I am absolutely BEGGING for an ability squish

(Locked)

90 Human Paladin
9780
I agree with OP. Sometimes less is more...

I think when they scrapped the original talent trees, they probably erred too cautiously on sharing 'base skills' so we wouldn't feel like too much was taken away. The whole seals and judgment thing keeps getting smaller over time, but what is the point in keeping it at all? Just incorporate the seal bonuses into each role as passive abilities and merge the offensive part of judgment with Crusader Strike. Do we really need Divine Protection, Hand of Protection, Hand of Scrifice, and Sacred Shield? Surely shielding a target could be managed with one or two better versions?
90 Blood Elf Death Knight
0
there are many more binds in pvp such as set focus arena 1-3. target arena 1-3. target party 1-3. focus casting and more.

if i wanted to i could bind all of my druids abilities for over 100+ bindings easily. 100 keys just to play a game.

the reason why pvp isn't as popular as raiding is that it's not accessible to most people. even as a lifetime, core gamer 100 keys is intimidating to think about. if you told me i'd need to learn that many to play a new game i'd pass.


Sure, but top end PVP =/= buying the game and being able to enjoy it for the level of difficulty presented. Overall, despite everyone's criticism of the leveling process, Blizz has a generous learning curve for newbies, since they do want to add people in.

Hardcore PVP'ers on the other hand, they are a different breed and (the ones I know) PVP because it's hard and challenging.

LOL is fun and is challenging too, sure, but not like WoW. WoW is made to be more challenging that a MOBA. Its supposed to be. They have different feels and different gameplay goals. I don't enjoy it as much but that doesn't mean it doesn't require skill.
90 Blood Elf Warlock
5380
Some times I wish there were fewer abilities or that I didn't need so many. Even during wotlk I felt like I needed nearly every ability in my aff locks spell book to fight.
94 Gnome Warlock
1965
I don’ t think many people were rage quitting and posting threads about “Not having enough buttons” back then.


That's because most classes used quite a lot more than the 5 or 6 primary abilities that they rely on now, intermixed with the sparse and several minute long cooldowns that they use today.
90 Worgen Warrior
10895
I can only see this as a problem for someone who plays a large amount of characters.

That's because most classes used quite a lot more than the 5 or 6 primary abilities that they rely on now, intermixed with the sparse and several minute long cooldowns that they use today.

I don't remember ever using more than I do today. Actually, I remember using less.
Edited by Jakkhel on 11/25/2013 12:51 PM PST
100 Draenei Hunter
17590
No.

I like all my abilities.

If you don't want to use them, then just don't use them or put them on your bars...
94 Gnome Warlock
1965
Still isn't enough for all your abilities. Healers are almost forced to play with addons if they want to use all their abilities effectively.


If people didn't keep keybinding everything down to their hearthstone, then they wouldn't be so overwhelmed by how many binds they "need" to play.
82 Blood Elf Warlock
4550
If you don't like it play a game like guild wars where you have 5 abilities forever
Community Manager
We do feel that, at least for some classes, there are a few too many buttons to keep on your action bars. It's an issue we'd ultimately like to solve, but something we have to be very, very careful with.

It's easy to look at your bar, go "LOOKIT ALL DEM BUTTONS", and decide that some of them need to go. In fact, we agree. It's much more difficult -- even dangerous -- to decide exactly which abilities to get rid of. Generally speaking, if you have an ability keybound, it's probably at least fairly important to your class. Getting rid of abilities you don't have bound doesn't really fix anything, so that means that, in most cases, we're talking about cutting the important ones.

That's not to say it can't (or won't) be done, but it does mean it's a fairly large task. Depending on the ability, there could be a lot of rebalancing or restructuring needed to make sure the class is still functional and fun to play. Again, it's something we'd like to do, it's just a very involved process.
94 Gnome Warlock
1965
Again, it's something we'd like to do, it's just a very involved process.


Something you didn't really touch on is how some abilities exist as flavour for the class. The last time this kind of ability trimming occurred, a lot of things we players took for fun and playing about wound up biting the bullet because they were seen as "unnecessary" (i.e. Hunter's Eyes of the Beast).
90 Human Warrior
9520
We do feel that, at least for some classes, there are a few too many buttons to keep on your action bars. It's an issue we'd ultimately like to solve, but something we have to be very, very careful with.

It's easy to look at your bar, go "LOOKIT ALL DEM BUTTONS", and decide that some of them need to go. In fact, we agree. It's much more difficult -- even dangerous -- to decide exactly which abilities to get rid of. Generally speaking, if you have an ability keybound, it's probably at least fairly important to your class. Getting rid of abilities you don't have bound doesn't really fix anything, so that means that, in most cases, we're talking about cutting the important ones.

That's not to say it can't (or won't) be done, but it does mean it's a fairly large task. Depending on the ability, there could be a lot of rebalancing or restructuring needed to make sure the class is still functional and fun to play. Again, it's something we'd like to do, it's just a very involved process.

Hunter volley and eyes of the beast would like a word with you.
90 Dwarf Paladin
7535
We do feel that, at least for some classes, there are a few too many buttons to keep on your action bars. It's an issue we'd ultimately like to solve, but something we have to be very, very careful with.

