StarCraft® II

Premium maps

I know this is probably answered already somewhere but I'm just wondering if the premium map market place is still happening?
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I really hope not. This will be sooo abused... I can already see it. :P not to mention battle.net maps have always been free, thats why I love them and create them.
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I think it would open the door to more elaborate map projects. So long as blizzard did some kind of quality control to make sure that only maps deserving a price tag get the premium label.
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Anytime Quality control is brought up, a set of rules is released and people push crap at the bare minimum of that.

Not to mention Multiplayer games within another game tend to fail :P.

Then theres the problem with the mapping community, where greed will take over(the reason i dont mod for XBLA). When greed gets a hold of someone they no longer wish to help anyone else. so new mappers will have it tougher.

I would love an INGAME DONATE BUTTON ALREADY THOUGH!!!!
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At the last news I saw, they still intend to have the Marketplace up, in other words Premium maps.

However, the #1 problem I see currently is Blizzard still having no solid information whatsoever.

In other words, those who want to jump at making maps for profit are insane or are betting a LOT when there is no solid ground AT ALL. Anyone serious about money would go about anywhere else.

Examples :

1) What kind of maps are honestly eligible? Closest I saw is "high quality" but problem is "quality" is so subjective especially when Blizzard can be known to twist words. It could be twisted to the point that "high quality" means Nexus Wars and whatever popularity top 1 - X maps.

2) What's the cut per map sold? At this rate, it could be a tiny 5% for all I know.

3) How much the map can sold? For all I know, Blizzard could force the map at 2.00-2.50$ when it's dreadfully clear it should be priced 1$ then the map fold both in popularity and as a money maker.

3) Will Premium map authors have solid support from Blizzard or are they essentially left on their own when all is said and done?

4) Will Blizzard have any long-term system (ex : donations preferably, pay for that extra new hero, etc.) to justify a map author to put more work on a same map after he "banked" most of his potential money after most interrested people already bought it? Even if they will have one, is it way too painful to use or constantly require Blizzard permission to lift a finger about it?
Edited by Honejasi on 12/16/2012 7:41 PM PST
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12/16/2012 07:39 PMPosted by Honejasi
1) What kind of maps are honestly eligible? Closest I saw is "high quality" but problem is "quality" is so subjective especially when Blizzard can be known to twist words. It could be twisted to the point that "high quality" means Nexus Wars and whatever popularity top 1 - X maps.

Last we heard, Blizzard's stance on "high quality" maps was: we'll know it if we see it, and we haven't seen it yet.
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12/18/2012 10:25 AMPosted by Khalanil
1) What kind of maps are honestly eligible? Closest I saw is "high quality" but problem is "quality" is so subjective especially when Blizzard can be known to twist words. It could be twisted to the point that "high quality" means Nexus Wars and whatever popularity top 1 - X maps.

Last we heard, Blizzard's stance on "high quality" maps was: we'll know it if we see it, and we haven't seen it yet.


Actually Last information given was a couple months ago, and I was told that it was still "In blizzards scope of the distant future" soo pretty much meaning Maybe Maybe not. I personally hope not.
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12/18/2012 11:09 AMPosted by IShadowWolf
Actually Last information given was a couple months ago, and I was told that it was still "In blizzards scope of the distant future" soo pretty much meaning Maybe Maybe not. I personally hope not.

I meant their definition of a premium map. However, I don't remember seeing anything a couple of months ago, so I probably missed whatever was said in that update.
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12/18/2012 04:13 PMPosted by Khalanil
Actually Last information given was a couple months ago, and I was told that it was still "In blizzards scope of the distant future" soo pretty much meaning Maybe Maybe not. I personally hope not.

I meant their definition of a premium map. However, I don't remember seeing anything a couple of months ago, so I probably missed whatever was said in that update.


It was off the forums :P.
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I feel like mappers should have the right to choose to sell their game or not. If Blizzard takes charge of it, it's kind of like they're taking credit for the mapper's work. Also, how many Blizzard employees are going to determine quality? I don't think Blizzard is going to put out the resources to have multiple employees vote on which maps are quality, which means in most maps' cases, there's just going to be one employee it determine whether it is quality or not enough for purchase. And what are quality maps widely varies between every person. So it would be kind of randomish. Blizzard is entitled to some amount of money that is donated, though.

I think DarkRevenant had the right idea about purchasing in his map. Players could play it for free, and buy (lets not kid ourselves, they weren't donating) more content if they wanted to.

So I think every map should have a donate button. This donation would go to both Blizzard and the mapper (off the top of my head, 75/25 seems like a good enough amount) and the amount donated would go into a Blizzard database of purchases association with the buyer's handle ID sequence for the donated map. The donated amount would be retrievable in-game (kind of like a bank) for triggers via a function. And using that, players can be checked to see if they're available for more content. The amounts players have donated to each map should be accessible by any map to provide the most utility (like banks again).

This method is the only middleground I see between the players doing the work and Blizzard providing the tools.
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12/19/2012 03:10 PMPosted by Cherry
This method is the only middleground I see between the players doing the work and Blizzard providing the tools.


Yes or any very close variant to it.

As a map author, I would endlessly trust more to be able to decide if *I* sell my map (or "DLC", etc.) rather than being forced to some Blizzard standard that cut my legs. I prefer the players to be 100% the judges if my map (or any other map) is worth paying anything or not.

In addition, as someone who prefer to play every map for free, I strongly prefer that monetary gains would be based on some donation system AND on a "DLC"-like philosophy. That way, I can play the map and then donate/buy if I want something or if I want to encourage the map author.

Finally, it ensures that the map author benefiting from it have a real motivation to improve his map over long periods of time and get out more "DLC" stuff.
Edited by Honejasi on 12/19/2012 6:17 PM PST
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12/19/2012 05:59 PMPosted by Honejasi
I prefer the players to be 100% the judges if my map (or any other map) is worth paying anything or not.


