StarCraft® II

Reasonable Buffs To The Terran Late Game

Posts: 180
All of the changes have to do with the Ghost. The ghost is simply in need of some love. It's hardly ever used simply because of the time it takes to get them out and all of the upgrades that you have to get to make them viable.

The suggested changes are as follows-

MACRO-ABILITY

---Reduce build time by 10-15 sec

---Remove the Energy Research Upgrade and/or Cloak

--- Reduce mineral cost to 150 or 125

OR

DAMAGE-ABILITY

--- Re-work Snipe so that it may once again be useful vs zerg T3(but not overpowered)

--- Increase EMP radius but keep dmg vs shields the same

--- Increase EMP range (would help to get in range of toss armies)


This will make the Ghost worth building and make up for when blizzard was swinging the nerf bat hard at terran and sliced the ghost nuts off with the emp and snipe nerf.

It's My Ghost And I Need It Now!

XDXDXD
Edited by Human on 6/20/2013 9:11 PM PDT
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Posts: 46
OMG DUDE! I KNOW!!!

Blizz has nerf ghosts WAY to much...they can't snipe worth a crap now and emp effectiveness is down.
Plus these guys are way to delicate.

They cost about the same as a dark Templar, which deal unreal melee damage and have infinite cloak.

I feel like ghosts should get this buff or if any buff at all.
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Posts: 180
OMG DUDE! I KNOW!!!

Blizz has nerf ghosts WAY to much...they can't snipe worth a crap now and emp effectiveness is down.
Plus these guys are way to delicate.

They cost about the same as a dark Templar, which deal unreal melee damage and have infinite cloak.

I feel like ghosts should get this buff or if any buff at all.


Yea I totally agree..

I would love to use it again but make it practicle you know? XD

They could also rework snipe and EMP so that they actually do damage..
That would be cool too
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Posts: 3,053
This does nothing for making the ghost viable in TvZ or TvT. All you did was buff it in TvP which is a matchup it already excels in.
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Posts: 1,654
Honestly, the Ghost just needs to be cheaper. Why am I paying 200/100 to counter, only COUNTER, a unit that costs 50/150, a unit that can #@@#!*@# the entire Terran army with energy.
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Posts: 180
This does nothing for making the ghost viable in TvZ or TvT. All you did was buff it in TvP which is a matchup it already excels in.


The main point is that the ghost needs some attention... the snipe could be fixed back to normal so that it can be used against now buffed ultras.. and ghost arent really needed in TvT outside of gimmicky nukes.. and in TvP they are just not efficient for the time+cost..im sure we could both agree on that..

Honestly, the Ghost just needs to be cheaper. Why am I paying 200/100 to counter, only COUNTER, a unit that costs 50/150, a unit that can #@@#!*@# the entire Terran army with energy.


cheaper and a build time reduction i think would be great
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Posts: 3,053
TvP they are just not efficient for the time+cost..im sure we could both agree on that..


Um... no. Absolutely not. Ghosts are the key to late game TvP.
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Posts: 1,809
Are you Insane?? you really think everyone else would agree with those changes? that would never happen lol
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Posts: 1,654
They kind of need something, HT's are faster to make, easier to use, cheaper, and simply better. I still think the 50% nerf on EMP was a kneejerk response because this was still when Protoss clumped all their HTs.
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Posts: 875
While many agree that ghost is in need of a buff, only one proposition of your's makes sense. Ghosts without need for research of Moebius Reactor or Cloaking would be powerful enough for the cost in TvP to build them midgame, where Terrans already excel at. Decreasing build time would help even out reinforcement time late-game for Terran, but with our midgame that would be unfair. Buffing EMP in ways you have described would give Terrans in TvP essentially a psi-storm that does all the damage.instantly. Zealot\Stalker\Collossi\Ht vs MMMGV is one of the most skillful and balanced matchups at the professional level. It doesn't need adjustements.(People don't like it becouse it's so so old. I am relatively new to SC, so I like it)

However, a snipe buff is a thing almost everyone wants. The best suggestion on changing is to make it 45 dmg 35 vs Massive in my opinion.
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Posts: 1,946
I'd love to see a rework of Snipe so that it's 45 (-25 vs. Massive). EMP is pretty well balanced as it is right now.
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Posts: 2,819
i do feel that bio does need a late game unit, and i mean something like a Commando unit that benefits from infantry upgrades

i feel that it needs to be something more than just buffing ghosts, they are a decent support caster and attacker like the sentry

they are good TvT for nukes... and technically they could be good in TvZ if they were used to snipe overseers, vipers, queens and infestors

maybe something like an ingame upgrade for reapers, like morphing to brood... be like "promoting" then you would get the Commando unit after like 60 sec

What the commando unit could have is,...

