StarCraft® II

Why make colossus?(PvZ)

Posts: 677
(this excludes the zerg building hydras)
like the title says whats the point of making colossus in PvZ? The only thing they seem to counter is hydra and zergling and for what they cost it seems like HT make a much better choice no matter what the zerg is building. (besides hydras)

No mater what zerg is at one point in the game going to make a spire so you know they will have muta (HTs counter, colossus cant attack air) or Corrupter (destroys colossus, storm does ok damage to them).

For anti ling storm does way more damage and has a much larger AoE then the colossus attack and you can morph them into archons when out of energy witch also are strong vs ling and roach.

Im just not seeing why you would want to make colossus over HTs in PvZ. Though Im silver and a noob so if im wrong I would love for someone to explain it to me. :)
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Posts: 594
Collosi wreck roaches when you get about 3 of them with good FF. HT's can be a good option, but in the current metagame of 3 base mass roach you're better off going collosi, as storm won't necessarily kill roaches very quickly.

*Is that a "Phantom Tollbooth" reference?
Edited by Neo on 7/14/2012 8:01 PM PDT
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Posts: 16,727
07/14/2012 08:01 PMPosted by Neo
*Is that a "Phantom Tollbooth" reference?


Oh jesus that book was...wierd. I still don't know if I like it or hate it. It's just...wierd.
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Posts: 8,144
What else are you going to make? Colossi are the only dps unit protoss has for the midgame. High Templar/Archons/Mothership can work in the late game but it takes a while to get all that going.
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Posts: 176
3 base mass roach is hard to beat with just HT and storm. The colossus actually does more damage overall.

Especially since you can get immortals if you go for Robo tech. Archons are just too slow against roaches.
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Posts: 1,775
storm is mediocre against roaches, archons and zealots are pretty bad against them en masse. you're best off with robo (or air if that's what you're comfortable with) if your opponent goes heavy roach, which probably the majority of zergs do.

i usually just crank out immortal/stalker/sentry if i'm getting hammered by roaches, add maybe 2-3 colossi after that in case they go into hydra or ling, and then push out. zerg can't really kill colossi efficiently without air, and if they overbuild air you stomp them with stalker warpins and the remaining immortals
Edited by Laconic on 7/14/2012 11:55 PM PDT
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Posts: 750
Think of it this way. Yes, you will get Immortals against Roaches, but you will never be able to field enough of them to take on 200/200 Roach balls without some supporting fire. This is where the Colossus comes in. Plus, Zergs will almost always have Zerglings to serve as cannon fodder, which will just absolutely melt to Colossi (and HTs, if you have any).
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Posts: 167
in PvZ I always start with a fast stargate and make a small fleet of phoenix since zerg's main source of production can be killed with a lift and their supply depots fly and cannot attack. I always make a robo as my second tech because void rays don't do enough dps to roaches to hold a third. You need a few immortals. During this mid game phase I often lay a second forge and get a TC to prepare my next upgrades. While my TC is being made I make a robo bay for colossus and if I didn't I wouldn't have splash in time for the big impending attacks with maxed armies. So in short, you can't get HT as first splash because when you play against people that know how to manage their economy efficiently, you don't have the time without exposing a weakness that most likely will be taken advantage of by an aggressive player.

If they aren't going to be aggressive, I will know because of my phoenix and I may speed things up and cut corners to tech up faster but in that case I'm doing it for a reason. I think that might be the real key to getting good at this game and at strategy games, doing things for reasons.
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Posts: 677
Ok this is informative, thanks for explaining it to me :)
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Posts: 318
both high templar and colossi are less than ideal vs 3 base roach. You need 5 colossi to 1 shot roaches, which isn't something reasonable to have at 12-13 minutes

colossi are basically only good against infestor tech in pvz, or on the rare occasion your opponent decides to go hydra or something.
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Posts: 392
I've been going colossi a fair bit PVZ lately since Stephano started using a mass Hydra / Roach meta in ZvT. I now find many Zerg i've been playing are blindly going Hydra/roach tech. I prefer to Sentry immortal as Colossus are more versatile than immortals being mainly good vs roaches and of course the required micro is less. Also obviously go blink stalkers for corrupter / broods, or more zealots if more lings.

Colossus are great vs lings, hydras, infestor, decent vs roach etc - whereas immortals are mainly good vs roach, crawers. I also find there is the tunnel vision factor with Colossi, opponents often focus fire above all else especially with roaches and meanwhile they're getting smashed by gateway units. This is in gold league anyway
Edited by Wired on 1/6/2013 8:13 PM PST
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Posts: 3
Start going colossus and any good zerg will just mass mutas and kill you. Zerg don't even need to try PVZ.

I literally went Zerg for a few games and was able to play at the level I'm at with protoss. This is so wrong I can't even describe it.
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Posting in a zombie thread.
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Posts: 593
I usually go with Gateway/Immortal until I'm comfortable economically to start producing Colossus if there are no Hydra. However, I do want to say that I will have my Robobay done and Extended Thermal Lance done even if I haven't produced Colossi. Basically, once I know my opponent is pumping out more Infestors and Roaches, I switch to Gateway/Immortal/Colossi. However, Colossus are very investment-heavy, even if they are standard, so I tend to scout first and make sure the Zerg player isn't going for Mutalisks which can end the game for you if you've invested too heavily in Colossus (since minerals and gas will be diverted from Stalkers).
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Posts: 158
2 or 3 Colossus make taking your third much safer, with a good simcity, as the roaches will just eat laser beams.

Once the 3rd is up, you transition into other tech to prepare for wInfestor GGlord Corruptor, keeping a few colossi around to take care of Infested terrans and broodlings. In end game PvZ if you last that long, you can swap out colossi for other splash AOE damage.
Edited by Grimmy on 1/7/2013 10:04 PM PST
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Posts: 6,821
2 or 3 Colossus make taking your third much safer, with a good simcity, as the roaches will just eat laser beams.

Once the 3rd is up, you transition into other tech to prepare for wInfestor GGlord Corruptor, keeping a few colossi around to take care of Infested terrans and broodlings. In end game PvZ if you last that long, you can swap out colossi for other splash AOE damage.


You can take your third easy with the Doubtle Immortal/Sentry expand....
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Posts: 3,293
07/14/2012 11:54 PMPosted by Laconic
storm is mediocre against roaches


that. roaches are fatter and tougher than terran bio, and they remax faster. you want consistent dps units that don't run out of energy.
Edited by Dryhumper on 1/8/2013 9:37 PM PST
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Posts: 158
2 or 3 Colossus make taking your third much safer, with a good simcity, as the roaches will just eat laser beams.

Once the 3rd is up, you transition into other tech to prepare for wInfestor GGlord Corruptor, keeping a few colossi around to take care of Infested terrans and broodlings. In end game PvZ if you last that long, you can swap out colossi for other splash AOE damage.


You can take your third easy with the Doubtle Immortal/Sentry expand....


True, and depending on the situation, the colossi are also useful later, and really deny a roach attack well. Immortal sentry eventually can be worn down, so getting collosus sooner than later is good.
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Posts: 16,780
01/07/2013 10:04 PMPosted by Grimmy
Once the 3rd is up, you transition into other tech to prepare for wInfestor GGlord Corruptor,
Against new-school 14 min Broodlords after ling infestor + corruptor (Leenock style), I think you will have a lot of trouble transitioning out of Colossi. It is better to get your "other tech" sooner and use Forcefields, cannons, and/or VR + zealot/Templar or Zealot/Archon, or Blink/Immortal/Sentry followed by a timing pre-broodlord.
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