[Marine Arena] Official Thread and Changelog

Posts: 34
I somehow get the feeling that you haven't seen a roach army get utterly annihilated by a well-built marauder, zergling, or zealot army.

Look at it this way: Temple zealots are cheaper, have more DPS (WAY more, in the case of beetles), have hardened shields, and have charge. In any situation where roaches do well, zealots simply do better by utterly annihilating everything they touch without the need for silly hit-and-run burrow tactics (which are, again, easily countered by scans or an observer).

Likewise with cracklings, which have the side benefit of a much lower bounty, a doubled spawn rate, and the highest DPS out of every unit in the game.


Keep in mind that Beetles DO have more DPS in melee. I wish I knew how much, but it is fairly significant. Melee is the one thing beetles are good against, as the damage they take is spread out enough that burrow micro is actually possible since it takes a few seconds to die.

You simply can't compare straight up DPS. In any given fight, a unit with 4 range will have 4 rows of units firing while a unit with 1 range has 1 row of units in melee doing damage. That means a large Roach army is effectively outputting 4x as much damage. It also makes melee completely useless in any tight area.

You are right that they get annihilated in a straight up fight against marauders, though.

Frankly, teched marines will do well with any kind of meat shield. That doesn't make the merc good, it makes the marines good. At least, that's the way I see it.

Edit: Yep, teched marines just destroy everything. Doesn't matter what, they just destroy everything. Kind of pointless to upgrade mercs instead when they're so blatantly inferior.

Personally, I have to suggest an attack speed upgrade for mercs so they can keep up with the marines. Right now it's just too one-sided in favor of teched marines (and only teched marines).


Yes, but you will never get teched marines without using some kind of merc, because unteched marines are easily killed. Even once you DO have teched marines, mercs are still useful. Everyone probably knows how much I love marauders by now, but they still make excellent bullet sponges and with stim packs their attack rate is decent enough to actually be worthwhile, while maraiders have AoE attacks which makes them excellent support against teched marines (and brutal against air unit stacks). And their bounty isn't much more then a marine anyway.

Also, keep in mind the marine spawner disable ability in the center. Only costs 200 minerals for 2 mins and there is no better way to get a pure teched marine player to rage xD
Edited by Plague on 8/20/2010 10:03 AM PDT
Posts: 7
I think something should be done at the ability to mass merc marines (support tower calldown) inside an enemy base. A way to fix this is to increase the cost by a substantial amount only at the support tower.

You could also give it a cooldown at the tower or make the ability cost 1/5th of the towers energy. These changes could also make control of the center shop more important.
Posts: 1,166
Maybe my roaches can get slaughtered in a straight up fight, but I usually fight along the sides and use them to create choke points. I also like to take out my enemies merc turrets so I can just unburrow underneath their compounds each time they purchase a new merc.

I dunno I like my roaches, they do acceptionally well against stalkers and hellions, and most people would have changed merc from zealot/marauder by the time I've got them.
Posts: 6
Lags real bad but that's unavoidable with the number of units in the map. Very fun nonetheless!
Posts: 24
Hey Crayon... Its a good game but Could you maybe fix the thor? The thor is a good unit but its annoying because it always gets sandwhiched with your troops and thus makes it useless unless u wanna risk it being kill bc it is in the front lines... may i suggest having the thor move like a collossus: over units. Also... How do you get ULTIMATE heroes? I've used the find button on every 10 of these pages and couldn't find one trace of it.... Can you enlighten me please... great work btw on the map
Posts: 1,166
There are 3 ultimate heroes.

Buy the ghost, promote it to spectre. Spectres have a huge amount of health/armor/damage and have a spectre snipe that can insta kill most heroes.

Buy the infestor, burrow it, evolve to queenfestoer. Queenfester is faster, regens faster, can attack with high damage, and retains all the infestor's abilities plus a few more.

Buy a HT and a DT, morph them to Archon. The Archon has the highest health/sheilds/armor than any unit in the map, and it recieves twice the armor per upgrade.
Posts: 162
I think something should be done at the ability to mass merc marines (support tower calldown) inside an enemy base.



As somebody that has used this tactic many times, I can tell you that vs. a novice it is very effective. However vs. a more experience player your merc marines are usually dead before the capsules even open. Then you have bascially wasted 1000 min. and gave your opposition 100. Now in squad mode this is another story entirely. Dropping an additional 100 troops anywhere and adding them to your troops is a definate unfair advantage for the meer fact that you have 2x the number of troops in your arsenal. I think if you mess with the merc dropdown in classic that the function will become pointless. It makes people think twice about moving their whole base out and leaving it empty.



Posts: 1,166
I think something should be done at the ability to mass merc marines (support tower calldown) inside an enemy base.



As somebody that has used this tactic many times, I can tell you that vs. a novice it is very effective. However vs. a more experience player your merc marines are usually dead before the capsules even open. Then you have bascially wasted 1000 min. and gave your opposition 100. Now in squad mode this is another story entirely. Dropping an additional 100 troops anywhere and adding them to your troops is a definate unfair advantage for the meer fact that you have 2x the number of troops in your arsenal. I think if you mess with the merc dropdown in classic that the function will become pointless. It makes people think twice about moving their whole base out and leaving it empty.


