Merge Disc and Holy.

100 Night Elf Priest
13930
Holy is a reactive healer with a weird mix of burst (non-Mastery) and HoT (Mastery) healing. Typical top heals breakdown includes: PoM/PoH/EoL/90 talent.

Disc is a proactive healer with a mix of DPS-based and absorb based healing. Typical top heals breakdown includes: DA/Atonement/90 talent/Spirit Shell/PW:Shield.

Their healing dynamics are incredibly different, and Disc's healing tendencies have changed drastically since Cata.
Edited by Elethia on 10/16/2013 6:14 PM PDT
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90 Worgen Druid
10970
So when the top heals include: Mastery, 90 talent, (insert PoM or PW:S) and PoH (because that is how spirit shell is stacked), it makes them wildly different playstyles?

Nevermind, I'm not here to argue. I just don't see (or feel) it.
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100 Night Elf Priest
13930
Masteries don't coincide, 90 talent is what it is, PoM =/= PW:Shield, Holy uses PoH far more often than Disc, Disc uses Smite/Holy Fire/Penance, etc, etc.
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100 Blood Elf Mage
18255
So when the top heals include: Mastery, 90 talent, (insert PoM or PW:S) and PoH (because that is how spirit shell is stacked), it makes them wildly different playstyles?

Nevermind, I'm not here to argue. I just don't see (or feel) it.


I would suggest that you actually just don't get it.
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90 Worgen Druid
10970
The masteries are both passive healing. They don't influence your "playstyle".

I realize PoM and PW:S arent the same thing, but in your breakdown it is the only difference.
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100 Blood Elf Mage
18255
The playstyles are *night and day* different.
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90 Night Elf Druid
13170
No one is arguing, you said yourself you haven't played it recently sooo. People pointed out why they are different, which you are just not seeing. Which you won't see unless you play one again.

There's nothing to argue.

When you go from disc to holy or vice versa it's a completely different healing style and spell usage. If you don't get that, then you don't get that.
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100 Blood Elf Mage
18255
10/16/2013 06:22 PMPosted by Veroicone
haven't played it recently


He hasn't played since Chakra was introduced; i.e., he hasn't played since *Wrath*. Yet he wants to argue Disc play is similar to Holy. Uh ok.

Honestly, I would say a Holy priest plays more similar to a resto druid than to Disc. Maybe he should start a thread titled "Merge Holy Priests and Resto Druids"
Edited by Taymage on 10/16/2013 6:27 PM PDT
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90 Worgen Druid
10970
When you go from disc to holy or vice versa it's a completely different healing style and spell usage. If you don't get that, then you don't get that.


The playstyles are *night and day* different.


Sounds like a mob mentality at this point -_-. Nevermind, guys. I was just curious to see what the differences were, but apparently "lolz dhey so different" is the most informative that I will get.

No wonder these forums are so slow these days.

haven't played it recently


He hasn't played since Chakra was introduced; i.e., he hasn't played since *Wrath*. Yet he wants to argue Disc play is similar to Holy. Uh ok.

Honestly, I would say a Holy priest players more similar to a resto druid than it does to Disc. Maybe he should start a thread titled "Merge Holy Priests and Resto Druids"


I swapped to disc on cata because of how awful chakra was, and then quit shortly after that.

Is there a reason why you are being so hostile? I don't get all of the snide remarks about it being "worlds apart" without giving any reasons.

I obviously didn't start this thread, but thanks for being a jack @ss.
Edited by Aíso on 10/16/2013 6:33 PM PDT
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90 Troll Priest
7090
Just link a section of a log. That'll sum it up. If someone could add a holy one.

Disc snip -- heroic 25m Galakras.

Log here:

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-tx6nxjq8317pg4lt/sum/healingDone/?s=13588&e=14370

