Proving grounds.

55 Orc Death Knight
3320
Proving grounds is a nice add, but as far as learning how to play your roll the higher stuff is not.
90 Undead Priest
4275
It's long because its new. Same as ToT. All in time.

G'night :)


That would be the opposite, if it was new more people would be doing, thus the queue times would be shorter. Longer queue times = less people doing it.
11 Draenei Paladin
50
09/27/2013 09:53 AMPosted by Barathos
PG actually shows mechanics and forces the player to actually work with those mechanics. If you don't interrupt the healers, you will lose, if you don't kill the bombing banshee, you will lose. People don't understand this in LFR, they just wanna hit the boss all day (Nazgrim, why you gotta have defensive?!) and ignore the adds


This is true but it will not guarantee good behavior while playing in LFR which is the real problem.
Even that isn't the real problem because LFR is a random group of people that will behave in random ways and the only way around it is playing in player organized content.
90 Undead Priest
10320
09/27/2013 10:07 AMPosted by Judgernaught
PG actually shows mechanics and forces the player to actually work with those mechanics. If you don't interrupt the healers, you will lose, if you don't kill the bombing banshee, you will lose. People don't understand this in LFR, they just wanna hit the boss all day (Nazgrim, why you gotta have defensive?!) and ignore the adds


This is true but it will not guarantee good behavior while playing in LFR which is the real problem.
Even that isn't the real problem because LFR is a random group of people that will behave in random ways and the only way around it is playing in player organized content.


Nothing GUARANTEE this. But it will improve the overall quality when everyone knows what is an interrupt?

It's more likely that people will stop attacking horridon, switch to adds and interrupt the add that heals if they done at least silver on pg?

Yes.
I tried the DPS proving grounds, it was no different than running around and killing stuff for dailies.

Were the healing and tank ones actually teaching something?
90 Undead Priest
10320
I tried the DPS proving grounds, it was no different than running around and killing stuff for dailies.


You did only the bronze.

Silver has some good mechanics... And gold is really challenging.

You should try the other difficulties.
90 Blood Elf Priest
9065
I tried the DPS proving grounds, it was no different than running around and killing stuff for dailies.

Were the healing and tank ones actually teaching something?


Healing gold basically just teaches mana management, target priority (chomp!), cooldown management, dispels, and for some classes maybe interrupts. In other words, some pretty normal stuff.
09/27/2013 10:29 AMPosted by Médic
I tried the DPS proving grounds, it was no different than running around and killing stuff for dailies.


You did only the bronze.

Silver has some good mechanics... And gold is really challenging.

You should try the other difficulties.


I did silver as well, but quit after that.
90 Night Elf Priest
12310
I never signed up for a MMO to do solo play =/

Don't really like proving grounds much.
90 Blood Elf Priest
9065
09/27/2013 10:29 AMPosted by Médic
I tried the DPS proving grounds, it was no different than running around and killing stuff for dailies.


You did only the bronze.

Silver has some good mechanics... And gold is really challenging.

You should try the other difficulties.


You you can't judge anything by bronze, I did all 3 roles as disc @ bronze however I can't seem to manage to get silver dps or tank as disc. I should maybe try to build a crit/haste set with no/minimal spirit for dps silver, I guess.
90 Undead Priest
10320
09/27/2013 10:32 AMPosted by Risha


You did only the bronze.

Silver has some good mechanics... And gold is really challenging.

You should try the other difficulties.


I did silver as well, but quit after that.


Strange, you don't have the achievement.
90 Blood Elf Priest
9065

Strange, you don't have the achievement.


Even after you log out, I noticed it took quite a long time for it to show up for me. Like 45m+.
90 Undead Priest
10320
Strange, you don't have the achievement.

Even after you log out, I noticed it took quite a long time for it to show up for me. Like 45m+.


Yeah, if he/she did that a few minutes/hours ago, it would make sense.

If he/she do it in the same day that he/she got bronze, it should have appeared by now.

But... That's not my problem, anyways.
11 Draenei Paladin
50
Nothing GUARANTEE this. But it will improve the overall quality when everyone knows what is an interrupt?

It's more likely that people will stop attacking horridon, switch to adds and interrupt the add that heals if they done at least silver on pg?


Not at all, once again placing a PG requirement on LFR entry will only serve to assuage a players conscience when they do kick an afker or a poor performer. I don't think player incompetence is nearly as large an issue as some of you and also any PG requirement is likely to be so low (bronze) that it will be even more pointless in the end.
11 Draenei Paladin
50
I never signed up for a MMO to do solo play =/

Don't really like proving grounds much.