-6 supply, unique like MSC
-cost reaper + 150/100
-high health (thinking about 200-300)
-would have the old reaper bonus attacks, bonus vs light and grenades vs buildings
-3 spells
-forced march, 50 energy, all nearby infantry units movement speed increased to 3 for 10 seconds
-take cover, 75 energy, friendly units in target area take 50% less area effect damage
-bazooka, 100 energy, fires a single rocket which deals 50 damage in a small area and stuns them for 2 seconds
Edited by Oldben on 6/21/2013 5:45 AM PDT
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Posts: 1,978
06/20/2013 08:53 PMPosted by Xenos
Honestly, the Ghost just needs to be cheaper. Why am I paying 200/100 to counter, only COUNTER, a unit that costs 50/150, a unit that can #@@#!*@# the entire Terran army with energy.


You realize that ghosts can also #@@#!*@# the entire Protoss army with energy, too right?
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Posts: 10,154
We shouldnt really nerf the cost, its fine as it is in TvP. But snipe really could use a rework so it isnt limited to TvP
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Posts: 1,654
06/21/2013 07:12 AMPosted by WorstMicroNA
Honestly, the Ghost just needs to be cheaper. Why am I paying 200/100 to counter, only COUNTER, a unit that costs 50/150, a unit that can #@@#!*@# the entire Terran army with energy.


You realize that ghosts can also #@@#!*@# the entire Protoss army with energy, too right?


Except Ghosts are primarily built specifically to counter HTs.
Except HTs rapes everything with and without energy.
I wish I could park two Ghosts on my ramp and deny/stall the entire Protoss army.
I wish I could do Ghost drops and kill probes with EMP.
I wish Ghosts could morph into a Psionic Hellbat.
I wish Ghosts didn't have such pigeon-holed usage.
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Posts: 11,567
I'm all for removing the energy research upgrade, but cloak should remain. Build time and mineral cost should remain the same for the late game as well. Snipe definitely needs a buff as I never make ghosts against Zerg. EMP range does need a buff because ghosts get usually get killed by storms before they can even land an EMP. However, EMP radius should remain the same because when they do manage to land, they are quite effective.
Edited by Raver on 6/21/2013 4:25 PM PDT
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Posts: 2,555
I think the only thing wrong with ghosts is that they aren't really efficient at their job (which is the only thing you really build them for).

In tvz the ghost should be a response to infestors and vipers, but against both these units the ghost really doesn't pull its weight.
Vipers are faster, more maneuverable and have a spell specifically designed to reduce the effectiveness of emp, while having enough hp to shrug off snipes (requires 4 to bring 1 down). The ghost really doesn't do anything to prevent this units.

Against the infestor the ghost is once again outshined in mobility and even the burrow mechanic has a few bonuses over cloak. On the bright side you can kill this thing pretty fast with snipe, but with the low hp, most other terran units do just as well. The other downside, infestors are pretty damn fat so emp isn't near as effective on them as other casters.
Other notes: Fungal and emp have the same range with fungal having wider radius.
All in all, tvz the ghost just isn't good against any other zerg units and emp is very lackluster in the match up.. so why would a terran make the unit here?

In tvt it's even worse. Ghosts are going against the rarely seen raven, medivacs and other really rare ghosts. The only one he can snipe is another ghosts, so this ability will really never see the light of day. While emp may be usefull on clumps of medics or the occasional raven, the ghost really just doesn't have much of a job here. Sometimes nukes help, but I think the upgraded yamato and occasional seeker is just going to make the ghost obsolete for tank stalemates.

My fix would be to reduce the supply cost of ghosts. This slightly buffs lategame tvp, allows the ghosts to at least spread out more against the more mobile zerg casters, while also giving a strong replacement for marines in tvt (or even allow a terran to sprinkle a few in to reduce the opponent support, while also providing nuke harassment)
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Posts: 741
The terran right now are in to the tightrope why some people who can't play or stop a simple hellbat drop and they are hysterical and filling of QQ treads these forums, and you ask a buff?

They don't gave to the banshee a cheaper cost to cloack, why this could give to terrans the possibility from being extremely aggressive and take control of the map, starting to reseach stimp packs so faster and take a rapid expansion and now you are asking a little love to the Ghost?

Seriously guys, not ofense but you are out of place.
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