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11/09/2012 09:30 PMPosted by GameOfDrones

We saw this same trend when protoss was considered overpowered for an 8+ month stretch. You know what blizzard did to change it? Nothing. They did the same thing they're doing now, waiting and seeing. And sure enough, very few reasonable people consider protoss overpowered now.

Really? Best I can find is 7/10 protoss advancing.

And when you bring in maths (gasp!) you find that statistically having at least 7/10 advance is a 34% chance if every game was random, over 5 seasons there's an 85% chance of that happening. So that's not really unexpected. Having 8/9 advance? Less than a 4% chance.

Why are people even bothering to waste their time to argue with OP?

In case you hadn't noticed, not once has he pulled out numbers (besides this 8/16 thing). Instead, his argument boils down to "LOOK AT THE COLORS HURR DURRRRRRRRRRRR"

11/09/2012 03:42 PMPosted by Nensura

stop complaining L2P ty

did you say something? didn't know diamonds knew how to play the game.

Currently sc2 is going through a phase where its either going to make or break this game, the devs attention is on HoTS and money where as the community wants change.

If they dont deliver their game will be ruined, if they do, well then that makes a happy player base and spectator base which will benefit the game drastically.

My advise is dont watch or play this game anymore until they nerf infestors, until then, keep posting your frustrations as the power of numbers is greater than how much money one has in their pocket (Blizzard).

Almost all of your arguments on these matter contain only the most raw, unanalyzed data, unsubstantiated claim on game's potential demise, and some sort of delusion of grandeur thinking that you represent the will of the community.

Nobody really wants your advise.

What's wrong with GOMTvT?

zerg are in denial, but again if my race was op i will be in denial too

So how many Zerg threads does this make?

see, swarm, the thing is, your EVIDENCE doesnt support you. if you look at the tournaments in the last 3 months it supports what ive been saying. saying they're facts doesnt make them true. go to the liquipedia page and look at allllll the red there. most of those tournaments are littered with zerg dominations. the GM ladder on the KR server is ridiculous. it's rife with zerg. actually, i made no assertion for protoss at all. in fact, terran is the most underrepresented race in most tournaments right now. are you BLIND????? liquipedia doesnt support you....AT ALL.....stop saying you made factual claims....
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Minor_Tournaments....what color do you see?
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Major_Tournaments....take a look at all the tournaments i mentioned previously....
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Premier_Tournaments....what finals do you see most of since August?
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Monthly_Tournaments....tell me what you see here?
JUST STOP...

Nice job posting partial links. You're probably not used to providing proof since most of what you say is out of your !@#.

First off, I don't really care for Minor tournaments since the majority of the players are either unknown or they are known but are competing against lesser players.

Minor Tournaments

-Scan Invitational #6

I think SortOf finished higher than what he should of. JohhnyRecco is a much better Zerg imo, he was tied for 5th place in TSL4. He is a much better player than Babyknight. Lucifron is a great Terran, considering he beat Stephano 4-1 in the "Stim to win" tournament. I would think it's safe to assume that Lucifron played poorly.

-AGL August Invitational

TSL.HyuN beats ROOTod 4-0. I mean is that really a surprise?

-Battle at Ministry of Win: get outPlayed

Nerchio takes out Sage 3-1. Nerchio is considered to be the best foreign Zerg behind Stephano. I would consider this win justified, since Sage's only accomplishment was all-killing fOu back on July 2011.

-Samsung European Encounter

Nerchio defeats Demuslim 2-0
Okay, so here is the first somewhat Zerg heavy tournament. I will admit Nerchio had a much easier road in the tournament than Demuslim. But Nerchio is by far a stronger player than DeMu.

Major Tournaments

-IEF 2012

SaSe defeats TooDming 2-1
I have no idea who anyone in this tournament is except for SaSe. I'd say it was a well deserved win for the Protoss race.

-World e-Sports Masters 2012

Leenock defeats JYP 3-0
I think you have to respect a Code: S player, and I think it's nice that JYP, a somewhat unknown, Protoss player made it all the way to the finals in this tournament.

