StarCraft® II

Basic PvP builds

Posts: 33
What's a good PvP build these days? I used to use 2-Gate expand, but with nobody 4-Gating these days I want a new build.
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Posts: 779
Ask Hobbes.

Just kidding, 2/3 gate robo or 3 gate blink or even riskier 2 gate starfate/dt, there is still a definite number of player going 4 gate.
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Posts: 5
Right now I'm trying out Grubby's 2 gate Robo expand.

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=376574
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Posts: 750
My favorite opener so far is MC's 2 Gate Pressure into Blink/Observer. It allows you to put on a lot of pressure while transitioning into either a Robo-based expansion, or straight into Blink/Observer harassment. If your opponent plays greedy, you can even kill him outright.

scdojo.tumblr.com/post/32319713491/pvp-mcs-2-gate-pressure-into-blink-observer
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Posts: 1,482
On Cloud Kingdom, a really old build, AdelScott's Late Gas PvP opening is really strong. It is a 2Gate pressure with a timing attack at 4:35 with 4 Zealots and 2 reinforcing Stalkers. Because of the short rush distance on Cloud Kingdom, your Zealots will hit your opponent around 5:15, long before your opponent can hit with a 4Gate.

I've done it before Cross Positions on Shakuras Plateau, but this opening is very weak on large map such as Cross-Spawn on Entombed, Condemned, and Daybreak.

  • http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Adel%27s_Late_Gas_PvP
  • I also love to open up with DTs, as suggested by my portrait. Not only can I win games outright with the initial DTs, but I also force my opponent to open up with Robotics because that is the only way my opponent can have mobile detection. If my opponent goes for a 4Gate, I kill him because there is no way in hell he will have detection at his Main Base. If my opponent tries some stupid 2Stargate crap, he dies.

    If my opponent happens to have an Observer, I will expand afterwards and build up a Chargelot/Archon force with 1-3 Sentries. So now, the only thing I about which I need to worry is what my opponent will do with his Robotics facility. If my opponent remains on 1 Base, he will only be either doing a 3Gate Robo All-in with Immortals or doing a 1Base Colossus push. Otherwise, I can tech up as hard as I want and attack again at roughly 10:30.

    The 3Gate Immortal all-in will have a terrible composition against Chargelot/Archon/Sentry. Your opponent will have some Zealots and Stalkers supporting a few Immortals. Our opponent's Zealots and Sentries suck against Archons, and our Zealots will shred through any of his Stalkers and Immortals.

    A 1Base Colossus play will not have a big enough Gateway army to compete with ours. The most amount of Colossi our opponent can have to be threatening is 3 by the time he pushes out. Otherwise, if he goes for 4, we will have crushed him with sheer economic force. Also, Colossi armies with few Gateway units suck against giant Gateway armies like ours.
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    Posts: 750
    11/30/2012 12:03 AMPosted by Guilt
    If my opponent goes for a 4Gate, I kill him because there is no way in hell he will have detection at his Main Base.


    Would he not win the base race with a much higher unit count this way? afaik, this game is won either by making your opponent surrender or destroying all his structures.
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    Posts: 498
    11/30/2012 05:28 AMPosted by EthanKairos
    If my opponent goes for a 4Gate, I kill him because there is no way in hell he will have detection at his Main Base.


    Would he not win the base race with a much higher unit count this way? afaik, this game is won either by making your opponent surrender or destroying all his structures.


    1 DT will kill his army well before he can finish off your base. Buildings have A LOT of HP and DTs have pretty good DPS. Furthermore, 1 DT in the enemy mineral lines would mean that he has no economy to support reinforcements, further slowing down his rampage in your base. He also has to destroy your Proxy Pylon.
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    Posts: 750
    11/30/2012 06:25 AMPosted by Park


    Would he not win the base race with a much higher unit count this way? afaik, this game is won either by making your opponent surrender or destroying all his structures.


    1 DT will kill his army well before he can finish off your base. Buildings have A LOT of HP and DTs have pretty good DPS. Furthermore, 1 DT in the enemy mineral lines would mean that he has no economy to support reinforcements, further slowing down his rampage in your base. He also has to destroy your Proxy Pylon.


    Hmm... when would DTs come out with a DT Expand opening, anyway? Since a 4-Gate is supposed to hit at 5:40, I could only imagine your Dark Shrine taken out before it even gets a chance to finish.
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    Posts: 498
    My DT Build Order can have 2 Zealots + 1 Sentry before the 5:45 mark. You will also have 3 Warp Gates and a DT Shrine already warping in. You will have enough Gas to be able to warp-in another Sentry in time for when Warp Gate research finishes.

    When the 4-Gate hits its 1st warp-in, you will have a Sentry ready, with another one warping in, with a Zealot and a Stalker following shortly.

    You will have 3 Zealots 1 Stalker 2 Sentries against his 1 Zealot and 5 Stalkers.

    At this point, you do not need to beat his army, you only need to hold it off until your Dark Shrine finishes, which is definitely possible. Your warp-ins will consist of Zealots, which will force the enemy to kite with his Stalkers. The amount of time it takes for his Stalkers to kill your Zealots will be enough to have the DT Shrine complete. You will have enough gas to warp-in 1 DT in your own base and his.
    Edited by Park on 11/30/2012 7:20 AM PST
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    Posts: 324
    Go 2 gate into 3 stalker rush into phoenix... you will have map control the entire game if you don't lose your phoenix.