[22:53:36.329] Naér casts Archangel
[22:53:36.735] Naér casts Divine Star
[22:53:38.053] Naér casts Holy Fire on Dragonmaw Flagbearer
[22:53:39.465] Naér casts Penance
[22:53:40.357] Naér casts Penance
[22:53:41.237] Naér casts Penance
[22:53:41.268] Naér begins to cast Smite
[22:53:42.729] Naér casts Smite on Dragonmaw Flagbearer
[22:53:42.729] Naér begins to cast Smite
[22:53:44.041] Naér casts Smite on Dragonmaw Flagbearer
[22:53:44.571] Naér casts Prayer of Mending on Kosmonaut
[22:53:48.286] Naér casts Penance
[22:53:51.299] Naér casts Holy Fire on Korgra the Snake
[22:53:52.634] Naér begins to cast Smite
[22:53:53.973] Naér casts Smite on Korgra the Snake
[22:53:53.973] Naér begins to cast Smite
[22:53:55.299] Naér casts Smite on Korgra the Snake
[22:53:55.328] Naér begins to cast Smite
[22:53:56.398] Naér casts Divine Star
[22:53:57.754] Naér casts Inner Focus
[22:53:58.280] Naér begins to cast Prayer of Healing
[22:54:00.518] Naér casts Prayer of Healing on Reanai
[22:54:00.556] Naér casts Prayer of Mending on Kosmonaut
[22:54:01.876] Naér casts Penance
[22:54:02.880] Naér casts Penance
[22:54:03.722] Naér casts Penance
[22:54:03.870] Naér casts Holy Fire on Korgra the Snake
[22:54:05.299] Naér begins to cast Smite
[22:54:06.623] Naér casts Smite on Korgra the Snake
[22:54:07.410] Naér casts Archangel
[22:54:08.076] Naér casts Spirit Shell
[22:54:08.340] Naér begins to cast Prayer of Healing
[22:54:10.346] Naér casts Prayer of Healing on Skeíth
[22:54:11.024] Naér begins to cast Prayer of Healing
[22:54:11.866] Naér begins to cast Prayer of Healing
[22:54:12.162] Naér begins to cast Prayer of Healing
[22:54:14.187] Naér casts Prayer of Healing on Syleion
[22:54:14.187] Naér begins to cast Prayer of Healing
[22:54:14.429] Pawko casts Chi Burst on Naér
[22:54:16.212] Naér casts Prayer of Healing on Skeíth
[22:54:16.306] Naér begins to cast Prayer of Healing
[22:54:18.321] Naér casts Prayer of Healing on Gralloch
[22:54:18.971] Naér casts Divine Star
Edited by Naér on 10/16/2013 6:41 PM PDT
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90 Worgen Druid
10970
I think I love you.
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90 Dwarf Warlock
12625
I'd recommend playing the two specs in a raid environment (Hell, even LFR) to get a feel for why they are different. While on paper the spell usage seems the same, they do function quite differently in practice.

To me, a few big differences would be atonement-style healing and the focus on absorbs vs. the raw healing of holy. The top healing spells for the two specs may look similar, but they can/are used differently. Holy also has a few other heals, like CoH / Sanc (Ugh) to fill in the blanks, as well as a traditionally healing CD in divine hymn.

Like I said before, playing them both in a few raids will give you a pretty good feel as to why they are different. I don't really get the hostility either - You've been quite polite in your posts thus far.
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90 Worgen Druid
10970
I'd recommend playing the two specs in a raid environment (Hell, even LFR) to get a feel for why they are different. While on paper the spell usage seems the same, they do function quite differently in practice.

To me, a few big differences would be atonement-style healing and the focus on absorbs vs. the raw healing of holy. The top healing spells for the two specs may look similar, but they can/are used differently. Holy also has a few other heals, like CoH / Sanc (Ugh) to fill in the blanks, as well as a traditionally healing CD in divine hymn.

Like I said before, playing them both in a few raids will give you a pretty good feel as to why they are different. I don't really get the hostility either - You've been quite polite in your posts thus far.


I may just have to dust him off and do that. Thank you.
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90 Troll Priest
7090
Here's a the holy priest from that same log.

20:57:51.506] Ooberbandaid casts Divine Star
[20:57:53.631] Ooberbandaid casts Circle of Healing
[20:57:55.023] Ooberbandaid begins to cast Flash Heal
[20:57:56.320] Ooberbandaid casts Flash Heal on Dingoro
[20:57:56.805] Ooberbandaid begins to cast Prayer of Healing
[20:57:58.521] Ooberbandaid casts Prayer of Healing on Dingoro
[20:57:59.474] Ooberbandaid begins to cast Lightwell
[20:57:59.895] Ooberbandaid casts Lightwell
[20:58:02.369] Ooberbandaid casts Circle of Healing
[20:58:04.158] Ooberbandaid casts Prayer of Mending on Kosmonaut
[20:58:06.485] Ooberbandaid casts Divine Star
[20:58:08.576] Ooberbandaid begins to cast Flash Heal
[20:58:09.643] Ooberbandaid casts Flash Heal on Divinedavex
[20:58:10.739] Ooberbandaid casts Circle of Healing
[20:58:12.086] Ooberbandaid casts Renew on Kosmonaut
[20:58:14.025] Ooberbandaid begins to cast Prayer of Healing


She's a bit of a FH aholic. Most lead FH into GH (better gameplay, because of serendipity) but I think she takes FDCL, so she gets a LOT of free FH.
Edited by Naér on 10/16/2013 7:04 PM PDT
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100 Night Elf Priest
13930
The masteries are both passive healing. They don't influence your "playstyle".

I realize PoM and PW:S arent the same thing, but in your breakdown it is the only difference.


I suggest you reread the breakdown then, because Atonement takes up a massive amount our healing. There's also no need to act like we're mouthbreathing lemmings diving off some sort of "Holy-Disc-different" cliff.