-ASUS ROG The GD Invitational

ThorZaiN defeats Elfi 3-2
OMG a Zerg didn't win? WTF RAGEEEEEEEE. JK. Nice TvP Finals

-IeSF 2012 World Championship

Monchi defeats NightEnD 3-1. Top 4 was all Protoss in this tournament. And Sen gets beaten by Verdi? HUGE UPSET.

-2012 MLG vs Proleague Invitational

SKT1_SoO defeats fnatic.Oz 4-2
I don't know too much about SoO other than hes a Kespa player, and is on the same team as Rain. So i'm sure he gets great practice against Protoss.

-EPS Belin Open

MouzHasuobs a Protoss defeats Slivko a Zerg 3-1
Same Zerg that dominated White-ra, falling to a Protoss. Maybe White-ra's QQ is a sign that hes getting old, and should retire?

Premier Events
-2012 MLG Fall Championship(Dallas)

Life defeats Leenock 4-3
Here is the 2nd ZvZ that I've covered so far. 2 TvZ's in the Semi-finals, and due to poor play on the Terrans part, both Code: S Zergs advance. Which is not surprising since they are Code: S.

-Electronic Sports World Cup 2012

MaNa defeats ForGG 2-0
A PvT finals. With 2 Protoss, a Terran, and a Zerg(Stephano) in the Semi-Finals

-2012 DreamHack Open: Bucharest

Nerchio defeats Bly 3-0

The 3rd ZvZ finals in the games I've covered.

-2012 StarCraft II World Championship Series: Asia Finals

Rain defeats Parting 2-0

HUGE Protoss representation in this tournament. If you think Protoss is under-represented look at this tournament. Top 4 all Protoss

-2012 DreamHack Open: Valencia

Taeja defeats ForGG 3-2
3 Terrans and 1 Zerg in the Semi-finals

-2012 StarCraft II World Championship Series: Europe Finals

Stephano defeats VortiX 3-2
The 4th ZvZ finals that I've covered.

So in the tournaments(Sept'12-Nov'12) with Notable players the tournament representation looks like this,

Protoss- 5 wins
Terran- 3 wins
Zerg- 8 wins

Terran overall has less tournament wins, but for a few reasons.
A lot of the top Terrans Marineking, ByuN, SuperNova, TOP, jjakji, Virus, I can name more, don't actively play in tournaments. Whereas Protoss and Zerg players do.

Oh and out of the 16 tournaments 4 were ZvZ's. That doesn't seem like a Zerg fest to me.

great effort...you STILL dont get what i said.....i didnt just say finals....i said top brackets of tournaments.....go back and count again the amount of zvz in quarters and up.....

I said "considered overpowered" - I've always argued that it was balanced.

But there was a good 8 month stretch where people were crying toss imba - either you weren't here then, or you're mis-remembering history for your own benefit. Part of the way through, they announced the battlehellion to combat chargelots, and from the way the forum exploded you'd think that chargelots were the be-all end-all unit against terran.

I don't understand why you keep bringing this up. Statistically Protoss did the worse by far in tourneys, ladders in 2011, and begginning of 2012 didn't really change that at all. The QQ was supported by nothing. Idra one of the "best zerg players" said that Protoss was overpowered when protoss was last place in every category. Zerg's are dominating on all angles, Protoss were not. You really have to stop mentioning people QQ about the race because it is completely irrelevant, espeicially with statistics are showing Zerg dominance in several tourneys(Recent I will give you that around 3 months span) and ladder dominance. Protoss was QQ when they were in last place, So ironic because they were being complained about when they were losing everything.

Nerf hydralisk and ultralisk . Problem solved.

Man all the Zerg QQ threads are funny these kids actualy think blizzard cares about a bunch of Whitney babies. Game is balenced at a professional level the best of the best get as good as skt rain or liquid teajea. Then you can argue balence everyone else should relax enjoy the game and no one cares about your sc2 rank loss bot and dumpster some noobs you will feel much better.

