StarCraft® II

Will Oracle put Protoss at a Disadvantage?

Posts: 406

It's as fast as a Muta, it will take more effort to kill than that.

I'm aware of the speed but if you meet it halfway you most likely can deter it before reaching it's target. If it's going to ignore the the patrol unit just reroute some air units to ambush it in between with it's weak stats it won't last long.

Economic damage is lasting damage.


Hardly it's comparable to taking your works off the line for a few seconds. The loss of workers is considerably more devastating because not only are the works taken off the line but you also have to spend extra resources to make new workers. Not to mention spend time rebuilding them this all adds up and is way more effective than a momentary halt of harvesting.
Edited by VonFoxFire on 6/12/2012 8:20 PM PDT
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Actually, something that I just realized is that:

Since an Oracle doesn't kill anything when using Entomb, using it on expansions with no units/structures nearby ready to shoot at the "bubbles" would not trigger any alert...
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I'm aware of the speed but if you meet it halfway you most likely can deter it before reaching it's target. If it's going to ignore the the patrol unit just reroute some air units to ambush it in between with it's weak stats it won't last long.

But I did say it would require more effort than just 1 patroling muta or corruptor. So now you've got to have a bunch of units hunting down the equivalent of 2 mutalisks...

Hardly it's comparable to taking your works off the line for a few seconds. The loss of workers is considerably more devastating because not only are the works taken off the line but you also have to spend extra resources to make new workers.

But unless your opponent builds tons of Mutalisks, just a few static defense will completely stop harass. A few static defensive buildings won't stop Oracle harass, it will just reduce the amount of time you can't mine. You will still have to pay attention to when it happens so you don't have workers standing around doing nothing.

Protoss used to complain about having no harassment methods that weren't high risk. Now they have a low risk, low reward harassment method... and some of them are still unhappy with that. wtf?
Edited by Fawxkitteh on 6/12/2012 8:48 PM PDT
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But I did say it would require more effort than just 1 patroling muta or corruptor. So now you've got to have a bunch of units hunting down the equivalent of 2 mutalisks...

True enough but I said it probably would deter further raiding not necessarily that it would.^_~ A toss player may assume that since there's one mutalisk there's probably more at the enemy players disposal and since the enemy player already know he's coming it may not be worth the risk to send the oracle in.


But unless your opponent builds tons of Mutalisks, just a few static defense will completely stop harass. A few static defensive buildings won't stop Oracle harass, it will just reduce the amount of time you can't mine. You will still have to pay attention to when it happens so you don't have workers standing around doing nothing.

Yes but the point I'm trying to make is the harass isn't as damaging as the loss of workers which I feel is going to cost the toss player more than it would if the toss player was doing actual damage. Which is why I feel it will be a poor economy raider. Well unless they increase the HP of the entomb shields or entomb depletes some of the minerals when cast on them. Then I could see it being useful.


Protoss used to complain about having no harassment methods that weren't high risk. Now they have a low risk, low reward harassment method... and some of them are still unhappy with that. wtf?

Seriously?!? You're going to lump the opinions of some protoss players as a consensus of all protoss players...then complain that not all protoss players think alike.>.>
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Seriously?!? You're going to lump the opinions of some protoss players as a consensus of all protoss players...then complain that not all protoss players think alike.>.>

No, I'm just saying I don't understand the people who don't think Protoss's new stuff is good.
I've seen people complain about the Swarm Host too, and I just don't get it.
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No, I'm just saying I don't understand the people who don't think Protoss's new stuff is good.
I've seen people complain about the Swarm Host too, and I just don't get it.


I believe all the protoss units have potential but they'll need some tweaking before they truly shine well except maybe the mothership core it seems fine as is. Though I really wish they'd fix up the oracle model. It was originally designed to be a machine but now it has a pilot and no place to put her unless the Oracle is huuuuggeee. That and it doesn't really look like a starship. Which is a shame because the pilot model is awesome.
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how can you claim the oracle won't be able to do economic damage when it can block mineral patches? the fields are like neutral supply depots, you have to manually attack them as NONE of your units will recognize it as an enemy structure. Not only that, but there is ZERO indication that this is happening on your map, there is no ping on your minimap that your workers are being attacked because they AREN'T, that's the big plus of this, is that you have to pay attention extremely hard to your income to notice this kind of thing.

phase shift will allow the oracle some amazing timing attacks from protoss. Can you imagine? MC opening with a stargate, going void ray with 2 phoenix and an oracle with gate way units? The void rays kill everything on the ground, the phoenix lift the queens and the oracles shut down the spore/spine crawlers, and the gateway units clean up shop. I think the oracle will be a sick unit that needs to be fully explored and that won't happen until we start to see pros mess with the game.
Actually your wrong only your workers won't auto attack it siince they won't ever auto attack enemy things, like your scouting worker won't just randomly attack the enemies workers when you haven't told him to do something. But units and defensive structures will auto attack the shields. Also it's not that hard to notice that one base worth of minerals isnt being added to your money, for Zerg that's a third of normal and Terran a half. So you will know its there and be able to kill the shields and then leave a few in the min line as they'll auto attack them for you. When I was in gold I would notice I didn't have enough gas if I had only 5 instead of 6 workers on gas, because you feel slower than usual and you can't afford things you usually could and that's only missing 1/6 of te income so you'll notice if half of it disappears.
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I think all the new units look awesome and I can't wait to see which new strategies come in too play although the tempest will probably be changed because it costs 300/300 and with an attack cooldown of 6 can't even one shot a marine. I'm guessing it'll lose some range and get a bit cheaper with a slightly faster attack.

