StarCraft® II

Jim and Sarah

Posts: 849
05/03/2013 04:56 AMPosted by ragnarok
But it's like this: if the majority of the fanbase is in it only for the multiplayer, then Blizzard may have the mentality of "Oh we can blow off the single player and make it crappy, it's not like any of the fans would notice because they only care about multiplayer."

Ah, I see. Well, fans like me purchased the expansion primarily for the story. I like the fact that there is a top notch multiplayer to fall back on once the story is completed, but I would not have purchased the game (or expansion) without the continuity of the story.

I am a little pot-committed at this point to seeing how the story ends, so I would probably buy LotV even if I knew that the story was worse than WoL and HotS. But if Blizzard really wants to throw the campaign story to the wind by not trying, I think that would be sort of the last nail in their coffin as far as their story-telling credibility goes. D3 blew and WoW screwed up the lore for the WC world. I'm not even trying to be bitter here; I just wouldn't buy Blizzard anymore.

Besides, the whole point to the "game split three ways" thing was strictly for the sake of making the story epic. I think the whole reason they took friggin forever was so that they could work on the story.
Posts: 19,723
05/03/2013 09:16 AMPosted by DarthTimmy
But it's like this: if the majority of the fanbase is in it only for the multiplayer, then Blizzard may have the mentality of "Oh we can blow off the single player and make it crappy, it's not like any of the fans would notice because they only care about multiplayer."

Ah, I see. Well, fans like me purchased the expansion primarily for the story. I like the fact that there is a top notch multiplayer to fall back on once the story is completed, but I would not have purchased the game (or expansion) without the continuity of the story.

I am a little pot-committed at this point to seeing how the story ends, so I would probably buy LotV even if I knew that the story was worse than WoL and HotS. But if Blizzard really wants to throw the campaign story to the wind by not trying, I think that would be sort of the last nail in their coffin as far as their story-telling credibility goes. D3 blew and WoW screwed up the lore for the WC world. I'm not even trying to be bitter here; I just wouldn't buy Blizzard anymore.

Besides, the whole point to the "game split three ways" thing was strictly for the sake of making the story epic. I think the whole reason they took friggin forever was so that they could work on the story.


Personally I'm unsure if LotV alone would be enough to tell everything. Sixen once said that technically you need FOUR games, because the 4th one is needed to explain the origins of the Xel'Naga.

For LotV, the only way to understand the ending is if Blizzard shows us how it all began...
Posts: 849
If LotV is a set up for the continuity of the SC universe, they won't need 4 games because they won't need to explain everything.
Posts: 19,723
If LotV is a set up for the continuity of the SC universe, they won't need 4 games because they won't need to explain everything.


True, but at Blizzcon 2010, Blizzard DID say everything has to come together by the end of LotV...
Posts: 359
05/02/2013 07:52 PMPosted by DarthTimmy
Personally, if Blizzard does not put them together by the end of LotV, I'm not sure the SC fans would accept ANY explanation they give...

Whatever Blizzard does, they need to do it well. So far I am convinced that the story is driving towards Kerrigan being killed at the end of LotV.

*Kill Kerrigan: If done really, reeeeeally well, Blizzard might be able to pull it off without pissing off all of the Jim/Sarah fans that they created. Still, if they end SC with LotV, I cannot see there being any heart in that sort of ending. If they don't end SC, and continue on to SC3, they will have lost one of the key reasons why people bother with the story: hope on a personal level.

*Save Kerrigan: A magic "you get out of death free" ending can be just about as damaging. If Blizzard wants to save Kerrigan, they have to drive towards the fated ending and not let on that they are gonna save her. They have to implant the subtle justifiers that would get us accustomed to the idea that her dieing is the best option that there is. Really, it has to be just like the ending where she dies, but there needs to be a tangible, deliberate, and personal intervention that saves her character. That right there is hard to pull off in my opinion.

They said thats its not gonna end with SC2, i think it was in some interview but i dont remember it
Posts: 359
05/03/2013 09:16 AMPosted by DarthTimmy
But it's like this: if the majority of the fanbase is in it only for the multiplayer, then Blizzard may have the mentality of "Oh we can blow off the single player and make it crappy, it's not like any of the fans would notice because they only care about multiplayer."

Ah, I see. Well, fans like me purchased the expansion primarily for the story. I like the fact that there is a top notch multiplayer to fall back on once the story is completed, but I would not have purchased the game (or expansion) without the continuity of the story.

