StarCraft® II

No Offracing Allowed

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Posts: 22,921
This is my biggest complaint about the online multiplayer experience of SC2 for "competitive" players, like myself. If you wish to offrace and aren't an absolute whiz, you have three limited and unattractive options:

1. Tank your MMR, either intentionally or naturally and painfully.

2. Get another battle.net account.

3. Play custom 1v1s against friends or opponents you hunt down.

Options one and two do not work for me. My Protoss is way better than my Terran, and my Terran is way better than my Zerg. I would like to play all three races vs equally skilled opponents at any time. (Note: Playing random doesn't technically accomplish this either, because you'll still likely be better with one race than the other two.)

The only way I could do that now is to spend $100 or so, get two more e-mails, and make two more accounts. Not an option. I live paycheck to paycheck and use my limited extra money to buy gifts for children and relatives and a little on myself. Plus, this should not be expected of an owner of Starcraft 2.

Tanking my ranking is painful, time consuming, and leads to a string of very lousy matches. And the moment I want to play my main race, I'm crushing my poor opponent, indirectly "smurfing" him. Not cool either.

My fellow gamers, I believe if Starcraft's design team can find a way for us to offrace at any time, against equally skilled opponents, on a single account, it would greatly boost the success of this game as well as our enjoyment of it as a community. Please give a +1 if you like it as well as any feedback you'd want to give to me or anyone else who reads this.

(Posted in General and Beta for widespread feedback.)

11/01/2012 03:27 PMPosted by WhyLater
Won't the Unranked matchmaking pretty much accomplish this?

Putting this in the OP due to its relevance. Yes, if unranked has a separate MMR (and I'm not sure that it does), it gives us the option to play one offrace, unranked, but only unranked and only for one other race. Pretty lackluster.

11/01/2012 03:30 PMPosted by ProdofVoid
Quit caring about rank, have fun.

I don't care about rank. I care about having equally skilled opponents.

11/01/2012 03:41 PMPosted by TheSkunk
When you initially play a ranked or unranked game, it creates a base MMR off of whichever one was created first, both they both change independent of each other.

If that's true, then you're still only allowed ONE offrace, and you're not allowed to play ranked with it. Not good enough. I have no desire to play unranked matches, and I know there's many out there who feel the same.

posted by ProdofVoid
I am all for the idea of separate ladder per races *if*, all races can only be 2 leagues apart max.

Agreed. That would cut down on potential abuses. Good point!

posted by Geechee
How much of Battle.net's servers goes into calculating MMR, performing match-making, storing that information, etc? I could see how Blizzard would be hesitant to make this change if it would be prohibitively expensive/complicated to suddenly increase the volume of that information by a factor of three.

Only for 1v1. It shouldn't be a problem, considering every single premade team has its own MMR.

11/02/2012 09:07 AMPosted by Crushface
Offrace in 2v2 3v3 4v4?

My response? Why are we allowed to offrace in team games but not 1v1, which most people consider to be the most important aspect of the game?

posted by Flare
Would it be fair for people who paid money for smurfs?

Wouldn't Blizzard rather people buy multiple accounts?

If you really enjoy the game, then the $40 isn't that much for the time and satisfaction you get. Starcraft 2 really does replace other games (or hobbies) you would end up spending much more money for smaller amount of time they provide, so with that perspective the $40 is very little in the end. Although upgrading multiple smurfs could be quite painful when HotS comes out. It would be cool to have a discount for people who own 1 account to buy another, but that goes back to the first and second question.

I felt Flare's argument deserved to be directly addressed by me. I will answer with two counter-points.

1. Buying multiple accounts is counter-intuitive to the new Leveling system. This system is encouraging offracing on one account, but the MMR system discourages offracing one one account, even with unranked as it currently is (as I've already explained). The new system wants you to put all your stats onto one beautiful chart so you get a one screen snapshot of your player progress as a whole. To go along with this system would synergize with the development of the game.

2. The atmosphere of the community is against the mindset of having to buy multiple accounts. Look at what's been happening. We've had the storm of fear saying "Starcraft II is dying" and then the great many people calling out for Starcraft being "free to play." While I'm not for the free-to-play movement, I am definitely not for having to buy multiple accounts either. When someone buys HotS, they should get everything. All these great new features and complete freedom to offrace at their will without dealing with all these negative, fun-killing inconveniences.

That's it in a nutshell. This is the direction the design of the game is already going, and it's what the community wants.

11/02/2012 12:01 PMPosted by Dayvie
Having different mmrs for the practice area (unranked play) makes a lot of sense. We'll discuss it internally as well to see what the best direction is.

Mr. Kim on page 8.
Edited by Doncroft on 11/2/2012 12:13 PM PDT
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Posts: 332
Won't the Unranked matchmaking pretty much accomplish this?
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Posts: 10,506
This is my biggest complaint about the online multiplayer experience of SC2 for "competitive" players, like myself. If you wish to offrace and aren't an absolute whiz, you have three limited and unattractive options:

1. Tank your MMR, either intentionally or naturally and painfully.

2. Get another battle.net account.

3. Play custom 1v1s against friends or opponents you hunt down.

Options one and two do not work for me. My Protoss is way better than my Terran, and my Terran is way better than my Zerg. I would like to play all three races vs equally skilled opponents at any time. (Note: Playing random doesn't technically accomplish this either, because you'll still likely be better with one race than the other two.)

The only way I could do that now is to spend $120, get two more e-mails, and make two more accounts. Not an option. I live paycheck to paycheck and use my limited extra money to buy gifts for children and relatives and a little on myself. Plus, this should not be expected of an owner of Starcraft 2.

