Why Raynor reacts badly on Kerrigan?

Posts: 15
***SPOILERS***

The post was edited to reflect answers received. Current edition: #2

I'm talking about cinematic video "Believe in me", when Kerrigan, already transformed into Primal Queen of Blades, comes into prison cell where Jim Raynor is being held. This gives me several questions:

In the beginning of video we see Jim Raynor sitting in his prison cell. There are marines running behind the door (their feet are shown between bottom of the door and the floor). Meanwhile the door metal starts screaming and in a few seconds the door is thrown inside the cell.

[ANSWERED] 1) Obviously, Queen of Blades uses her psionic powers to break the door. If we imagine these powers as an electromagnetic field (like in microwave oven), everything standing between Kerrigan and the door must burn and get fried (just as in oven). Why are marines still running through this field and not get fried? They are like cockroaches running through the laser beam - shouldn't they get burned?

Answer:
I like the answer from Gwaihir:
03/15/2013 06:11 AMPosted by Gwaihir
1) Psionic powers aren't like a microwave.

My speculation: I think that psionic powers "travel" in sub-dimensional space. It looks like Kerrigan emanates her "psi-push", psi-waves "burrow" from this plane of existence into "parallel reality", "crawl" to the target, then "unburrow" into "real world" and hit the target.

[ANSWERED] 2) The door gets crushed inside the prison cell. Why does Kerrigan let this happen? What if the cell was much less in size and Jim was not to the left of the door, but right behind this door? He could have got himself smashed by huge piece of metal junk and "rescue" mission would have ended in the person being rescued (Raynor) killed by rescuer (Kerrigan). Why not take precautions, like stopping the door in the air telekinetically (remember Zeratul being hung by Kerrigan in the air when she found him on his leviathan ship)?

Answer:
03/15/2013 06:11 AMPosted by Gwaihir
Those same psionic powers told her how the room was shaped and where Jim was so she knew it was safe to blast the door off.


3) When Jim Raynor sees Kerrigan in her zergified body, what does he mean by asking "What have you done?". Does he mean:

3.1) "Kerrigan, I sacrificed everything to make you human again and you threw it away and turned back to Zerg? I'm so upset that I was wrong about thinking I can rescue you."

--- OR ---

3.1.1) "Kerrigan, I sacrificed everything to make you human again and you threw it away and turned back to Zerg? I'm afraid that you are playing with fire: Zerg nature of Queen of Blades might take control over your will and you'll become reckless bloody monster once again."

--- OR ---
3.2) Since later Raynor replies to Kerrigan's "What I had to..." with "Tell that to Fenix", so, maybe his "What have you done?" really means "Queen of Blades, now I see that I it was not Kerrigan who returned as human, it was your mind but in human body. What have you done to Kerrigan - the person I loved? Why toy with me and give me a kiss (remember the video when they reunite and going to leave the lab)?"
--- OR ---
3.3) Raynor sees Queen of Blades and understands that Kerrigan - the woman he loved - is lost completely - only Queen of Blades personality is left. So he asks Queen of Blades, not Kerrigan: "You, foul monster, you killed millions of people, you have treacherously killed my Protoss friend Fenix. Now you eradicate all people in this facility only to make sure that I will die by your own hand?" But this contradicts what she says him before he asks "What have you done?". When she entered, she said: "I had to let you out". So, maybe Raynor does not see the situation this way?

[ANSWERED] 4) Why Kerrigan does not act like the loving woman who came to rescue the person she loves? For example, why does not she rush into the prison cell and not fall on her knees before him and not hug him crying something like: "Oh Jim, my love, you are alive! I have finally found you. I thought Mengsk killed you so I sacrificed all you gave me just to make sure you will be revenged. I am so sorry... Now let's get you out of here". Why she enters the prison cell, showing off her "wings", giving him reason to make wrong decisions ("Is that Queen of Blades? Or Kerrigan I knew as ghost? Why did she come here, to kill me herself? To rescue?")

Answer
Kerrigan isn't a love-sick fool... sure she loves him, but she's got something slightly more to her than just 'run into his arms and simper like a puppy'.


In short, WHAT THE HELL IS HAPPENING IN THAT PRISON CELL? If someone of you are psychologist or psychiatrist, your professional point of view on this situation is highly appreciated.