Squad mode.. yeah this definately needs a fix. I think I'm going to remove this ability for squad mode. I never realized that people could abuse it in squad mode.
Posts: 689
There seems to be a bug where if I kill my partner's command center, I gain vision from all the Zel'Naga watchtowers for the rest of the game. I've done this twice so far.
Posts: 137
now why would you ever do that in the first place? :P

besides, thats because when someone dies, they have the option to watch (so they can see the middle) and since you guys share vision, you can see what he sees.
Edited by Wolf on 8/21/2010 12:50 PM PDT
Posts: 140
I do believe that the armor on defensive structures are bugged, good sir.
..unless it works in some strange and mystical fashion.
I have a replay if desired, wherein several stalker lances (each with upgrades to deal 11 damage, which is still ridiculous I believe, since it was only 3) entered my base, which was defended by three zerg spine crawlers. Said crawlers had 15 defense. (Or above the stalker damage. I'd need to rewatch the replay for specifics). the stalkers then proceeded to deal well over the damage that they should have been doing, which is 1. Now I think maybe some more testing is in order to completely determine this bug with accuracy, (and yes, I did look at the 'Armored' bonus- still less than 15.) but I think that either stalkers do more damage than is displayed, or the armor on structures doesn't have the desired effect.
Let me know if you want the replay.
Posts: 1,166
Hmm, well the armor should be working, but yeah the stalker base damage plus its armored damage might be why its doing that much damage per hit.
Posts: 140
Are the bonuses beneath the regular damage the total of the addition, or do you add those numbers to the damage itself?

Well, heres the replay I mentioned.

Ignore the dialog.
http://www.filefront.com/17222878/Marine Arena 0.9.9 (6).SC2Replay
Posts: 35
yeah it does add together. like if your unit does 20 and it says armored 40 then your unitdoes 60 damage to armor.
Posts: 1,510
Sorry for the double post, my computer was being difficult.
Edited by Trogdor on 8/21/2010 7:43 PM PDT
Posts: 1,510
I love this map but there are a few problems.
1) Banelings cost 25, which is far too much. They will never manage to kill over 25 minerals of units. A better price would be 5-10 (but not 0, because then they would be abused). Right now they are useless.
2) When your teammate leaves and you are left with his base, it stops spawning marines putting you at a disadvantage, can this be fixed?
3) Also when he leaves, I've found that teching up the units is extra costly. When you tech up with your CC, it only effects the merc compound that is attached to it and not both meaning that you have to spend double the resources on teching up your units and quickly fall behind. Is it supposed to be this way?
4) Can you put in a cap for how much you can tech up? Right now there is none so in the late game you can get units with 25 attack which is just ridiculous. I think a cap of 10 would be good.
5)Can you limit the number of units you can have in the normal mode? Also in the late game you can get armies which fill the entire base and tremendous lag in the battles. Instead of making it unlimited, cap it at something like 100-250 of each (mercs and marines).
Posts: 35
1) dont use them so i cant comment

2) i dont belive you are at a disadvantage cause you can still have them create mercs and you get double the income now.

3) Yeah cause you get double minerals now in case you havent noticed. so you get twice the amount of money and you should really be teching your partners stuff only double teching your stuff so they are a lot stronger and uber. to me it seems kind of broken if i can last to the 10 min mark by myself cause then i get so much minerals my marines get super charged and rip through things so much easier.

4) a cap of 10 would be way to easy to reach and it was like this in the early stages. it wasnt as fun after a while. especially since everyone will be on equal levels at some point and you wont be using your resources on stuff you want.

5)To me i like having so many troops because i would get as much money when my opponent does a full ahrdy rush into my super marine lines.
Posts: 1,166
I love this map but there are a few problems.
1) Banelings cost 25, which is far too much. They will never manage to kill over 25 minerals of units. A better price would be 5-10 (but not 0, because then they would be abused). Right now they are useless.
2) When your teammate leaves and you are left with his base, it stops spawning marines putting you at a disadvantage, can this be fixed?
3) Also when he leaves, I've found that teching up the units is extra costly. When you tech up with your CC, it only effects the merc compound that is attached to it and not both meaning that you have to spend double the resources on teching up your units and quickly fall behind. Is it supposed to be this way?
4) Can you put in a cap for how much you can tech up? Right now there is none so in the late game you can get units with 25 attack which is just ridiculous. I think a cap of 10 would be good.
5)Can you limit the number of units you can have in the normal mode? Also in the late game you can get armies which fill the entire base and tremendous lag in the battles. Instead of making it unlimited, cap it at something like 100-250 of each (mercs and marines).


1) Banelings are more for defense and end game offense. They annihilate buildings and are amazing defense units. Their costs were never meant to be covered, else everyone would just baneling bomb eachother all game like it was when I first added them. Using them to deal with turtling enemies at the end of the game is great, and using them to defend your base and flanks is also great.

2) Your spawning only works if the player == user, this is intentional. If your ally quits his spawning stops. You still gain his income and can use his left over units, but you dont spawn new marines.

3) This is an obvious answer, your upgrades cannot affect your ally's upgrades. Even if he left, the units arent actually owned by you, they're owned by him with you able to control them. You'll have to tech his upgrades if you want to tech his units.

4) I did originally have the caps at 10 per upgrade, but people didnt like this since some games the match would last so long that everyone had full upgrades and the games went no where since everyone was 100% equal.

5) This I might do.
Posts: 1,510
#5 was a big problem in the last game I played. 3 teams (i was on my own though since my partner left) survived and our armies got so big that the units started spawning next to the Xel'naga towers. I eventually got bored and decided to do a suicide rush so I could lose. The lag in any large clash, especially the last one, was so huge it was almost impossible to play. It was the only way for me to lose since there were just too many units for anyone to win or lose.
Posts: 35
why would you have so many units anyways? did you guys jsut sit in your bases all day?
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