    You can keep his watchtower.... take your third and never let him get his third up.
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    Posts: 211
    DT drop is fun, you just have to ensure that it is not scouted. Otherwise, your SCREWED!!!
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    Posts: 10,723
    On Cloud Kingdom, a really old build, AdelScott's Late Gas PvP opening is really strong. It is a 2Gate pressure with a timing attack at 4:35 with 4 Zealots and 2 reinforcing Stalkers. Because of the short rush distance on Cloud Kingdom, your Zealots will hit your opponent around 5:15, long before your opponent can hit with a 4Gate.

    I've done it before Cross Positions on Shakuras Plateau, but this opening is very weak on large map such as Cross-Spawn on Entombed, Condemned, and Daybreak.

  • http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Adel%27s_Late_Gas_PvP


  • 3 Stalker rush basically auto-wins against this build, and 3 Stalker rush is very common right now. Even 1 gate chronoboosting 2 Stalkers and 1 Zealot autowins against this build, because by the time the 2 Stalkers show up, the opponent should already have at least 3.
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    Posts: 1,194
    @Sidewinder

    He's bronze. No one should be able to get the 3 stalkers on the timing or micro them well enough to hold off 4 zealots and 2 stalkers. Great advice, not disputing your wisdom, just sayin'... basics are probably good enough.

    @OP

    Someone suggested Grubby's 2 gate robo, I'm not familiar with that. However, I have had a lot of success in PvP's with what basically amounts to a 2 gate robo. The way I play it is very dependent on scouting.

    Ideally (and this NEVER happens) I want to 1 gate expand if I'm absolutely certain I can get away with it. Basically my style is focused on getting the expansion up ASAP while remaining as safe as possible.

    Normally based on my scouting, I feel that I need at least 2 gates to be safe. If I think he's 4 gating or doing something very aggressive that isn't phoenix play, I'll build a Robo, chrono out the immortal, and defend. Note that sentries are often critical for defending early pressure.

    With 2 gates, a robo, and a small ground army including sentries and an immortal, I will generally feel safe enough to expand.

    From then on it's fairly standard double robo.

    So, to recap, the way my strategy works is that my priorities are as follows:

    1) Be Safe
    2) Take an expansion ASAP

    Anything I have to do to be safe I will do... At the moment I think I can get away with expanding, I will.

    With my build I have held 3 gate robos, 2 gate proxies, DT's, and 4 gates. At the time I was doing this build Phoenix's weren't popular. I have little to no idea how this would do against Phoenix play, but I doubt you see much Phoenix play.
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    Posts: 1,482
    @Sidewinder

    He's bronze. No one should be able to get the 3 stalkers on the timing or micro them well enough to hold off 4 zealots and 2 stalkers. Great advice, not disputing your wisdom, just sayin'... basics are probably good enough.


    Umm.... Excuse me!!?
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    Posts: 1,194
    @Sidewinder

    He's bronze. No one should be able to get the 3 stalkers on the timing or micro them well enough to hold off 4 zealots and 2 stalkers. Great advice, not disputing your wisdom, just sayin'... basics are probably good enough.


    Umm.... Excuse me!!?


    IDK, maybe he is hitting chrono exactly when he needs to, is constantly building workers, gets buildings down on the timings, and his opponents can micro 3 stalkers to fight zealots and one less stalkers.

    If that was the case I'd guess he'd at least be silver. Like I said, Sidewinder is right, but Adelscott's build might work better in Bronze.Obviously its up to the OP how he wants to play and he should learn both builds.
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    Posts: 498
    @Sidewinder

    He's bronze. No one should be able to get the 3 stalkers on the timing or micro them well enough to hold off 4 zealots and 2 stalkers. Great advice, not disputing your wisdom, just sayin'... basics are probably good enough.


    Umm.... Excuse me!!?


    I think the "Bronze" comment was referring to the OP.
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    Posts: 1,194


    Umm.... Excuse me!!?


    I think the "Bronze" comment was referring to the OP.


    Yeah. Wasn't calling Sidewinder Bronze, but that would have been funny.
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    Posts: 1,482


    I think the "Bronze" comment was referring to the OP.


    Yeah. Wasn't calling Sidewinder Bronze, but that would have been funny.


    I can assure you I am no Bronze level player. I know my strategies and concepts, so please think twice before randomly pulling a League Card that doesn't apply to me.
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    Posts: 2,691
    To me, the 3 stalker rush is the safest opener in all of starcraft. You're set up with 3 very fast ranged units that can scout for proxy pylons, take out probes trying to place pylons, outmicro anything less than 3 stalkers, and you're set up for some very nice transitions into just about any followup you could possibly want.

    http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/3_Stalker_Rush_%28vs._Protoss%29
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    Posts: 125
    To me, the 3 stalker rush is the safest opener in all of starcraft. You're set up with 3 very fast ranged units that can scout for proxy pylons, take out probes trying to place pylons, outmicro anything less than 3 stalkers, and you're set up for some very nice transitions into just about any followup you could possibly want.

    http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/3_Stalker_Rush_%28vs._Protoss%29


    This is my preference. It's safe against 4-gate openers and even allows you to punish players who do 4-gate if you do it very well. The only hang-up is that it leaves you vulnerable to proxy-gate-zealot cheese so you'll want to be diligent in your scouting and be prepared to alter your build if you see it coming.

    Like EllisD said, you can pretty easily make a transition into just about any midgame. 1-base blink/observer is an easy one to make. Chargelot/Archon also works well off of this opening.
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