P.S.: I know she put the pistol into his hands herself. Does she want to show him that she is still Kerrigan he knew - a human - and test his faith in her as in human?
Edited by izogfif on 3/15/2013 1:56 PM PDT
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Posts: 32,898
It's probably 3.1 for your Q3.

For Q4, you need to remember the mission briefing right before that mission began. Kerrigan told Izsha that this was something she had to see it through, but she knows she would expect a VERY cold reception from Raynor once he sees her infested again.

At the end of the scene, I'm unsure just WHAT Kerrigan was thinking. Although Raynor said they were done, the fact that he didn't shoot her DID imply he still believed in her.
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Posts: 15
but she knows she would expect a VERY cold reception from Raynor once he sees her infested again


Then why she doesn't react the way I described in question 4? It is like "I know there will be a rain outside. And I will get wet. So I won't even try to take the umbrella". Why not do some precautions, try to explain or just, I don't know, why not psionically take control of some person of the prison ship crew and disguise him as her agent. It could have been this way.
Marine enters Raynor's prison cell and tells him: "Mr. Raynor? I'm from Sarah Kerrigan, she send me to rescue you. Come with me, you'll meet with her on the ship"?
Why does she put Jim - the man she loves - in the most hardest situation possible (letting him see her infested) under extreme circumstances (being help captive, ship being thorn apart)?
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Posts: 41
Kerrigan learn Jim is dead, gets angry and sad.
Kerrigan no longer have a anchor for her humanity, gets reborned as Queen of Blades.
Kerrigan learn Jim is alive, gets "happy" yet sad and angry - its too late to change anything.
Kerrigan still loves Jim, she set out to rescue him the way she is now, destructive in nature.

Jim is dishearted when he see Kerrigan gave up and got herself reborned as a zerg.
(Kerrigan killed Fenix, Jim sworn he would kill her for that).
Jim says "We'r done", could translate to the next time they see each other it will not be a rescue of either.

Hm, i think thats about it in a nutshell.
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Posts: 4,314
1) Psionic powers aren't like a microwave. She directly targeted the door and used her power to destroy it. It would be a horrible waste of her energy to not do it en force.

2) Those same psionic powers told her how the room was shaped and where Jim was so she knew it was safe to blast the door off.

3) 3-1 is the correct option. He's upset at the fact that she's gone and zergified herself again after he went to so much effort to reclaim her.

4) Kerrigan isn't a love-sick fool... sure she loves him, but she's got something slightly more to her than just 'run into his arms and simper like a puppy'.
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Posts: 15
I suggest separating Queen of Blades and Kerrigan personalities. They are intertwined, but still are different persons.
Kerrigan killed Fenix

In second cinematic, where Kerrigan and Raynor reunite, she says something "I killed so many" to what Jim replies with "It wasn't you, it was Queen of Blades". So... your reply
Jim is dishearted when he see Kerrigan gave up and got herself reborned as a zerg.

doesn't explain why Jim is dishearted
1) because he realizes that she is still Queen of Blades and there is no Kerrigan left;
2) because he accepts that she is still human woman, Kerrigan, but now in Zerg body and he disgusts Zergs;
3) because she threw away everything he gave her - human body - and it means that she does not respect his efforts because she is obsessed with her "vengeance". Or, in short, Kerrigan does not love Jim anymore, only loves her revenge.

P.S.: By the way, did you mean "his heart is broken"? I can't find word "dishearted" in the dictionary.
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Posts: 4,314
P.S.: By the way, did you mean "his heart is broken"? I can't find word "dishearted" in the dictionary.


disheartened is the word he was most likely aiming for, no need to poke fun at his grasp of the language, it's probably not his native language.
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Posts: 32,898
03/15/2013 04:57 AMPosted by izogfif
but she knows she would expect a VERY cold reception from Raynor once he sees her infested again


Then why she doesn't react the way I described in question 4? It is like "I know there will be a rain outside. And I will get wet. So I won't even try to take the umbrella". Why not do some precautions, try to explain or just, I don't know, why not psionically take control of some person of the prison ship crew and disguise him as her agent. It could have been this way.
Marine enters Raynor's prison cell and tells him: "Mr. Raynor? I'm from Sarah Kerrigan, she send me to rescue you. Come with me, you'll meet with her on the ship"?
Why does she put Jim - the man she loves - in the most hardest situation possible (letting him see her infested) under extreme circumstances (being help captive, ship being thorn apart)?