That is another point that should be considered for those in favor of a PG gate on LFR and that is you are asking players to participate in solo play to enter group play. There are just to many variables with PG to count on it as a solid metric not least of which it lacks other players.
90 Undead Warlock
17765
(Apologies if vast majority of what I'm writing was mentioned already. I didn't have the time to read all the posts.)

I'll be honest. I know what I'm doing in raids. I've been doing them since vanilla. I don't raid anymore because I don't want to commit to a raiding schedule anymore. 8 year of this crap, it's getting old. So LFR is one option.

However, there are some nights where I just can't give 100% mental focus to the drudgery of those extremely long LFR battles. I get bored so easily, and especially with 24 others you figure someone will pick up the slack. The fights are, mechanically, so simple that you can let your guard down and kind of auto-pilot through it.

... and that's what the problem is. The majority of people just don't care and figure, "Hey, it's LFR."

You can't pull that crap in a Normal or Heroic raid. It just can't happen, even if it is a PUG. While the attunement idea is great by doing it via Proving Grounds, I think people still won't take it seriously because LFR is too easy.

I'd prefer to see a mechanism like LFR-type queueing applied to Flex, Normal or even Heroic difficulties, but where the attunement process is in place. I'm sure the community will rage over it and force the hand of the designers to something more friendly for the masses, but thinking back to BC attunements, the reward of gaining the attunement was so satisfying.

Consider...

Flex / Normal - As others have stated, attunement is that you must have completed Gold and have a minimum ilvl requirement.

Heroic - Attunement is completing said raid on Flex or Normal (all bosses), and have something like Brawler's Guild rank of 5, just to show you know how to maneuver. Maybe up the ilvl requirement a bit.

I've been using OQ recently and have been getting into some great groups that can stand up to these challenges. I'll just keep doing them instead of holding my breath, but I would like to see a more flexible raid queue system introduced.
90 Undead Priest
10320
(Apologies if vast majority of what I'm writing was mentioned already. I didn't have the time to read all the posts.)

I'll be honest. I know what I'm doing in raids. I've been doing them since vanilla. I don't raid anymore because I don't want to commit to a raiding schedule anymore. 8 year of this crap, it's getting old. So LFR is one option.

However, there are some nights where I just can't give 100% mental focus to the drudgery of those extremely long LFR battles. I get bored so easily, and especially with 24 others you figure someone will pick up the slack. The fights are, mechanically, so simple that you can let your guard down and kind of auto-pilot through it.

... and that's what the problem is. The majority of people just don't care and figure, "Hey, it's LFR."

You can't pull that crap in a Normal or Heroic raid. It just can't happen, even if it is a PUG. While the attunement idea is great by doing it via Proving Grounds, I think people still won't take it seriously because LFR is too easy.

I'd prefer to see a mechanism like LFR-type queueing applied to Flex, Normal or even Heroic difficulties, but where the attunement process is in place. I'm sure the community will rage over it and force the hand of the designers to something more friendly for the masses, but thinking back to BC attunements, the reward of gaining the attunement was so satisfying.

Consider...

Flex / Normal - As others have stated, attunement is that you must have completed Gold and have a minimum ilvl requirement.

Heroic - Attunement is completing said raid on Flex or Normal (all bosses), and have something like Brawler's Guild rank of 5, just to show you know how to maneuver. Maybe up the ilvl requirement a bit.

I've been using OQ recently and have been getting into some great groups that can stand up to these challenges. I'll just keep doing them instead of holding my breath, but I would like to see a more flexible raid queue system introduced.


Hey, I lke that.

But be prepared for a lot of "NO".
90 Blood Elf Priest
9065
Normal/Heroic with lfr queueing would be setting groups up to fail and they'd demand the content be re-tuned to offset the lack of coordination present in a queue system where you have very little control over who you are grouped with.
90 Human Warlock
10690
Who said anything about wiping for 5 hours?

I just meant I've been in LFRs that lasted for 5 hours from start to finish, luckily it was a weekend. O_O


That has never happened either. The most I've ever been in one was maybe an hour from start to finish, min time is about 30 - 45 mins approx. Less in ToT as I've been in LFR's that literally just blew past it all in one smooth run.


Same here. My LFR runs have almost always been fast and fun. Either the problems are being dramatically magnified on the forums, or you and I live charmed lives.
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