It's easy to look at your bar, go "LOOKIT ALL DEM BUTTONS", and decide that some of them need to go. In fact, we agree. It's much more difficult -- even dangerous -- to decide exactly which abilities to get rid of. Generally speaking, if you have an ability keybound, it's probably at least fairly important to your class. Getting rid of abilities you don't have bound doesn't really fix anything, so that means that, in most cases, we're talking about cutting the important ones.

That's not to say it can't (or won't) be done, but it does mean it's a fairly large task. Depending on the ability, there could be a lot of rebalancing or restructuring needed to make sure the class is still functional and fun to play. Again, it's something we'd like to do, it's just a very involved process.


Am I the only one that likes it just fine the way it is? I have made use of every spell in my spellbook (all of which are on my action bars) this expansion. I can't think of any one spell that I would want to be gone.
90 Worgen Hunter
8295
Something you didn't really touch on is how some abilities exist as flavour for the class. The last time this kind of ability trimming occurred, a lot of things we players took for fun and playing about wound up biting the bullet because they were seen as "unnecessary" (i.e. Hunter's Eyes of the Beast).


This guy has an excellent point. I wish we could keep those non-combat fun abilities, but have them somewhere out of the way. I miss Eyes of the Beast ( ._.)
Community Manager
11/25/2013 01:01 PMPosted by Bomdanil
Again, it's something we'd like to do, it's just a very involved process.


Something you didn't really touch on is how some abilities exist as flavour for the class. The last time this kind of ability trimming occurred, a lot of things we players took for fun and playing about wound up biting the bullet because they were seen as "unnecessary" (i.e. Hunter's Eyes of the Beast).


True, and we want to avoid that. As I mentioned above, removing abilities you don't often use doesn't accomplish much. We often talk about this issue in terms of action bar space, but it's really keybind space that's the problem. One could make an argument that, say, Unending Breath could stand to be cut, but that's not something that's going to free up a keybind for the vast majority of Warlocks.
91 Worgen Priest
7985
Hunter volley and eyes of the beast would like a word with you.
I think Lore, and the OP, was more referring to the important stuff considered useful and/or necessary to play a class, not just how many tiles their are in our spellbooks.

Ya know, stuff you keybind as opposed to stuff you can just tuck in the corner because you don't need to whip it out with precise timing.
Edited by Morrice on 11/25/2013 1:10 PM PST
90 Human Priest
4585
WOW is going the way of Diablo folks.

Coming to a console near you.

Anyone taking wagers?
100 Blood Elf Death Knight
15870
We do feel that, at least for some classes, there are a few too many buttons to keep on your action bars. It's an issue we'd ultimately like to solve, but something we have to be very, very careful with.

It's easy to look at your bar, go "LOOKIT ALL DEM BUTTONS", and decide that some of them need to go. In fact, we agree. It's much more difficult -- even dangerous -- to decide exactly which abilities to get rid of. Generally speaking, if you have an ability keybound, it's probably at least fairly important to your class. Getting rid of abilities you don't have bound doesn't really fix anything, so that means that, in most cases, we're talking about cutting the important ones.

That's not to say it can't (or won't) be done, but it does mean it's a fairly large task. Depending on the ability, there could be a lot of rebalancing or restructuring needed to make sure the class is still functional and fun to play. Again, it's something we'd like to do, it's just a very involved process.


I can understand that. Adding things in are almost as dangerous as well. I was a bit upset when Volley was initially taken out, but at least multi-shot was still around.

In contrast, take a spell like corpse explosion which was just a fun ability that didn't serve any real purpose that could essentially be put into a minor glyph.

It all makes sense.
100 Human Paladin
17885
Let's see I have:

A normal heal
A quick heal
A big heal
An instant heal that generates a secondary resource
A heal based upon that secondary resource
An AoE heal based upon that secondary resource
An AoE heal that generates the secondary resource
A giant AoE heal hammer OR a beam of light that must shoot the boss to do the most healing
The "Oh crap tank is dying" mega heal that you can use 1 time

And that's just the heals.
90 Blood Elf Warlock
10295
PREACH! I completely agree. I love being able to have a somewhat unique play style, but the number of abilities, especially for healers is just out of control. I admire the fact that Blizzard wants to have unique encounters and that can lead to needing more options in abilities, but at this point, I am too afraid to play my pally or druid healers because it's just too much pressure. And as DPS, I can handle it, but I am never looking at the boss, only at my action bars and my feet. Great post.
90 Night Elf Warrior
14380
This sort of post drives me nuts, because I want the opposite to happen. Blizzard has been weeding out abilities for the last two expansions. Unless you're a frost mage, you're hitting less buttons today than you did during Wrath of the Lich King, and yet the devs indicate a desire to pare down even more. If having a dozen abilities that you use every day is too complicated, why are raid encounters so incredibly complex? It would actually be easier for the players for individual rotations to be more complex, and for fights like Paragons of the Klaxxi to be dumbed down. It doesn't make any sense to dumb down player rotations to the point where you could use a console controller and map all of your regular buttons to it (I would argue you could do that today for most classes as-is). Interesting choices on a per class level are slowly being removed, replaced by gimmicky platforming mechanics. When will it be enough? Will classes be stripped down to 3 buttons? "attack" , "AoE attack", and "defend" ? It would be nice to move back in the RPG direction instead of continuing towards a God of War style game. WoW was at its best during Wrath, and its a shame we keep moving away from that.
Edited by Seaotter on 11/25/2013 1:12 PM PST
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