Tanking my ranking is painful, time consuming, and leads to a string of very lousy matches. And the moment I want to play my main race, I'm crushing my poor opponent, indirectly "smurfing" him. Not cool either.

My fellow gamers, I am asking Starcraft's design team to try to find a way for us to offrace at any time, against equally skilled opponents, on a single account. Please give a +1 if you like it as well as any feedback you'd want to give to me or anyone else who reads this.

(Posted in General and Beta for widespread feedback.)


The game is actually cheaper now...so not $120 BUT besides the point ;)

I fully agree, I try playing zerg every once and a while but it only gets me losses (one more win for the baneling portrait and I have played 10 games with zerg and haven't gotten it...awkward...)

I don't think they will implement 3 ladders for offracing (although it would be good for the casual gamer who wants to play all three) and I think we will just have to live with the ranked, no point no ladder option in HotS.
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Posts: 9,760
I am off racing this season...WOOT demotion or promotion here I come.

Play custom games, get practice partners, and when you feel comfortable play ladder.

Quit caring about rank, have fun.
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Posts: 10,506
If you come to DreadLock's channel chillzone you can do #3 more easily ;)
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Posts: 3,029
Yes I want this.
+1

Seperate ladder rank for each race

Let's make this happen!!
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Posts: 3,484
i made this same topic the other day

http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/7004691853
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Posts: 21,243
i think a simple solution is allowing people to reset their MMR to pre-placement. or allow X number of re-placement matches.
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11/01/2012 03:30 PMPosted by ProdofVoid
Quit caring about rank, have fun.

I don't care about rank. I care about having equally skilled opponents.
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Posts: 4,469
sn't this basicly 3 seperate mmr ratings for every race? Wouldn't this allow you to play each race against opponents of your skill level for that race?


EXP is not your MMR. It's closer to bonus pool points if anything.
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11/01/2012 03:27 PMPosted by WhyLater
Won't the Unranked matchmaking pretty much accomplish this?
Not really. It still has an mmr, so if you switch races you be facing opponents much better/worse than you. You'd still have to play a bunch of games as the new race for it to stabilize and give you proper skilled opponents. If they allow 3 separate unranked systems then it works. Ideally they should allow you to have 3 characters off of 1 b.net account.
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11/01/2012 03:34 PMPosted by Doncroft
Quit caring about rank, have fun.

I don't care about rank. I care about having equally skilled opponents.


So you want to play opponents who are roughly at the same skill level as your offracing ability?

Sorry, Doncroft, but the only way this will happen is if you have multiple accounts, or are of roughly the same skill level with each race.
Not much Blizzard can do about that.
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Posts: 332
Unranked matchmaking does not accomplish this as it currently is, because your MMR is still taken into account. So if I play Protoss ranked and Terran unranked, my unranked opponents will still be matched to my Protoss skill level.

Good point, and well said.

Perhaps Blizzard could implement separate MMRs for each race ONLY for Unranked? I think that could work well. There's a lot of potential for things we could accomplish with the Unranked Ladder.

I think that Ranked should stick to one overall MMR though.
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MVP - StarCraft
Posts: 22,921
So you want to play opponents who are roughly at the same skill level as your offracing ability?

Sorry, Doncroft, but the only way this will happen is if you have multiple accounts, or are of roughly the same skill level with each race.
Not much Blizzard can do about that.

Why not?
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Posts: 1,194
So you want to play opponents who are roughly at the same skill level as your offracing ability?

Sorry, Doncroft, but the only way this will happen is if you have multiple accounts, or are of roughly the same skill level with each race.
Not much Blizzard can do about that.


Blizz could have 3 different MMR ratings for protoss/zerg/terran.
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Posts: 9,760
Quit caring about rank, have fun.

I don't care about rank. I care about having equally skilled opponents.


The only way a seperate ladder per race would work is if random never gets ranked. Instead after 5 games of one race you get 1 rank then 5 ranks of the next race etc.

Example
after a few games as random you have played
5 zerg
2 terran
4 protoss

So you get placed as zerg, say Gold, then after another protoss match you get say diamond protoss, 3 more terran games you get placed as bronze.

So what effect would have to happen is Random is no longer a rank, only races are.
Edited by ProdofVoid on 11/1/2012 3:42 PM PDT
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MVP - StarCraft
Posts: 7,789
So if I play Protoss ranked and Terran unranked, my unranked opponents will still be matched to my Protoss skill level.

This isn't true - your ranked MMR and your unranked MMR are separate, and will place against differently skilled players.

When you initially play a ranked or unranked game, it creates a base MMR off of whichever one was created first, both they both change independent of each other.
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11/01/2012 03:41 PMPosted by TheSkunk
So if I play Protoss ranked and Terran unranked, my unranked opponents will still be matched to my Protoss skill level.

This isn't true - your ranked MMR and your unranked MMR are separate, and will place against differently skilled players.

When you initially play a ranked or unranked game, it creates a base MMR off of whichever one was created first, both they both change independent of each other.

I play unranked whenever I play Terran in the Beta. I get creamed by opponents equal or close to my Protoss skill level. Granted it IS Beta, and the matchmaking system has been rough, but even if you're right, TheSkunk, that still only allows me to play ONE offrace.
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11/01/2012 03:43 PMPosted by Doncroft

This isn't true - your ranked MMR and your unranked MMR are separate, and will place against differently skilled players.

When you initially play a ranked or unranked game, it creates a base MMR off of whichever one was created first, both they both change independent of each other.

I play unranked whenever I play Terran in the Beta. I get creamed by opponents equal or close to my Protoss skill level. Granted it IS Beta, and the matchmaking system has been rough, but even if you're right, TheSkunk, that still only allows me to play ONE offrace.


in all fairness Don, if you wanted to play all 3 races, why not just play random?
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