StarCraft® II

[G] Comprehensive Starcraft II Ladder Guide

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MVP - StarCraft
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06/09/2011 12:34 PMPosted by OneOfOne
ExcaliburZ, is there any way that you know of that you can find out what division or tier you are in in a league? also are you stuck in that tier while you are in that league?


No, you can't find out what tier you're in. Yes, you're stuck in that tier as long as you're in that league.

By the way, the hotfix for this bug went live yesterday afternoon.
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what bug?
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MVP - StarCraft
Posts: 2,102
06/10/2011 12:52 PMPosted by OneOfOne
what bug?


There was a bug where newly-promoted players would commonly see themselves as slightly favored because they were unintentionally being promoted into the highest tier of a league. This was most evident with newly-promoted Diamond players. It's fixed though.
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I have heard that in order to get promoted faster you should lose a couple games on purpose, apparently its said that the system will increase the difficulty of your opponents as long as you keep winning games at a higher ratio of losing them. The purpose for losing is so that the system will belieive that you have reached your maximum skill capacity once you lose some games and then place you accordingly (Rather than waiting for you to simply play untill you've reached a gap you can't cross.)

That was just from skimming a couple threads/ stuff on team liquid, can anyone confirm if thats true or just some rumor? Would be really nice to know since ive been playing against either slightly favored or favored opponents the last cpl weeks and have been winning about double the games ive been losing.


Edit: I have also had expieriences where i join a game and the other player just gives it up in the first couple seconds, so it would seem as if it has some truth to it, i just wana know for sure.


The timeframe is important here. When the game first launched, the system would take a "wait and see" approach before promoting players. That is, if you just kept on winning, it would postpone your promotion because it wanted to be confident that you belonged in a league before it would move you. This allowed players to skip entire leagues, even going from Bronze to Diamond in a single promotion, but this had some unintended side effects. For example, players who did extremely well (the top of the top level players) couldn't get promoted into Diamond back when that was the highest league because they kept overshooting the requirement for Diamond, so some of them intentionally lost games in order to stabilize within Diamond and force their promotion.

Since then, a number of hotfixes have been applied to the ladder. Among these, the system is now more aggressive in moving players between leagues. As a result, skipping leagues is no longer possible. If you outperform a league, you just get promoted into the highest tier of that league. It still takes longer to promote or demote into or out of Diamond or demote into/promote out of Bronze because those are larger leagues than the others, but it's faster than the old version and doesn't require you to lose games in order to force a promotion.
Edited by ExcaliburZ on 6/13/2011 8:16 AM PDT
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MVP - StarCraft
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alright that makes more senese, so just keep winning untill you get placed basically.


oh, i also wanted to ask what the difference is between a silver/gold player and a bronze player with the same MMR winning wise. Was just wondering since i was playing all silver/gold opponents in my ladder matches, i won two in a row and now im playing bronze opponents again, im still getting +42 for a win (with bonus pool) and only losing 2-4 for a loss, so am i still going to get promoted soon or is it just random. (For about the last month ive only been against favored players if that makes a difference.)


It's not uncommon to face players in your similar situation. That is, Bronze players who have MMRs higher than Bronze but who haven't yet been promoted. One thing you can do to verify is to look at the match histories of people that you've played. Are the Silver/Gold players you fight typically facing other Silver/Gold players? Are the Bronze players typically fighting Silver/Gold players? That should give you enough information to determine where you stand, and the more data points you gather, the more accurate the estimate.
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Hey ExcaliburZ I read your very thorough league/ladder system info and i am understanding how the system works a lot more. The thing is that I am a high diamond player trying to get promoted to masters. I have been continously going against high rank master league players for the past 20-30 games. I kno that your mmr has to be at a past the master league promotion point to know that I will stand a chance once im promoted into masters. I heard that the league/ladder system was bugged for a couple of days and other ppl like myself was having the same situation about not getting promoted. I read in one your post saying that the bug is off and promotion are now online and working. People are saying that once you start going against masters(since I am a diamond player) that eventually you will get into masters. Some of my game matchups are saying that I am evenly matched with rank 3-4 masters and beating them. I just need some advice on when I will likely get promoted b/c it is literally taking forever to get the promotion. Thank you.
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06/21/2011 02:53 PMPosted by xOCLoud
Hey ExcaliburZ I read your very thorough league/ladder system info and i am understanding how the system works a lot more. The thing is that I am a high diamond player trying to get promoted to masters. I have been continously going against high rank master league players for the past 20-30 games. I kno that your mmr has to be at a past the master league promotion point to know that I will stand a chance once im promoted into masters. I heard that the league/ladder system was bugged for a couple of days and other ppl like myself was having the same situation about not getting promoted. I read in one your post saying that the bug is off and promotion are now online and working. People are saying that once you start going against masters(since I am a diamond player) that eventually you will get into masters. Some of my game matchups are saying that I am evenly matched with rank 3-4 masters and beating them. I just need some advice on when I will likely get promoted b/c it is literally taking forever to get the promotion. Thank you.


