To those wanting to solo-queue rated BGs

81 Troll Mage
0
Remember when you guys ruined BGs for us before? Because of your QQ Blizzard made it so that groups of more than 5 could only meet other raid groups, killing queue times and essentially removing the ability to BG with more than 4 other people from your guild.

Your selfish desire to force us to not use teamwork because it would be too much work for you ruined BGs for a long time. Now we're getting a whole Rated BG system so we can queue with our guilds again and you want to screw it all up AGAIN? Go play your random BGs and please stop trying to make playing as a team so damn difficult for us.
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49 Night Elf Warrior
850
I understand your frustration, but...

playing as a team so damn difficult for us.


There's nothing difficult about rolling pugs in a premade.
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80 Blood Elf Paladin
1100
The problem with not being able to solo queue for rated bgs is that it splits the population down the middle. Relevantly, there are two types of PvP players. Those who want to play with their guild in rated BGs, and those who want to queue solo or maybe with one or two friends. I fall into the second camp. I loved running premade BGs in vanilla wow with my guild, but now I don't have the time or interest. My old wow friends are scattered. Some switched servers, factions, or just stopped playing. I now like to play with two of my real life friends. That's it, just a three person group. I play wow three times a week for 2-5 hours, more or less like clockwork. Sometimes I miss the macro strategy of running AB with a full 15 man group, but I just don't have the patience or interest. I just want to play the game, progress whatever character I'm currently on and have fun. I don't want to sit around and wait for 15 people of the right classes to get on so they can get in my group and get on vent because people are too damn stubborn to use the in-game mic functionality which works perfectly fine and is 500 times more convenient. I'm getting off point here.

I just want to play the game my own way, at my own pace, but the competitive side of me makes me feel like I need to play arenas, which I never liked, or rated BGs, which I was excited about until I learned that you needed to queue with a large group. Having a rated BG system that requires 10 or 15 players is a slap in the face to people like me. By not giving solo queuers access to the higher levels of gear, or even rating us at all, it effectively designates us as second class citizens. It invalidates my style of play, much like they have always done with twinking.

The solution? Solo queuers and groups in the same pool and a good matchmaking system. Simple. Oh and all the battlegroups need to be combined. I realize they're doing this, so good for them, but there's no good reason why with a good matchmaking system, solo queuers shouldn't be able to get the same benefits as people making premades. The goal here is to implement a fun, balanced BG system that everyone can enjoy, not just the people who like premades and not just the people who like queueing solo.

And any RP-based arguments can go eat a %*#@. Yes, it is more logical for people who work as a group to get better rewards, but logic was thrown out the window long ago in favor of balance.

Alternate solution: throttle the gear of rated BG pieces in unrated BGs, and for the love of %##* give unrated BG people the ability to buy weapons. Maybe not weapons that are as good as what you get out of rated, but just something. If there has to be a line drawn, at least allow the people on my side to still have fun and feel like our playstyle is at least slightly understood or appreciated.
Edited by Oztroja on 11/18/2010 5:27 PM PST
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49 Night Elf Warrior
850
There's nothing difficult about rolling pugs in a premade.

However, there was something difficult about getting 10 or 15 people into the same battleground when you couldn't queue as group and didn't have instant queues.


This may be true, but it is becoming clear that Blizzard is not interested in better rewards for something simply because it's an organizational headache. For instance, 25-man dungeons used to receive substantially superior rewards simply because it was a bigger organizational headache to heard 24 cats instead of 9. In Cataclysm, only greater skill (heroic instances) will receive greater loot. The pain of getting 25 people online together no longer entitles people to greater reward for minimal play effort.

I see no reason why BGs should be exempt from this new design philosophy. The fact that it's difficult to accomplish getting all those people in a BG together for what then becomes trivially easy honor should not justify greater rewards.

