

X: I had my field all set up and then they Flamestriked / Froze the board.
M: Getting punched in the face by an army sucks a lot!

Not a single one of those explanations is unreasonable. So why does this always happen when you face a Mage, it’s the nature of our class. Blizzard said as much early in Alpha. They went on the record saying we’re changing fireball to four mana we want the Mages to be the masters of burn. We already knew with all the ice spells and polymorph we’d be control, but having cheap burn power made it official. Our Modus Operandi or MO is control burn. In MTG terms Boros or Izzit (Red/White or Red/Blue).

So why do we always respond with spells rather than play minions to win like everyone else. Simply put they do a better job of dealing with threats than our minions. Our minions are utility and ultimately situational. They are far cry from sure bets, and they are not supposed to go toe to toe. Their purpose is to be deployed biased on the current state of the game. My minions have two jobs to do. First, wreak havoc with their ability. Second, to deal what damage they can. If I’m dealing enough damage to cause you problems I’ll leave it to you to try and kill my minions. In the mean time I’m going to nuke and remove your minions and poke away at your health.

Here is the point. Control decks are designed to force you to play our game and not yours. We will start by taking your game plan away from you. What always works may not work anymore. What you needed to pull off a combination might be taken from you. We break your game down and dismantle it. Yeah it’s annoying but it’s how we win. And, you think there is no thought to how we play?

The problem isn’t that we have overpowering spells we don’t anymore. See the above if you need convincing of that. No the problem is Mages are a control class. Our minions are bolstered by our ability to control you. They get bolstered by our control and removal. Mirror Entity, Vaporize, Counterspell, Spellbender they take away your spells and minions. They are control cards. Frostbolt Fireball: Flamestrike take away your health and your minions. They are removal cards. It’s not secret to a CCG player what our cards are meant to do. And, to give Blizzard credit they did a good job in our design. Secrets are Blue control, Freeze is White control, and Nukes are Red.

The complains you are voicing aren’t new to this game or any other CCG. Let me break that down for you if you’re new to CCG’s. There are three formats decks roughly fall into: Burn, Control, and Aggro. Control is a pain no matter what CCG you’re playing, I've faced enough control decks in my time to hate them as much as everyone else. That said it’s as legitimate a strategy as Aggro. Red White (what I play) in my opinion is the worst because it feels so hopeless, and if you fall behind it's over and your opponent knows it. Barring any mental errors you've been pushed to break point.

The meta is partially to blame for your difficulty. You all build to fight against Aggro because the vast majority of decks are Aggro. When you run into us you’re utterly unprepared to deal with how we’re going to handle the game. As I said we dictate the terms of engagement and force you to play how we wan’t you to. That is why when you get beaten you get beaten badly. Aggro is utterly predictable and relies heavily on RNG, if your speed is a little off a well constructed control will completely dominate you. We have great consistency and versatility, it just doesn’t show as well in Hearthstone because the decks are 30 cards instead of 60 and resources are a set certainty . Aggro is very fast here and is harder to shut down.

It’s not our cards that you hate, it’s the playstyle they facilitate that you hate. Control is annoying and is only fun if when you manage to compete with it. Blizzard nefed us to balance. We’re not going to get hit with nerf bat till Naxx, and that's only because every class will get at least one stupidly broken card. We’re are the control class that Blizzard intended us to be. Like all control deck it takes work and a lot of forethought to play well as a mage now. We’re balanced, we’re just the wrong playstyle for the meta game right now.
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Posts: 4
@OP

are you kidding me? I played pally against all class on a day to day basis but never had problems with mages. they ran out of steam pretty fast. they have few minions and mostly neutral at that. probably you're using a shockadin deck with no heals whatsoever. it's pretty much GG with out heal.
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Posts: 14
This is your problem and your stupidity. You're playing 1 deck (Paladin) and expect to beat all decks with it. You come across a class with a deck who counters your deck and you decide to cry on the forums instead of adjusting your deck or playing a different class that will be more effective. All decks have counters, unfavorable matchups, and favorable ones. Until you understand this and actually try to get better at the game and understanding it, you're just going to come on here and cry like the little child you are.