I agree. I don't think anyone else can decide for a person what they should or shouldn't enjoy and what something is worth to them.
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Blizzard wants to do a premium maps service, but they may or may not ever do it. Maps right now are all free, so there are no heartbreaks in disappointments. Paying for maps however changes that, and when you discuss real money use then controversy is a problem. Primarily this is hardly done by any games because whether something should be paid for or not is not easy to determine and additionally who should be judging content for premium is a problem too. The other end of the stick is, people will do more for money which results often in better or more content as they expect a return from it. The last problem is protection of premium content. Blizzard would be required an entirely new system for handling maps to protect premium maps and their owners from theft, tampering, and dozen of false filed claims from the minds who prefer to take more than just someone else's work.

I would not count the days for it to come, it may never show up as a last feature to implement.
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12/20/2012 09:06 PMPosted by Malachai
Blizzard wants to do a premium maps service, but they may or may not ever do it.


I do admit that's it is a huge can of worms if Blizzard do it wrong. However, I am fairly certain that they will still make it live anyway regardless if they do it right or horribly wrong. I believe in the "blinding greed conspiracy".

The only thing I am 100% sure is their current premium map philosophy is likely to go hardcore flat unless their goal is to have "safe" but little extra money from extremely specific decent maps that can survive an important popularity loss.

Otherwise, it's a death sentence (popularity drops due to non-payers, fade into obscurity) for most maps in favor of some quick bucks.
Edited by Honejasi on 12/21/2012 7:50 PM PST
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@honejasi

I will say this, blizzard DID seem greedy at the start of Starcraft 2 from almost any outsider perspective, but in the past 6 months I have seen more support from them then ANYONE else. There prospects have changed, and so have their policies, they have done a great job turning around.

I mean they could have been doing great before, but with the releases of information I was seeing... its doubtful... but then again you never know what goes on behind the closed doors at blizzard :P.

They have done really great half of this year, and the other half, (in my opinion) they were more worried about their other prospects(WoW MoP, and D3). and not for unwarrented reasons.

But Either way, Lets just hope they keep up the good work... And personally I hope they dont do the premium map service, I think it will be a damaging blow to blizzards reputation and player base, And I think it would poison the mapping community, but thats just my opinion. so take that either way.

They have done great, the devs are doing an Amazing job. and I thank them all.
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I was just thinking about maybe making a post about this. If there is going to be any official monetization of maps the best way probably would be to do it through donations right through a button on the map pages. A strict paywall would be really bad for the player base because the better maps would be locked out for the majority of players.

What the "Arcade" (stupid name) needs first and foremost is to maintain the flood of players that will be returning and checking out games online at HotS's release. There was no chance of reviving the custom map scene with 1.5 because it took too damn long to release while the volume of players continuously declined to too low of a point for any kind of recovery (totally Blizzard's fault).

I just got the beta and I'm fairly surprised that there haven't been very many changes to custom maps. There are some very nice B-net changes that are really sweet (mostly cosmetic stuff). But Blizzard just has one chance with this. The release needs to bring something from the start or the entire HotS expansion will die just like WoL did. I'm guessing they hope it's going to be their DOTA game, which indeed will probably be damn good.

So... it seems like they're putting all their eggs into Allstars right now. It's risky. It might fail, though I doubt it. But it's really a sad thing because it means they can put off other custom map scene improvements. But at least there will be something to maintain a playerbase, we can hope.

But yeah, just have a donation system to incentivize map makers and content will maximize. Unless they want to maximize their Allstar players... IT'S A CONSPIRACY!
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01/09/2013 11:19 PMPosted by Hubris
I just got the beta and I'm fairly surprised that there haven't been very many changes to custom maps.


You kind of forget that the expansion is essentially an e-sports/melee expansion. Yes, there are improvements for custom maps but they are all Editor-wise when the main problems are all Battle.net-related.

It almost seems like 1.5 was just "good enough" from their point of view. Then it's just "good enough" for avoiding a total wipeout especially when the most needed changes are just a few tweaks (refresh button, open games being main, etc.) .

But Blizzard just has one chance with this.The release needs to bring something from the start or the entire HotS expansion will die just like WoL did.

Pretty much. Quite a few of us tried to push important B.net changes for the custom map scene and favor open games over the popularity system.

Unfortunately, nothing really solid was done in that regard beyond 1.5. Heck, I have almost nothing to convince my friends to be optimistic towards HotS as far the custom map scene goes. Heck, they gave up.

Anyway, the best I saw is the groups feature in HotS which *MIGHT* help make a real difference.

01/09/2013 11:19 PMPosted by Hubris
So... it seems like they're putting all their eggs into Allstars right now. It's risky. It might fail, though I doubt it.


I would say they share the eggs between Allstars and the Marketplace.

If it was a true 100% stance for Allstars, they wouldn't even updated the Map Editor or the absolute bare minimum. They would have truly pooled all their "custom" efforts into Allstars while even abandoning the Marketplace.
Edited by Honejasi on 1/11/2013 5:13 PM PST
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http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/7593741305#1

Yo honejasi, I made a thread with a great idea to fix it.
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Hmm, already answered on the Fun or Not thread.

In short :

Would favor the LAST 10 open games (mostly for unpopular maps sinking at bottom) on the spotlight.

However, if Blizzard honestly do the FIRST 10 open games even it would already help considerably since many players are likely to see the spotlight as their first page.

EDIT : If blizzard is going to answer anything, I would suggest you also push the refresh button for open games on the beta forums as well. Preferably 2-3 minutes of cooldown.
Edited by Honejasi on 1/14/2013 12:53 PM PST
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