I am a little pot-committed at this point to seeing how the story ends, so I would probably buy LotV even if I knew that the story was worse than WoL and HotS. But if Blizzard really wants to throw the campaign story to the wind by not trying, I think that would be sort of the last nail in their coffin as far as their story-telling credibility goes. D3 blew and WoW screwed up the lore for the WC world. I'm not even trying to be bitter here; I just wouldn't buy Blizzard anymore.

Besides, the whole point to the "game split three ways" thing was strictly for the sake of making the story epic. I think the whole reason they took friggin forever was so that they could work on the story.

I dont think they will screw up with this, hopefully, they are taking their time and i enjoyed the Hots campaign, we just gotta wait and see how it will turn out
Posts: 19,723
05/05/2013 07:11 PMPosted by MajorFoley

Ah, I see. Well, fans like me purchased the expansion primarily for the story. I like the fact that there is a top notch multiplayer to fall back on once the story is completed, but I would not have purchased the game (or expansion) without the continuity of the story.

I am a little pot-committed at this point to seeing how the story ends, so I would probably buy LotV even if I knew that the story was worse than WoL and HotS. But if Blizzard really wants to throw the campaign story to the wind by not trying, I think that would be sort of the last nail in their coffin as far as their story-telling credibility goes. D3 blew and WoW screwed up the lore for the WC world. I'm not even trying to be bitter here; I just wouldn't buy Blizzard anymore.

Besides, the whole point to the "game split three ways" thing was strictly for the sake of making the story epic. I think the whole reason they took friggin forever was so that they could work on the story.

I dont think they will screw up with this, hopefully, they are taking their time and i enjoyed the Hots campaign, we just gotta wait and see how it will turn out


Yeah I mean a lot of people weren't too happy they didn't end up together, but the trilogy isn't over.

To me, the HotS ending simply meant Raynor accepted that getting back together with Kerrigan will still have to wait.
Posts: 359

I dont think they will screw up with this, hopefully, they are taking their time and i enjoyed the Hots campaign, we just gotta wait and see how it will turn out


Yeah I mean a lot of people weren't too happy they didn't end up together, but the trilogy isn't over.

To me, the HotS ending simply meant Raynor accepted that getting back together with Kerrigan will still have to wait.

The ending of Hots to me means im a little pissed that i gotta wait another 2 years for the conclusion lol, but yeah the wait is gonna be excruciating
Posts: 52
Oh I'm sure Kerrigan and Jim will have to team up again, lest he get killed and Kerrigan's humanity is irreparably shattered . Remember, Narud used a doppleganger of Jim to get under her skin, and then reminded her of the good days when she was a sexy redhead. And that more or less worked; she was stunned for long enough to get run through. I'd say that her thing with Jimmy would be quite useful as a means to break her, so it seems obvious to me that Amon will exploit that and Kerrigan will have to run to Jim's defense.
Posts: 65

The ending of Hots to me means im a little pissed that i gotta wait another 2 years for the conclusion lol, but yeah the wait is gonna be excruciating


Yeah...brings me memories of 2002. 3 years of waiting ahead until a certain Sci-fi movie-triology was completed, except that we all knew the outcome more or less (Anakin turns into Darth Vader, Padmé and all jedi die)...

Except that in this case, we'll have to wait for about 2.5 years or more without knowing if Jim and Sarah will survive the ordeal with Amon, and without knowing if they'll have each other at the end. This really frustrates me, since I have to just keep hoping for the best, well aware that Blizzard might not grant me what I hope for.
Edited by Sygnious on 5/6/2013 8:38 AM PDT
Posts: 359
Oh I'm sure Kerrigan and Jim will have to team up again, lest he get killed and Kerrigan's humanity is irreparably shattered . Remember, Narud used a doppleganger of Jim to get under her skin, and then reminded her of the good days when she was a sexy redhead. And that more or less worked; she was stunned for long enough to get run through. I'd say that her thing with Jimmy would be quite useful as a means to break her, so it seems obvious to me that Amon will exploit that and Kerrigan will have to run to Jim's defense.

and thats what i was trying to say earlier, glad someone had a better explanation than i did xD


The ending of Hots to me means im a little pissed that i gotta wait another 2 years for the conclusion lol, but yeah the wait is gonna be excruciating


Yeah...brings me memories of 2002. 3 years of waiting ahead until a certain Sci-fi movie-triology was completed, except that we all knew the outcome more or less (Anakin turns into Darth Vader, Padmé and all jedi die)...

