StarCraft® II

Rushed ending?

Posts: 21,373
07/02/2013 05:01 PMPosted by JohnnyZeWolf
You're assuming Zeratul can unite them that quickly. It's not going to be THAT easy...


Sure, but 80 missions? Even Arcturus managed to unite the Terrans in less than 10.


You forget that the terran people in the SC universe have an avg IQ of 0.
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Posts: 21,373
07/02/2013 04:54 PMPosted by Gradius
Defeating Mengsk should not have been a 3 mission ordeal and "the toughest fight of our lives". We did the same thing against the UED on Korhal and it took us one mission. And they were a much tougher opponent.


That's true. But answer me this Q Gradius: do you think after his defeat by the UED in Brood War, Mengsk has learned ANYTHING?
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07/02/2013 05:32 PMPosted by Retloclive
20 missions are more than enough for the Protoss to defeat Amon.


20 missions of the Protoss uniting, and eventually allying with Kerrigan and Raynor to have the three races face off against Archimo-i mean Amon.

...yawn


Well the Protoss aside, I'm more curious just HOW the alliance between the Raiders and the swarm could work.

Kerrigan received more than enough complaints from the Broodmothers when she chose to rescue Raynor.
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Posts: 7,782
07/02/2013 04:54 PMPosted by Gradius
Defeating Mengsk should not have been a 3 mission ordeal and "the toughest fight of our lives". We did the same thing against the UED on Korhal and it took us one mission. And they were a much tougher opponent.


Had the psi disruptor been located in or near korhal, it would have been a different story.

07/02/2013 05:32 PMPosted by Retloclive
20 missions are more than enough for the Protoss to defeat Amon.


20 missions of the Protoss uniting, and eventually allying with Kerrigan and Raynor to have the three races face off against Archimo-i mean Amon.

...yawn


Kerrigan might be a nice ally, but Raynor isn't a big force. Without kerrigan, it'd probably be a similar force that attacked the overmind.
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07/02/2013 07:10 PMPosted by Brathearon
Defeating Mengsk should not have been a 3 mission ordeal and "the toughest fight of our lives". We did the same thing against the UED on Korhal and it took us one mission. And they were a much tougher opponent.


Had the psi disruptor been located in or near korhal, it would have been a different story.



20 missions of the Protoss uniting, and eventually allying with Kerrigan and Raynor to have the three races face off against Archimo-i mean Amon.

...yawn


Kerrigan might be a nice ally, but Raynor isn't a big force. Without kerrigan, it'd probably be a similar force that attacked the overmind.


Well it still depends just WHAT role Raynor would play in LotV. I'm not sure he can convince his Raiders to fight Amon...
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Posts: 7,782
Yeah i'm pretty sure the mission will play out as you playing the protoss and the computer controls the zerg, or that you control both races.

Also, most of the campaign is probably going to involve protoss matters. Despite what many people see the campaign as, the Amon story arc isnt the only thing in the starcraft universe.
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Posts: 21,373
Yeah i'm pretty sure the mission will play out as you playing the protoss and the computer controls the zerg, or that you control both races.

Also, most of the campaign is probably going to involve protoss matters. Despite what many people see the campaign as, the Amon story arc isnt the only thing in the starcraft universe.


Well yeah I know that. I just don't want to spend TOO much time fighting the Zerg in LotV because the Protoss can't see that they're not the enemy anymore.

Well, depending on what the LotV ending will be. If Blizzard does a Brood War 2.0 ending for LotV...
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Posts: 7,782
i believe most of the fighting will be against protoss. The protoss do not really have much reason for fighting terran except for the ones that were making hybrids. However, kerrigan already destroyed Narud and cut off arcturus's supply of hybrids, so the terran involvement with hybrids now should be negligible.

So the rest of the protoss will be either anti-zeratul (given his pro-kerrigan stance), or just invovled with the hybrids.

The zerg we do fight will not be under kerrigan's control (for whatever reason). Under no circumstance should those zerg be allowed to live because of Amon, and these zerg themselves might initiate the battle (like Niadra). There probably will not be any input from kerrigan when engaging these zerg, or much at all during the campaign.
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Posts: 21,373
i believe most of the fighting will be against protoss. The protoss do not really have much reason for fighting terran except for the ones that were making hybrids. However, kerrigan already destroyed Narud and cut off arcturus's supply of hybrids, so the terran involvement with hybrids now should be negligible.

So the rest of the protoss will be either anti-zeratul (given his pro-kerrigan stance), or just invovled with the hybrids.

The zerg we do fight will not be under kerrigan's control (for whatever reason). Under no circumstance should those zerg be allowed to live because of Amon, and these zerg themselves might initiate the battle (like Niadra). There probably will not be any input from kerrigan when engaging these zerg, or much at all during the campaign.


Big deal. In the Brood War, once the alliance served its purpose, Kerrigan simply turned on the Protoss.

What makes you think they're going to wait for the same thing to happen again? I believe even Zeratul had to consider the fact that Kerrigan could still choose to turn on them the moment Amon is defeated...
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Posts: 7,782
Big deal. In the Brood War, once the alliance served its purpose, Kerrigan simply turned on the Protoss.


I'm not saying it is a big deal. I'm just saying that is who we will fight =)
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07/02/2013 07:54 PMPosted by Brathearon
Big deal. In the Brood War, once the alliance served its purpose, Kerrigan simply turned on the Protoss.


I'm not saying it is a big deal. I'm just saying that is who we will fight =)


Well, fighting the Dominion could still be part of it all.

