StarCraft® II

A Clash of Kings (Continued)

Posts: 216
Well boys (and girls), we've reached the max # of posts for the Clash of Kings thread.

Good job!

I'll start the new/continued thread here, with a response to EllenPage's comment:

Army targeting isn't a huge deal and it's not going to go away. If your hero is being targeted (especially non-melee heroes) then you should be able to slam your hot-key and get your hero out of there. Because your hero is on a different key than your army, the rest of your army will shred the attacker's army while they try to get your hero that is running away.

This doesn't work perfectly, but army targeting isn't the end of the world.

As far as mass alliances, I agree that mass alliances can ruin games and make things lopsided. That being said, this is a diplomacy game and we should try to keep the options for diplomacy as open as possible. The same game mechanic that allows Lannister to make over powered alliances is the same one that lets me ally Lannister when I'm playing Tully so I can go to north to try to save Stark. It's a double edged sword, but better than no sword I guess.

Does anyone have thoughts on the new changes? I have a few:

1. Stark's longbow men hit hard now, and I like it. I almost lost Mallister to a group of them.
2. Same with archers. I actually had to retreat with my Tully hero ball from a large group.
3. My hero ball seemed a bit more vulnerable, but nothing to cry about. I always level up armor/hp first anyhow (except for Mallister, who gets energy/hp)

How has this impacted the Wilds? Have they seen an improvement from their better units?

My two games played yesterday suggested that the Wilds/Others did a little better. Granted, Stark and NW were noobs, but so was one of the Wilds. Usually new wilds can't even break an AFK wall haha.

What do you guys think?
Posts: 216
After playing a few more games, I def enjoy the new unit changes. Stannis players have been saying that their heroes are too weak, but they seem to have done well both times. Tully isn't changed much.
Posts: 57
Let JT make a new thread. Call it "A Song of Ice and Fire", since it is what the game is called now.
Posts: 66
Had an awesome game. Heroes where were they needed to be. It's not the same mindless easy mode now. Heroes CAN die, you just have to play smart.
Posts: 36
wall gets run through from wilding's without a house coming up now which doesn't seem intended, but a result of the hero nerf. also i like the army buff, but i feel with army buff stacked with the hero nerf. certain houses cannot keep up because they produce less units. (although ive only played a couple games so i may just need to adjust, but i like the way the game headed with this update.
Posts: 333
Yes unfortunately with the Hero nerf and army buff there will be several Houses taht will be weaker as a result, such as Greyjoy and Stannis. But when i made the game i knew there would be several Houses that would be very difficult to win as and i think that makes the game more fun for the veteran players who maybe want a challenge and a good test for their skills.

But as you all know it is diplomacy so any House can do well if they make the right alliances with other Houses.
Posts: 66
Greyjoy isn't too hard to win with. It's about picking your win condition properly. In fact I think greyjoy is more effective now than he was.

Stannis is now a real challenge, as he ought to be.
Posts: 36
greyjoy does seem more effective, its probably because they always had a strong army and now they even stronger? plus they still have the stun and plasma blast which can follow peeps for miles.
Posts: 216
I don't think that Stannis is weaker as a result of this. At least in my experience, Stannis has done pretty well over this last weekend (looking at you Dinobear!).

The hero nerf is great, makes things a bit more exciting.

I tried Renly the other day and allied Tully so I could find the new heroes. Lannister was somewhat of a noob, so it wasn't a good test, but Renly seemed more complete with the new heroes. On that point, I don't believe that Thoros (or the other one) can hold weapons/armor.

Note: the burning pitch still doesn't work on the wall.
Posts: 33
Beric is able to use items, while the rest of the new heros can't (Thoros, Harrold, and Bolton). Asha and Damphair still can't get attack speed and Wilds can still donate medics, observers, and archers to a dead NW spawn.
Edited by Skoton on 4/2/2012 3:07 PM PDT
Posts: 66
I'm not totally familiar with all the triggers but in the past I was able to hire golden company with 2k minerals and an observer. This did not work the last time I played. Nobody was able to hire them all game. any thoughts?
Posts: 216
Speaking of possible trigger confusion: A few games back, as Tully (obviously), I was able to win a game despite having lost one of my Twins (damn Wildlings always get mah Twinz!!1).

Edmure was alive, Lannister was off the throne, and The Mountain was dead. I'm unsure if Robb was alive, but I don't believe he was.
Posts: 333
Golden Company costs 8k to hire as it says on the beacon

Robb only needs to be alive if Edmure is dead and the trigger shows as the Twins needing to be controlled by Tully, but if its dead that may cause some win trigger confusion
Posts: 216
Interesting, thanks for the clarification. It would certainly explain why I won.
Posts: 43
I've just discovered the game a few days ago, and am loving it. It's been interesting trying to learn all the different wincons. However, I have run into a problem

for NW and Renly, I cannot get the "How to win" tip to show up. This isn't a big deal as Night Watch, as it was fairly easy to figure out what his wincon was(stop the wildlings, if I'm not mistaken). But I have no idea what to do when I'm Renly.

The "How to win" tooltip icon shows up on the right along with the rest of the tooltips, but it doesn't show up on the tips screen.
Posts: 333
Ill look at the Tips, but Renly only wins if he can take and hold King's Landing

Also im beginning work on another asoiaf map set during Robert's Rebellion. I have alot of good ideas for the map, but the reason i mention it is that i need a person to help me with fact finding and lore from that time period as i dont have as much time as i used to, so if youre interested in helping, let me know.
Edited by JTaylor on 4/4/2012 1:48 PM PDT
Posts: 66
Since the score board was put in, I've noticed there has been a lot more attention paid to win conditions. As a personal judgment, I think it's cool we see people playing as intended a lot more.

However, there is a side effect that I never saw before the scoreboard. People making impromptu alliances with the others. In which said kingdom backstabs the nights watch or simply takes out a layer of the nights watch's defense to guarantee the others break through. The alliance comes into play when the others effectively become a super powered forced to attack people for said kingdom. What is common is, the others attack someone for the backstabber while the backstabber just sits in kings landing, insulated and un-harassed for 20 minutes. Typically the others kill off a portion of the backstabber's biggest opponent's city and then largely sits around waiting out the timer while the former biggest opponent can no longer muster a massive army because the others destroyed the cities they needed to do so.

It's my understanding the wildlings/others can't win without taking Kings Landing and breaking the wall. And obviously it hurts the game when people aren't playing to win but to ensure everyone loses.

My proposal. Some kind of penalty to the others for sitting around doing nothing during the end of game countdown. If they're consistently doing battle, they suffer no penalty. If they stand around or occasionally do stuff, they suffer the penalty. Not applicable north of the wall but certainly applicable south of the wall. An incentive to keep being "other-esque" and advancing the horde of undead against the living.

Absent some penalty, there would be no way for a battered kingdom to fight through the others and then the backstabber. In one way or another, it promotes some sort of inevitable conclusion. Either the others overwhelm the remainder of the opposition kingdoms or they hang out, and get weak and those kingdoms have at least some sort of chance to undo the lame tactic of "allying" the others.
Posts: 57
The Others can win if they just break the Wall.

The option to destroy KL is for when you're feeling a bit... mischievous.
Posts: 333
Im just going to make it so that the NW is perma allied to all other factions other than the Wildlings since people are exploiting
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