Except that in this case, we'll have to wait for about 2.5 years or more without knowing if Jim and Sarah will survive the ordeal with Amon, and without knowing if they'll have each other at the end. This really frustrates me, since I have to just keep hoping for the best, well aware that Blizzard might not grant me what I hope for.

yeah well, you think tahts excrutiating, ive been watiing for 10 years for DOOM IV and now i'm hoping to god that it isnt going to be a failure... anyways back on topic, all we know is that something big, will happen towards the end of LotV and im not referring Amon either, for all we know blizzard might extend the series as he might exactly be defeated in LotV
Posts: 65




Yeah...brings me memories of 2002. 3 years of waiting ahead until a certain Sci-fi movie-triology was completed, except that we all knew the outcome more or less (Anakin turns into Darth Vader, Padmé and all jedi die)...

Except that in this case, we'll have to wait for about 2.5 years or more without knowing if Jim and Sarah will survive the ordeal with Amon, and without knowing if they'll have each other at the end. This really frustrates me, since I have to just keep hoping for the best, well aware that Blizzard might not grant me what I hope for.


yeah well, you think tahts excrutiating, ive been watiing for 10 years for DOOM IV and now i'm hoping to god that it isnt going to be a failure... anyways back on topic, all we know is that something big, will happen towards the end of LotV and im not referring Amon either, for all we know blizzard might extend the series as he might exactly be defeated in LotV


Hmm...I don't have the same relationship to Doom as I have to Starcraft. Do Doom 3 and Doom 4 have a story connected?

That being said, I'm not a big fan of modern RTS (especially not multiplayer), but I grew up with Starcraft so it's more the story. Sarah Kerrigan influenced my childhood a lot, so I have a sort of personal interest in this, wether I like it or not.

If Blizzard pulls this off good AND the way I hope for, she could actually topple Darth Vader from the throne as my #1 most influential fiction-character in my life.
Edited by Sygnious on 5/6/2013 10:41 AM PDT
Posts: 19,723
Oh I'm sure Kerrigan and Jim will have to team up again, lest he get killed and Kerrigan's humanity is irreparably shattered . Remember, Narud used a doppleganger of Jim to get under her skin, and then reminded her of the good days when she was a sexy redhead. And that more or less worked; she was stunned for long enough to get run through. I'd say that her thing with Jimmy would be quite useful as a means to break her, so it seems obvious to me that Amon will exploit that and Kerrigan will have to run to Jim's defense.


Yeah that was painful for Kerrigan to see again, how badly she wanted to go back to being like that, and to be by Raynor's side.

Still, that was nothing compared to the prison break scene. That was literally the deathblow that would have shattered her permanently, had Raynor NOT fought by her side in the last HotS mission.

And for the part of Amon exploiting that, it's obvious. Mengsk's idea of using Raynor to force Kerrigan to back down obviously didn't work, but the principle held true.

And unlike Mengsk, Amon has a much better army.
Posts: 849
This really frustrates me, since I have to just keep hoping for the best, well aware that Blizzard might not grant me what I hope for.

Exactly how I feel.
Posts: 65
Oh I'm sure Kerrigan and Jim will have to team up again, lest he get killed and Kerrigan's humanity is irreparably shattered . Remember, Narud used a doppleganger of Jim to get under her skin, and then reminded her of the good days when she was a sexy redhead. And that more or less worked; she was stunned for long enough to get run through. I'd say that her thing with Jimmy would be quite useful as a means to break her, so it seems obvious to me that Amon will exploit that and Kerrigan will have to run to Jim's defense.


Hmm...I wonder if we may be forgetting something...or someone: Zeratul in the shadows to the rescue!
If Amon attempts using Jim against Sarah, it could be good opportunity for Zeratul to show heroism.
Edited by Sygnious on 5/6/2013 11:34 AM PDT
Posts: 65
05/06/2013 11:21 AMPosted by DarthTimmy
This really frustrates me, since I have to just keep hoping for the best, well aware that Blizzard might not grant me what I hope for.

Exactly how I feel.


........FOR 2 FREAKING YEARS!!
Posts: 849
Hmm...I wonder if we may be forgetting something...or someone: Zeratul in the shadows to the rescue!
If Amon attempts using Jim against Sarah, it could be good opportunity for Zeratul to show heroism.