Of course there are exceptions. It's just that in general we are seeing zerg make it to the later rounds of the tournament disproportionally more than similar level terrans. Also, we also see more zerg's qualifying for tournaments.

So you consider Flash(Code A) and Bomber(Code B) to be on the same level as Life(Code S) and Leenock(Code S)?

Yes they are on the same level if not better. Because zerg is !@#$in.g op.

i just did the math on the round of 32 35 zerg wins only 15 zerg losses. better then 2 to 1. not saying it has any bearing on balance at all. just that wow zerg kicked butt!

TIME TO TURN IT UP A NOTCH CODE S TERRANS,
WE MUST BE SWIFT AS A COURSING RIVER:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSS5dEeMX64

Let's get down to business
To defeat the Huns
Did they send me daughters
When I asked for sons?
You're the saddest bunch
I ever met
But you can bet
Before we're through
Mister, I'll make a man
out of you

Tranquil as a forest
But on fire within
Once you find your center
you are sure to win
You're a spineless, pale
pathetic lot
And you haven't got a clue
Somehow I'll make a man
out of you

I'm never gonna catch
my breath
Say good-bye to those
who knew me
Boy, was I a fool in school
for cutting gym
This guy's got 'em
scared to death
Hope he doesn't see
right through me
Now I really wish that I
knew how to swim

(Be a man)
We must be swift as
the coursing river
(Be a man)
With all the force
of a great typhoon
(Be a man)
With all the strength
of a raging fire
Mysterious as the
dark side of the moon

Time is racing toward us
till the Huns arrive
Heed my every order
and you might survive
You're unsuited for
the rage of war
So pack up, go home
you're through
How could I make a man
out of you?

(Be a man)
We must be swift as
the coursing river
(Be a man)
With all the force
of a great typhoon
(Be a man)
With all the strength
of a raging fire
Mysterious as the
dark side of the moon

(Be a man)
We must be swift as
the Coursing river
(Be a man)
With all the force
of a great typhoon
(Be a man)
With all the strength
of a raging fire
Mysterious as the
dark side of the moon

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try to find the mulan i'll make a man out of you lyrics on TL
u wont

Hey, a GOMTvT is better then watching Zerg pros. (except for Idra)

code festor

I am very happy about CODE Z. Zerg will win the GSL and the WCS finals. This will be the nail in the coffin for the ZERG/WinFestor. I cant wait. Its gonna be glorious. Zergs will have to learn how to play. Not like now FUNGALFAUNGALFUNGAL WIWIIWIIWIWIWNNNNN. I am so good did you see that mannnnnnn, FUNGAL awwww I am so gooddddd. No you are s hit.

11/09/2012 03:46 PMPosted by RageQuit

ZSL Code S

you mean its the GZL Code S

you mean GZL Code Z

9 protoss in >>> 2 out
14 Terran in >>> 6 out
9 zerg in >>> 8 out

1 zerg doesnt make it to Ro16. 1!!!

So, let me get this straight. In Ro16 there is:

8 zerg
6 terran
2 protoss

And somehow that makes zerg ridic[sic]? (The word is "ridiculous" by the way).

You're NEVER going to get an even 3-way split in the Ro16. 3 Doesn't go into 16. There's always going to be a discrepancy. I guess in a perfect world you'd have one race with 6 and the other two with 5, but the reality is it never works like that (and even of it did, someone would be crying OP about the race that managed 6). Having 8 zerg and 6 terrans looks pretty reasonable actually. Protoss looks to be under-represented, but we'll see who makes it to the Ro8.

if you look at it in-terms of % pass through rate.

6/14 ~ 43% of Terrans that entered went through.
2/9 ~ 22% of Protoss that entered went through
8/9 ~ 89% of Zerg that entered went through.

There are a lot of factors that can affect this, but honestly we should see all of the number closer to 50%. Seeing P at 22 and Z at 89 could mean a couple of things.

1) The game isn't balanced
2) player skill isn't balanced
3) Blind stupid luck?

no really though, that's about all the could really be affecting these %'s.