Most promotions from Diamond into Master (and promotions from Plat into Diamond too) take longer than Silver to Gold for example because Diamond covers a wider skill range than those leagues. The reason for this is because most Diamond players get put into the second-lowest division tier when they get promoted, and because Diamond has seven tiers, that's five more tiers plus the Master threshold that you need to cross before you get into Master league. It shouldn't be too much longer, I suppose.
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ignore
Edited by Denied on 6/23/2011 5:10 PM PDT
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So I just have to keep clubbing the silver players I get matched against? Can do.
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Do player's MMR in team games affect games they're MMR in 1v1's? I've been playing against Gold League players in 1v1 and it says I'm slightly favored, but they're bronze or silver in team games.
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MVP - StarCraft
Posts: 2,102
Added this image to the division tiers section to better explain why tiering exists:
http://i.imgur.com/tjSg7.jpg

Salmagundi, your question is answered in the guide already =) When you start your first placement match for a new team or game mode, it bootstraps your starting MMR from your other teams/game modes. Beyond that first game, though, your other teams have no influence.
Edited by ExcaliburZ on 7/5/2011 10:47 PM PDT
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Posts: 109
quick question for you excaliburz.
i have noticed since the lock i have been playing a wider skill range in 1v1 from bronze all the way up to diamond. I have also noticed that a lot of people are thinking they are playing out of their league as well. Is this due to my MMR, their MMR, or is league matching more people together while the league is locked?
i dont mind facing anyone. just kinda seems odd to me because i know my MMR is no where near diamond and i figured the diamond i faced would have been demoted long ago before the lock if hes facing silvers.
SIDE NOTE: the diamond player i faced today was pissed he lost to a silver so i dont think he was trying to tank his own MMR
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MVP
Posts: 3,942
If you are losing 11-13 points or winning 11-13(+11-+13) points (+bonus pool), then those guys are all around your MMR, but it seems that your MMR is already gold level at least, potencially platinum (1v1).

Leagues are locked till Jul/26th, so you should expect some players to be in the wrong league.
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Then riddle me this, how can me (a silver in 2v2's season 2) play against silver opponents and lose the placement match and now I get put into plat.
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07/26/2011 08:30 PMPosted by Dirty
Then riddle me this, how can me (a silver in 2v2's season 2) play against silver opponents and lose the placement match and now I get put into plat.

while the leagues were locked your MMR went up and down accordingly as if they were not. if the league lock didnt happen you would have been there already.
just because you lost the placement does not dictate what league you are placed . your MMR was at plat at the time of placement
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while the leagues were locked your MMR went up and down accordingly as if they were not. if the league lock didnt happen you would have been there already. just because you lost the placement does not dictate what league you are placed . your MMR was at plat at the time of placement


So then you agree the league system means nothing
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Posts: 109
07/27/2011 06:18 PMPosted by Dirty
while the leagues were locked your MMR went up and down accordingly as if they were not. if the league lock didnt happen you would have been there already. just because you lost the placement does not dictate what league you are placed . your MMR was at plat at the time of placement


So then you agree the league system means nothing

it does mean something . the only thing that "league lock" meas is that you will not get promoted/demoted and you will not gain bonus pool. your MMR still changes like normal when the leagues are locked.
like i said before. if you continue to play and win when the leagues are locked you can get promoted to a higher level after your first placement.
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