Btw, I have no great interest in either side of this debate. I'm just showing you a different perspective on it. Critical thinking EFF TEE DUBYA.
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90 Dwarf Priest
8000
I love how how people point at Blizzard's "new design philosophy" as a reason to allow solo queues. Cheery picking the philosophy is lame.

1) The new loot system, 25 mans STILL get rewarded more.
2) Even ignoring gear, you STILL have to make a raid for 10 mans lol.
3) And it takes a lot more "skill" in a premade then it does when you're solo. I'd know doing a lot of both.
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90 Undead Warlock
5850
BGs are one of the few areas that's exempt from the server tax. I tried queuing with people from my realm, it was terrible.

Coming from an awful PvE realm I can't do much. I have no raid gear, I'm 1/12 in ICC, in fact the only raid I've ever finished was Nax. I'm punished by playing on my crappy server, at least with BGs I could team up with people from other servers. But, no, now people can design a team with the correct number of healers and I'm either forced to randomize with who knows what against people who are out pacing me gear-wise anyway EDIT: or give up on the game entirely, which is probably what I'll do.

So why don't you take your better version of the game than me and let my wallow in the crapulence of random BGs?
Edited by Raistmajere on 11/18/2010 5:46 PM PST
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49 Night Elf Warrior
850

Btw, I have no great interest in either side of this debate. I'm just showing you a different perspective on it. Critical thinking EFF TEE DUBYA.


This is me quoting myself. Looks like a few folks don't know how to read all the way to the end of a post.

Let me TL;DR for the folks in this thread: I don't care one way or another about rated BGs. I'll participate in them sporadically at best because I play on a terrible PvE server in a small'ish guild of people who enjoy 10-man raids and couldn't give less of a damn about PvP if they tried, outside of maybe 3-4 people. The entire point of my post was to demonstrate another perspective on the issue.

Your opinions about rated BGs are not gospel. Neither are the people wanting to solo queue. You would, however, both be better off if each of you took a moment to consider the other person's perspective instead of just QQing and waving your wangs at each other.
Edited by Laughriot on 11/18/2010 10:02 PM PST
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49 Night Elf Warrior
850
I love how how people point at Blizzard's "new design philosophy" as a reason to allow solo queues. Cheery picking the philosophy is lame.

1) The new loot system, 25 mans STILL get rewarded more.
2) Even ignoring gear, you STILL have to make a raid for 10 mans lol.
3) And it takes a lot more "skill" in a premade then it does when you're solo. I'd know doing a lot of both.


FYI, none of that is actually a valid counter-argument to anything I said. The point I was originally making is "participating in something that is 'difficult' only because it is more of a headache to organize is no longer intended to provide greater rewards."

1) More rewards, not better rewards.
2) This has nothing to do with what I said. I'm not even sure where you're going, with this one.
3) Again, this has nothing to do with my original point, so I won't attack it. That being said, it is false.

Again... the point was that you don't get cooler stuff for herding more people together, which is what the person I was replying to seemed to be implying.
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18 Troll Priest
140

Again... the point was that you don't get cooler stuff for herding more people together, which is what the person I was replying to seemed to be implying.


Technically, you're getting better stuff. You'll gear up faster, and have a greater chance at getting something in every raid. I like how they're not actually giving out a higher tier of gear just for bringing more bodies though. Sadly, PvP is always a step behind the great new PvE designs.

It's like PvP is a dumping ground for elitist tards. They make PvE less hardcore > tards QQ and switch to PvP (in this case arena) > Bliz gets a few more sub payments before they quit the game. For example: the arena players who have been stomping their feet the entire expac to remain the tiny minority allowed to have current gear. 4.0 hits, rating reqs are removed from just about all gear, cue the "my accomplishments now mean nothing so I quit bawwww". The epitome of the rejected TBC raider right there. Spoiled. Rotten. Despicable.

At least the future is looking good, but boy has PvP sucked for the last 2 years.
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18 Troll Priest
140

He's obviously pointing out the fact that the 10 man raids Blizzard is moving to still require organizing a raid, while solo queuing is soloing. Blizzard continues to maintain the philosophy that group content has better rewards than solo content, and that contradicts your whole point.