To be frank, I see Zeratul as a big picture guy. The only reason I could see Zeratul dividing his priorities to specifically protect Raynor would be to deny Amon any advantage against Kerrigan (who needs to be alive to deny Amon the Swarm). Not that Zeratul isn't loyal to his old comrade Raynor, but they are both soldiers; and soldiers often die for the cause. I think Zeratul's priorities go 1) greater good (universe), 2) people (Protoss), 3) personal... in that order. #1 and #2 would have to be served before he would consider #3.

That being said, since I suspect that Blizz is gearing things to culminate with Kerrigan being killed, I think Zeratul is the key to her character being saved, and I think Raynor is the reason he would save her. Maybe Zeratul might even give his life to do it. Considering Zeratul's tireless focus on the greater good, I would consider it very moving if, after the greater good has been served, Zeratul would choose to give his life for the sake of a friend. Story-wise I think it would be a good contrast and balance to Tassadar's sacrifice for the sake of all.
Posts: 65


That being said, since I suspect that Blizz is gearing things to culminate with Kerrigan being killed, I think Zeratul is the key to her character being saved, and I think Raynor is the reason he would save her. Maybe Zeratul might even give his life to do it. Considering Zeratul's tireless focus on the greater good, I would consider it very moving if, after the greater good has been served, Zeratul would choose to give his life for the sake of a friend. Story-wise I think it would be a good contrast and balance to Tassadar's sacrifice for the sake of all.


Except Kerrigan doubting that the Swarm can win against Amon, and Blizzard's past with bittersweet stories, what makes you suspect that Blizzard is gearing up to such a culmination?

Thinking about Blizzard's past, I remember only two sacrifices: Tassadar in SC1, and the main character from Diablo 1 (warrior according to lore, and his attempted sacrifice was a failure). Sure, Blizzard has had gloomy stories, as SC: Brood War and Arthas' rise to become Lich King in Warcraft 3: The Frozen Throne, but if I am to base it all on Blizzard's past, it could go either way.
Or has Chris Metzen hinted about anything like this?
Edited by Sygnious on 5/6/2013 1:26 PM PDT
Posts: 849
Except Kerrigan doubting that the Swarm can win against Amon, and Blizzard's past with bittersweet stories, what makes you suspect that Blizzard is gearing up to such a culmination?

I suppose it is a hunch based on the feel of how things are adding up.

-Kerrigan's character (her soul) has been resolved and redeemed in HotS. So, her development as a character has pretty much ended.
-The ending of HotS could have very well been the conclusion of the relationship between her and Raynor. I believe Metzen said that Raynor and Kerrigan's relationship would be concluded at the end of HotS.
-The Protoss and Zerg are designed to eventually merge. With her absorbing the full power of Zerus and thus "peaking" it will likely be that her essence will be the prime candidate for being merged with Protoss purity of form to create new Xel Naga. Realistically that would kill her as no Zerg has survived having its essence taken, and it would be totally arbitrary if it didn't.
***I don't see the Swarm suddenly disappearing (by merging) after all the establishment of new characters like Zagara, Abathur, Izsha and the return of Stukov. Plus, we all know Dehaka doesn't want his evolution to cease.
***New Xel Naga being created will likely be the only thing that can really counter Amon.
-With the tremendous weight of all her past atrocities (that she now remembers) and the new tragedies (Khaldir) that the Protoss have suffered at her hands, she will probably see it as fitting if she has to sacrifice herself in such a way to save the galaxy.
-Blizzard is probably going to be continuing the SC universe and they like to switch things up. Kerrigan has been Queen for a very long time now and they will probably change that.
-The artifact may kill her now since she has been remade from the core up rather than simply reinfested. Arcturus seemed convinced it would kill her when he was zapping her with it.
-Metzen told his writers that he wanted to create a "Gone With the Wind" type story about Kerrigan and Raynor. The guy did not end up with the girl in Gone With the Wind.

Those are a few of them and I'm sure I have more floating around in my brain. Like I said though, it is a feel mostly.
Edited by DarthTimmy on 5/6/2013 2:08 PM PDT
Posts: 52
I think Jim will start to be considered as important to stopping the Fallen One as Kerrigan...they are a team in a sense; if he dies, Kerrigan's humanity will be broken and she's not much good to anyone as emo-Kerrigan.
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