Because back in BW, she tried that and later backstabbed him. She knows if she tried that again, Raynor would expect another backstab.

As the old saying goes, "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."
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Posts: 15
disheartened is the word he was most likely aiming for, no need to poke fun at his grasp of the language, it's probably not his native language.

Sorry if that looked that way. English is not my native language and Opera Google Translate plug-in didn't show me the translation of that word so I said what I said. Thank you for explanation!

03/15/2013 11:14 AMPosted by ragnarok
Because back in BW, she tried that and later backstabbed him. She knows if she tried that again, Raynor would expect another backstab.


Good point, thanks!

Let me revise the question #3:
Is Jim upset because Sarah Kerrigan values her "revenge" idea more than Jim's efforts to return her back to human form? She wants vengeance so much that she transformed herself back to Zerg effectively nullifying everything he did to rescue her? Is Raynor afraid of what Kerrigan can become, that Zerg nature can take control over her will and she will once again turn into bloody and reckless Queen of Blades - like playing with very dangerous thing?
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Posts: 249
In my opinion it shows that Raynor doesn't really love Kerrigan, not truly anyways. I thought it was selfish for Raynor to dump her like that. What does it matter if she's terran or zerg, she sacrificed herself and her identity to save the universe and him! Maybe if he stopped chugging whisky and sulking around the Hyperion he could amount to something himself.
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Posts: 68
***SPOILERS***

I'm talking about cinematic video "Believe in me", when Kerrigan, already transformed into Primal Queen of Blades, comes into prison cell where Jim Raynor is being held. This gives me several questions:

In the beginning of video we see Jim Raynor sitting in his prison cell. There are marines running behind the door (their feet are shown between bottom of the door and the floor). Meanwhile the door metal starts screaming and in a few seconds the door is thrown inside the cell.

1) Obviously, Queen of Blades uses her psionic powers to break the door. If we imagine these powers as an electromagnetic field (like in microwave oven), everything standing between Kerrigan and the door must burn and get fried (just as in oven). Why are marines still running through this field and not get fried? They are like cockroaches running through the laser beam - shouldn't they get burned?

2) The door gets crushed inside the prison cell. Why does Kerrigan let this happen? What if the cell was much less in size and Jim was not to the left of the door, but right behind this door? He could have got himself smashed by huge piece of metal junk and "rescue" mission would have ended in the person being rescued (Raynor) killed by rescuer (Kerrigan). Why not take precautions, like stopping the door in the air telekinetically (remember Zeratul being hung by Kerrigan in the air when she found him on his leviathan ship)?

3) When Jim Raynor sees Kerrigan in her zergified body, what does he mean by asking "What have you done?"

3.1) Does he mean: "Kerrigan, I sacrificed everything to make you human again and you threw it away and turned back to Zerg? Why? Are you irreparably corrupted by Zerg and lost your human nature completely?"
--- OR ---
3.2) Since later Raynor replies to Kerrigan's "What I had to..." with "Tell that to Fenix", so, maybe his "What have you done?" really means "Queen of Blades, now I see that I it was not Kerrigan who returned as human, it was your mind but in human body. What have you done to Kerrigan - the person I loved? Why toy with me and give me a kiss (remember the video when they reunite and going to leave the lab)?"
--- OR ---
3.3) Raynor sees Queen of Blades and understands that Kerrigan - the woman he loved - is lost completely - only Queen of Blades personality is left. So he asks Queen of Blades, not Kerrigan: "You, foul monster, you killed millions of people, you have treacherously killed my Protoss friend Fenix. Now you eradicate all people in this facility only to make sure that I will die by your own hand?" But this contradicts what she says him before he asks "What have you done?". When she entered, she said: "I had to let you out". So, maybe Raynor does not see the situation this way?