ITT: participating in a 10-15 man battleground is "soloing".

Hmm, what was that sound... was it your argument going out the window?
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85 Goblin Death Knight
4935
Remember when you guys ruined BGs for us before? Because of your QQ Blizzard made it so that groups of more than 5 could only meet other raid groups, killing queue times and essentially removing the ability to BG with more than 4 other people from your guild.

Your selfish desire to force us to not use teamwork because it would be too much work for you ruined BGs for a long time. Now we're getting a whole Rated BG system so we can queue with our guilds again and you want to screw it all up AGAIN? Go play your random BGs and please stop trying to make playing as a team so damn difficult for us.


You guys have arena.

And everyone pays the same amount you do so why shouldn't Blizzard have something for people who want to solo rbg?

If you have a guild then you can get 10 of your guildies and queue up.
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18 Troll Priest
140
ITT: participating in a 10-15 man battleground is "soloing".

Hmm, what was that sound... was it your argument going out the window?

By your logic, solo questing isn't soloing, because there's other people questing in the same world. How's that 1,000 man server wide raid you do your dailies in working out for you?


More like, by your logic queuing up with a raid through the raid finder is soloing. Doing your daily 5-man dungeons is soloing. Since you're not forming the group beforehand then you aren't actually in a group working with others towards a goal, right?

You clearly don't understand what soloing means so you should probably just stop talking about it.
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18 Troll Priest
140
The difference between the random dungeon finder and soloing is that you actually work together in a random dungeon group. You play as a unit instead of running in 5 different directions killing mobs on your own, and if somebody doesn't feel like listening, you can kick them out of the group and get someone who will cooperate. Let me know when solo queue battlegrounds let us boot out road fighters who are more concerned with each others' moms than the objectives.


So since this system doesn't exist yet, and you can't kick anyone out of your battleground groups, and haven't been able to ever. Then queueing into a battleground, regardless of whether you're solo or with a group / raid = soloing. According to you.

You clearly don't understand what grouping means so you should probably just stop talking about it.


Cute, but no.

Thank you for making yourself look like such an idiot, it makes my job easy.
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81 Troll Mage
0
Your opinions about rated BGs are not gospel. Neither are the people wanting to solo queue. You would, however, both be better off if each of you took a moment to consider the other person's perspective instead of just QQing and waving your wangs at each other.

I tend to be a person who tries to see both sides of an argument. However, in this case, people have BGs they can solo in all day long yet want to be able to solo in the competitive rated BGs now as well. Finding a group of 9 others who want to do a casual RBG team should be no problem, and after that they can grind away all day long. Asking to put the tiniest bit of effort into higher rewards should not be too much.

Normally, with a decent matchmaking system I would not care. However, past experience has taught us that we're more likely to get a system where full raids will only get other full raids or something awful like that and break the ability to play with a guild entirely. The point above about asking for just a small effort to form a group only makes my concern stronger.

You guys have arena.

And everyone pays the same amount you do so why shouldn't Blizzard have something for people who want to solo rbg?

If you have a guild then you can get 10 of your guildies and queue up.

BGs you can solo queue will still be in the game, and I'm sure I'll spend plenty of time in them. However, RBGs are RBGs and they give better gear, there should be SOMETHING to distinguish them from regular BGs.

Yes, everyone pays the same, so why is it that people who complained about premade BG groups got to ruin that for me and make it impossible to do? The same risk is here. If you can queue solo for RBG, then everyone will. The non-rated BGs then become a ghost town, which will make doing BGs while not in my group impossible unless I want to queue RBGs and tank rating.

I'd reply to buttercups, but to him the one road warrior screwing over a 9 man premade is teamwork because he got in a queue, so nothing really to see there.
Edited by Dimolapietra on 11/19/2010 12:39 PM PST
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