But the game is still in alpha so any thoughts or concern is just blind theory crafting, and a lot of what we see will get changed so its pointless to argue over balance.
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06/13/2012 11:36 PMPosted by StolenGunner
Also it's not that hard to notice that one base worth of minerals isnt being added to your money, for Zerg that's a third of normal and Terran a half. So you will know its there and be able to kill the shields and then leave a few in the min line as they'll auto attack them for you.


One might add to that if you look closely to the replay entomb seems to also shows up on the mini map. Granted no warning but all you have to do is glance down.
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your forgetting how much minerals are prevented by your harass, aside from having a ridiculously fast scout the oracle was also given a cloaking field which makes stargate tech just as viable as the old standard robotics at least vs zergs as you can shoot down their overseers easily seeing as you went air tech.
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06/21/2012 10:19 PMPosted by kavinh
your forgetting how much minerals are prevented by your harass, aside from having a ridiculously fast scout the oracle was also given a cloaking field which makes stargate tech just as viable as the old standard robotics at least vs zergs as you can shoot down their overseers easily seeing as you went air tech.


I'm not sure if you're addressing me or speaking in general to everyone in the thread but I'll assume it was to me. No I'm not forgetting the prevented minerals what I'm saying is that it's the equivalent of a failed raid and that will probably make the oracle a poor raider in comparison to other raiders. Lets look at what happens when a raid goes wrong. The workers are pulled off the lines to save them and the opposing raiders are either forced to leave or destroyed only doing minimum economy damage before harvesting is back up and running again. For all intents and purposes this is exactly what the Oracle does a failed raid which I feel makes it a weak raider.
Moving on to the part about the Oracle's cloak as I already stated previously , in a support role I feel the oracle will be good I just have doubts to it's effectiveness as an economy raider which is a completely different use of the Oracle.
Edited by VonFoxFire on 6/22/2012 2:15 AM PDT
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Well Stargate play should probably be improved.

Perhaps if a Fleet Beacon allowed Stargates to start acting like Warpgates.


I love this guy
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Oracle isn't totally useless in middle game, it makes a sturdy defence unit. Having an entire protoss wall turn invisible simultaneously is an impresive defensive feat, so if the protoss are facing a huge army invasion by land and have to bunker down and wall in, what better thing to have around than a portable invisibility cloak.

Sure, it does not fulfill it's purpose of "harassment unit", but it makes a good replacement for the mothership core, which cannot even move!
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The people here say otherwise.

http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/5760136464
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man, avalon is a special creature, how can anyone think the oracle being a useless unit now. It must be the same people who preciously micro there one stalker and lose 1,000 gold worth in macro during the process. Not understanding why they are stuck in the silver league.
Edited by Loomdun on 6/27/2012 4:05 AM PDT
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Posts: 275
Are people still necromancing this thread?

This thread is about the Oracle from the BlizzCon'11 Demo, not the new 2012 MLG Update. Everything for the Protoss has changed now, including the Oracle I was original bagging on. Plese dont insult me or my "playing skill" based on my own opinions made about a unit that doesnt exist anymore. Just makes you look more like a fool.

My opinion on the Oracle has changed since this original post, hint why I havent replied to anything until now on this thread. My Issues with it have turned into other problems that dont necessarily make it OP or UP, but the Entomb ability still functions in a way I dont want, especially in PvP matchups and Timing Attacks. I also think the Cloaking Field goes against everything Blizzard said about the original Orcale in that it would not be given abilities to use in your "Deathball", which is now proven incorrect as the Cloaking Field it generates is directly a unit you use in your Deathball for Early game Harassment and Timing Attacks. Its absolutely a deathball unit now, but with a different approach.

Oracle still needs work, but its for different reasons.
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Oracle won't put Protoss at a disadvantage, because it stops your opponent from leaving his base as long as the Oracle is around. During that time you can try to catch up in tech and macro. But the main problem I have with Oracle is that you can pull off the maximum effectiveness of Entomb relatively easily. All you need to do is just press one button and target the mineral patch. To me, that is just downright boring. I think Blizzard might wanna actually cut Entomb, because there are other ways you can use Oracles to harass. Like for example you can combine the usual Phase Prism drop with Oracle, and then Oracle use AoE invis aura to hide all the units that come out of phase prism. It would be kind of like a mass DT drop.
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06/27/2012 10:47 AMPosted by dullSword
the main problem I have with Oracle is that you can pull off the maximum effectiveness of Entomb relatively easily.
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Oracle won't put Protoss at a disadvantage, because it stops your opponent from leaving his base as long as the Oracle is around.


No it doesnt lmao. You only need like 2 marines to kill the bubbles.
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06/27/2012 11:37 PMPosted by Khobai
Oracle won't put Protoss at a disadvantage, because it stops your opponent from leaving his base as long as the Oracle is around.

No it doesnt lmao. You only need like 2 marines to kill the bubbles.

Yeah, Marines do have quite high dps for their cost, Zerglings do too, but they block more drones from attacking, while marines don't.
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