4) Why Kerrigan does not act like the loving woman who came to rescue the person she loves? For example, why does not she rush into the prison cell and not fall on her knees before him and not hug him crying something like: "Oh Jim, my love, you are alive! I have finally found you. I thought Mengsk killed you so I sacrificed all you gave me just to make sure you will be revenged. I am so sorry... Now let's get you out of here". Why she enters the prison cell, showing off her "wings", giving him reason to make wrong decisions ("Is that Queen of Blades? Or Kerrigan I knew as ghost? Why did she come here, to kill me herself? To rescue?")

In short, WHAT THE HELL IS HAPPENING IN THAT PRISON CELL? If someone of you are psychologist or psychiatrist, your professional point of view on this situation is highly appreciated.

P.S.: I know she put the pistol into his hands herself to show him that she is still Kerrigan he knew as human ghost and test his faith in her as in human, it does not worth explanations.


He's upset she became Zerg again--and everything being a Zerg means--death, destruction, loss of humanity, and probably most of all...forsaking their chances of being together as humans (minus the Zerg hair). Jimmy has done and given up so much for her...and he finally felt things were coming around...only to have it all shot in the face--literally.
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Posts: 51
Also when he says "We're done", his emotions are probably not the most coherent that they've ever been. I highly doubt he has stopped loving Kerrigan, but at that particular point he was angry and lashed out.
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Posts: 15
Also when he says "We're done", his emotions are probably not the most coherent that they've ever been. I highly doubt he has stopped loving Kerrigan, but at that particular point he was angry and lashed out.


Yes, I feel that way too. Raynor was too upset to say "I'm shocked, Sarah, I don't like what you have become, but I need to think about this situation. I still have feelings to Kerrigan I knew, but I'm not sure that she is still alive inside this Zerg body".
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Posts: 8
He's most likely been tortured and fed propaganda by Mengsk, so his initial reaction is somewhat understandable even if I don't particularly like it myself.
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Posts: 601
Because he was already in compromised mental and physical state (he was probably tortured) and assumed that she reverted to her original Queen of Blades self because of the physical resemblance. Plus, she said exactly the wrong thing. So he simply freaked out. It happens.

In retrospect, she should have taken a Raynor's friend (Stetmann would be a logical choice as he is a medic) with her and let him go into the cell first.
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Posts: 15
03/15/2013 02:19 PMPosted by Alex
Plus, she said exactly the wrong thing.

What thing? Could you please explain, quote from in-game dialog, maybe?
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Posts: 3,224
Raynor: "What have you done?"

Kerrigan: "What I had to."

An extremely poor explanation of how and why she became the Queen of Blades a second time, and the sort of explanation that the old Queen of Blades might have given.

Raynor needed proof that Kerrigan was not the same old Queen of Blades, and he didn't get it until he overheard her conversation with Valerian.
Edited by Paviel on 3/15/2013 2:31 PM PDT
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Posts: 15
An extremely poor explanation of how and why she became the Queen of Blades a second time.


I don't know about other languages, but in English Kerrigan almost crying (weeping) "What I... had to". I watched this cinematic in Russian and didn't hear those intonations.

What do you think how each of them perceives this dialog?

Raynor says: What have you done? (I turned you back to human and you threw it away because your Zerg part took over your humanity?)
Kerrigan hears: What have you done? (How does Kerrigan perceive this question?)
Kerrigan says: What I had to. (I heard you were killed so I had to become powerful to avenge your death).
Raynor hears: What I had to. (I am Zerg and I like it - quote from original Starcraft - and I just returned my power).
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Posts: 601
Raynor: "What have you done?"

Kerrigan: "What I had to."

An extremely poor explanation of how and why she became the Queen of Blades a second time, and the sort of explanation that the old Queen of Blades might have given.


^^This.

She could have said: "It's not what it looks like" or "It's complicated" or "I will explain after we get to your friends" or "I know what it looks like and I don't know what they told you, but this is not the best time and place to talk about it".
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Posts: 15
Raynor needed proof that Kerrigan was not the same old Queen of Blades, and he didn't get it until he overheard her conversation with Valerian.


Which one? I remember this dialog:

Valerian: I didn't ask you to spawn zerglings!
Kerrigan: That's the problem with zergs: they don't always do what you want.

Shouldn't this be read as "You asked me not to create zerglings - I spawned zerglings = I don't do what you want = I am Zerg"?
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