Even though most of the Protoss have no clue what Kerrigan was like BEFORE the whole infestation, I have a feeling Raynor would have told them that the Queen of Blades came to be because of Mengsk's actions.

Given that, the Protoss may adapt a "like father, like son" mentality to Valerian. Since the Dominion has been weakened by the end of HotS, might as well finish them off now, just in case Valerian turns out like his father.
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07/02/2013 06:32 PMPosted by ragnarok
do you think after his defeat by the UED in Brood War, Mengsk has learned ANYTHING?


He didn't need to. The rebuild process of how Mengsk was able to re-establish himself from being left with nothing at the end of BW, to being the almighty Emperor again at the start of WoL was done off-screen. There was nothing to learn if he didn't lose anything. His beat-down throughout Brood War (and even WoL) might as well never of happened.

End of SC Episode 1: Dominion is created

Then jump to the end of HotS: Dominion is destroyed

Everything in-between regarding the Dominion was just filler that didn't affect anything in the long run, even Duke's death seemed meaningless besides being a named character suddenly disappearing.
Edited by Retloclive on 7/2/2013 7:59 PM PDT
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07/02/2013 07:57 PMPosted by Retloclive
do you think after his defeat by the UED in Brood War, Mengsk has learned ANYTHING?


He didn't need to. The rebuild process of how Mengsk was able to re-establish himself from being left with nothing at the end of BW, to being the almighty Emperor again at the start of WoL was done off-screen. There was nothing to learn if he didn't lose anything. His beat-down throughout Brood War (and even WoL) might as well never of happened.

End of SC Episode 1: Dominion is created

Then jump to the end of HotS: Dominion is destroyed

Everything in-between regarding the Dominion was just filler that didn't affect anything in the long run, even Duke's death seemed meaningless besides being a named character suddenly disappearing.


The Dominion isn't DESTROYED by the end of HotS, it's just under new leadership. And hopefully Blizzard doesn't make Valerian even MORE evil.
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meh, I don't really consider it the Dominion anymore with Mengsk gone.
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07/02/2013 08:27 PMPosted by Retloclive
meh, I don't really consider it the Dominion anymore with Mengsk gone.


We'll see. I'm curious just WHAT Valerian will do now.
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Posts: 8,770
Sure, but 80 missions? Even Arcturus managed to unite the Terrans in less than 10.


You forget that the terran people in the SC universe have an avg IQ of 0.


On the contrary, surely Zeratul can unite his generally smarter Protoss brethren in at most 20 missions. I mean, in SC/BW, whenever he or Tassadar wanted to rally his people, they would do so in only one mission: "Shadow Hunters" won the Conclave over, "Dunes of Shakuras" had the Dark Templar join Zeratul also immediately and "The Insurgent" put a swift end to the Khalai revolt.
Edited by JohnnyZeWolf on 7/3/2013 4:17 AM PDT
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Posts: 8,770
Defeating Mengsk should not have been a 3 mission ordeal and "the toughest fight of our lives". We did the same thing against the UED on Korhal and it took us one mission. And they were a much tougher opponent.


The UED, a tougher opponent? They just happened to show up when everyone else was busy recovering from the First Great War and they were lucky to stumble upon advantageous assets such as Duran, the Psi-Disruptor and even a Second Overmind. Most of their forces weren't present on Korhal IV anyway when Kerrigan liberated it.

In Heart of the Swarm, Kerrigan deliberately held back at first so Valerian could evacuate civilians and Arcturus had the right idea of having the Psi-Destroyer built on Korhal IV rather than on some backwater world with minimal defense.
Edited by JohnnyZeWolf on 7/3/2013 4:47 AM PDT
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Posts: 7,782


I'm not saying it is a big deal. I'm just saying that is who we will fight =)


Well, fighting the Dominion could still be part of it all.

Even though most of the Protoss have no clue what Kerrigan was like BEFORE the whole infestation, I have a feeling Raynor would have told them that the Queen of Blades came to be because of Mengsk's actions.

Given that, the Protoss may adapt a "like father, like son" mentality to Valerian. Since the Dominion has been weakened by the end of HotS, might as well finish them off now, just in case Valerian turns out like his father.


I don't really think the protoss (specifically zeratul that we are controlling) cares about where she came from. He knows there are evil people even within the dark templar.

The only terran i can see that Zeratul might face off with are some remnants of Narud's people, which should be so few that we will probably be done with them in 1 mission, similar to SC1.
Edited by Brathearon on 7/3/2013 7:38 AM PDT
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Posts: 2,588
07/03/2013 04:24 AMPosted by JohnnyZeWolf
The UED, a tougher opponent?


Dismantled the Dominion,

Took control of the Overmind and most of its Zerg,

And required an alliance of convenience between Raynor/Fenix, Mengsk, and Kerrigan to even stand a chance against them.

Ya...they were indeed a tough opponent.
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Posts: 21,373


Well, fighting the Dominion could still be part of it all.

Even though most of the Protoss have no clue what Kerrigan was like BEFORE the whole infestation, I have a feeling Raynor would have told them that the Queen of Blades came to be because of Mengsk's actions.

Given that, the Protoss may adapt a "like father, like son" mentality to Valerian. Since the Dominion has been weakened by the end of HotS, might as well finish them off now, just in case Valerian turns out like his father.


I don't really think the protoss (specifically zeratul that we are controlling) cares about where she came from. He knows there are evil people even within the dark templar.

The only terran i can see that Zeratul might face off with are some remnants of Narud's people, which should be so few that we will probably be done with them in 1 mission, similar to SC1.


Not necessarily. I'm curious if Valerian and Zeratul associated with each other in the past. If yes, there may be conflicts.
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