Edit: Some games will be lost due to card draw and random luck even if you have a favorable matchup.

tl;dr Stop crying, learn/understand the game as a whole, get better..... stop crying
Edited by Jeroniwhoa on 8/22/2014 3:10 AM PDT
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Posts: 779
08/19/2014 06:38 PMPosted by JohnKelly
Not only do they have an absolutely overpowered hero power (dealing 1 damage for 2 mana is far more powerful than it sounds), every Mage deck contains each of the following cards guaranteed:


Hunters do 2 dmg for 2 mana, what do you think about that?

Also I don't use flamestrike, or polymorph.
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Posts: 45
08/19/2014 08:15 PMPosted by JohnKelly
08/19/2014 08:06 PMPosted by Pathology
If you truly believe mage is all powerful then you should be Legend rank by now with a mage deck.

I have been planning on doing this for some time now.


Op i remember you've cried about mages for a very long time now in various threads of yours.Why haven't you played mage already to see for yourself how wrong you are?In the end the best way to learn how to counter a class,is to play a class itself.That's what every smart pro guy does,instead of crying about non-sense in forums.

ps:When you decide to play mage,i want to see how you'll feel when the enemy will be playing Loathbeb,faerie dragon,spectral knight.
Edited by GoldJohn on 8/23/2014 7:20 AM PDT
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Posts: 38
80% of the games you play in arena is against a mage.
That sounds completely normal and balanced. I mean people choose them for a reason, obviously not because they're broken.

From a developer standpoint I can't see how blizzard is ignoring this.
It is really shocking to me and a very ignorant thing to do of a developer.

None the less the fact that they pay extremely little time to take in any feedback from their community.
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Posts: 81
08/24/2014 03:22 AMPosted by TjockaLinnea
80% of the games you play in arena is against a mage.
That sounds completely normal and balanced. I mean people choose them for a reason, obviously not because they're broken.

From a developer standpoint I can't see how blizzard is ignoring this.
It is really shocking to me and a very ignorant thing to do of a developer.

None the less the fact that they pay extremely little time to take in any feedback from their community.


Arena is unbalanced by design. This is not a fault of the Mage class, and punishing Mage players in constructed by nerfing the class for the Arena mode is the most stupid suggestion in the history of video games.
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Posts: 589
I like mages that pull stuff like this

http://youtu.be/s9Jtyu4jR40?t=55s
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Posts: 1,143
I hate Mages. Mages are seriously killing my enjoyment of this game. .


2 threads above... "mages can't win against hunters"

there's your answer.
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Posts: 219
08/19/2014 08:06 PMPosted by Pathology
Just to save you from the posts that are incoming:

-Mages are near non-existent at rank 3+;

-Any good mage runs at most 1 copy of Polymorph and 1 copy of Flamestrike (if any)

-And for the love of all that is left in you, why are you wasting your life posting weak yet punctuated arguments against a moderately 'ok' class in a video game?

I understand the angst that can come with losses in a videogame particularly when you feel you 'deserve' better but don't waste the lives of the people around you with this dribble.

If you truly believe mage is all powerful then you should be Legend rank by now with a mage deck. We both know you're response will be "I hate mage so I'll never play it", so until you actually try it and make it past rank 5 save the butt hurt charade for !@#$ that matters.


You say this facetiously but it is actually good advice. If you hate a particular deck, play it. From playing it you will find out its weaknesses which makes you better at fighting it when you play against it.
Edited by BlinkingDuck on 8/27/2014 1:06 PM PDT
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Posts: 219
DP
Edited by BlinkingDuck on 8/27/2014 1:06 PM PDT
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Posts: 623
08/24/2014 03:22 AMPosted by TjockaLinnea
80% of the games you play in arena is against a mage.
That sounds completely normal and balanced. I mean people choose them for a reason, obviously not because they're broken.


Try 22%.
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Posts: 27
Newbies like to rant. This is definitely a L2P issue
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