The entire mentality used when healing as Holy is completely different from Disc.

At its best, Disc is about:

- Being aware of major damage mechanics and preempting them with Spirit Shell and/or PW:Shield.
- Knowing when to use PoH or GH with Spirit Shell.
- Keeping track of Rapture.
- Keeping PW:Shield on the tank(s) beyond Rapture.
- Using level 90 talents appropriately for DA production or burst healing to hit just after damage has hit.
- Using Penance and Holy Fire on/very near cooldown offensively, unless using Penance defensively is the better course of action.
- Smite as needed/warranted.
- PoM as warranted by consistent raid damage.
- PoH rarely, typically only when raid damage absolutely requires it.
- Barrier placement.
- Pain Suppression.
- Inner Focus use.
- Archangel use.
- Void Shift use.
- Knowing how to fluidly swap between single target healing, Atonement, and raid healing.

Holy, at its best:

- PoM on cooldown as warranted by consistent raid damage.
- CoH on cooldown as warranted by consistent raid damage.
- Prayer of Healing as warranted by damage, usually fairly often.
- Chakra stance management, dependent upon damage trends; knowing when to cut one slightly short in order to ensure a smooth cycle when an encounter loops between single-target and AE demands.
- Sanctuary/Serenity use/placement, dependent on raid needs, mana sustainability, tier bonus, etc.
- Knowing damage trends to provide the best possible burst damage through PoH/tier 90 talents/CoH (possibly in combination).
- Renew use/upkeep as warranted.
- Flash Heal/Binding Heal use for Serendipity.
- Lightwell placement.
- Divine Hymn timed appropriately.
- Guardian Spirit timing, especially with its ridiculously hinky bugginess.
- Fairly intense mana management.
- Void Shift use.

Fact is, despite potentially looking similar on logs, Disc and Holy simply aren't played the same way when played correctly.
Edited by Elethia on 10/16/2013 7:14 PM PDT
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90 Worgen Druid
10970
I suggest you reread the breakdown then, because Atonement takes up a massive amount our healing. There's also no need to act like we're mouthbreathing lemmings diving off some sort of "Holy-Disc-different" cliff.


Fair enough.

I'm not acting like you are a mouth breathing anything. I appreciate your posts. I see a lot of band wagon hopping and very little helping on these forums, so the typical "it just is" posts are frustrating.

After reading these, there have obviously been enough changes to make them drastically different. I appreciate you showing me that.
Edited by Aíso on 10/16/2013 7:14 PM PDT
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94 Human Priest
11810
Disc and holy only look similar because so much healing is generated by L90 talent and mastery. A lot of the other casts are different; it's just not so obvious because there are a couple really strong abilities shared between the specs.

If you want to play something radically different from disc (in both playstyle and spell selection), play 10man serenity / renew based holy.
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100 Night Elf Priest
13930
10/16/2013 07:14 PMPosted by Aíso
I suggest you reread the breakdown then, because Atonement takes up a massive amount our healing. There's also no need to act like we're mouthbreathing lemmings diving off some sort of "Holy-Disc-different" cliff.


Fair enough.

I'm not acting like you are a mouth breathing anything. I appreciate your posts. I see a lot of band wagon hopping and very little helping on these forums, so the typical "it just is" posts are frustrating.

After reading these, there have obviously been enough changes to make them drastically different. I appreciate you showing me that.


Sorry if I was snappy. To be honest, most of the band wagon hopping isn't what it appears. We see plenty of repeat questions (though yours was more of an offshoot of the typical Disc/Holy questions), and it can get fairly frustrating rehashing the same detailed information.
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90 Blood Elf Priest
10090
Almost every other class already has multiple DPS specs. We're fine with being the only one with two healing ones.


Excepted that the holy priest spec is always at the bottom of all healing specs, while disc often on top and the moronic justification of holy being under is “just play disc if you feel underwhelmed playing holy”.
This has been the Status quo since way before the Firelands 2 years ago.
Hell developers even forgot to put holy priest spirit cloth in the Firelands raiding instance, which should be enough to tell you how much they care about it.
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100 Night Elf Priest
13930
Excepted that the holy priest spec is always at the bottom of all healing specs, while disc often on top and the moronic justification of holy being under is “just play disc if you feel underwhelmed playing holy”.
This has been the Status quo since way before the Firelands 2 years ago.
Hell developers even forgot to put holy priest spirit cloth in the Firelands raiding instance, which should be enough to tell you how much they care about it.


Holy certainly isn't always at the bottom of the healing specs. In fact, historically, Holy has been middle to top of the pack fairly consistently. The issue is that Disc has been incredibly powerful since Cata, which marginalizes Holy.

I'm also pretty sure the developers didn't "forget" to put spirit cloth in.
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