Ret GoAK Nerfed :(

85 Human Paladin
8180
Well I made a thread when GoAK was buffed I guess it is only fair to inform you guys of the recent nerf. Ancient fury has been reduced by another 35%(it is now down by 95% from 4 builds ago). At 20 stacks the explosion at the end of the duration is a whopping 9k in PvE, and might as well heal our target in PVP, it is just that bad. You would think at the absolute minimum they would make it so our guardian either has the same hit/expertise as us, or cannot miss/dodge/parry, but that isn't the case so sometimes you get to look forward to getting about 20 dps from this thing as it just misses over and over.

So we went from a bad but at least not completely terrible level 85 ability last patch, right back to a completely awful ability this patch.

It is like the people designing ret are completely afraid of any ability ret has being useful at all. Now we get an 85 ability that does about 30k damage in PvP over 30 seconds, it is essentially useless. In PvE the only saving grace is that it is off the GCD, so we will just macro it to everything and ignore it, right now it is barely beating out mirror images damage when used on CD.

Also, the color of these forums is awful.
Edited by Beta on 11/19/2010 4:14 AM PST
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
10790
I was testing on beta literally an hour ago - my GOAK was critting for ~10k and lasted 30(?) seconds. That's pretty weak for an 85 ability, taking into consideration we lost every ability we gained with WOTLK :/

In PvP, we'll just be CCed for the duration it's up due to the fact that it doesn't even melee unless you're in melee range as well. Just to top off the new abilities we're getting in Cataclysm:
- A spell similar to SnD where if we let it fall off, our pve DPS goes to !!@@.
- A weak AoE heal on a 1 minute CD that costs 1/3 of our mana
- A summonable pet that we're just going to macro to Wings and it useless if you're out of melee range

Sounds like a bunch of nice abilities we're going to be able to train.
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85 Blood Elf Death Knight
1990
Ret is in a very bad place right now, they have too many redundant cooldowns that does nothing else but increase DPS.

GOAK
Zealotry
Hand of Light(mastery)
Inquisition
Avenging Wrath

Because we all know at the end of the day, Blizzard will balance all dps classes within range of each other. What Ret want is abilities in addition to DPS, like spammable CC, dispel and stun protection, or a self heal that doesn't share same resource as DPS.
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
9020
That's really a shame, because the Holy and Prot versions of GoAK are even more bland.
Where has all the fun gone?
Edited by Valkura on 11/19/2010 10:09 AM PST
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85 Blood Elf Death Knight
1990
Yes, all 3 versions of GaAK is very bland. Having these abilities as cooldowns only nerfs your other abilities. Like I said, DPS, HPS, damage mitigation are all balanced vs other similar class roles. The less abilities you have, the more each of them does.

With all the cooldowns, paladins just gets watered down.

Compared to Arcane mages that can play with 1 button, but that 1 button is extremely powerful. Sometimes less is more.
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85 Human Paladin
8180

Is it possible it's broken? I know Gargolye is broken in beta and doesn't even do one deathcoil worth of damage the entire time he is out.


It is working as intended, it attacks and builds stacks and everything just fine. It is just extremely underwhelming, the burst explosion at the end is pathetic now, hits for about 4-5k in PvP :(.
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85 Human Paladin
8180

Is it possible it's broken? I know Gargolye is broken in beta and doesn't even do one deathcoil worth of damage the entire time he is out.


It is working as intended, it attacks and builds stacks and everything just fine. It is just extremely underwhelming, the burst explosion at the end is pathetic now, hits for about 4-5k in PvP :(.


The explosion really should do no less than 30k in PvP, and 50k or so in PvE. Otherwise any possibly damage from it is easily lost within a standard deviation by a few crits more or less.


I agree completely, except the devs seem to disagree. The original version that actually added a reasonable amount of damage was pretty much perfect for a 5 minute cooldown (it was about 500dps used on CD) but it was insane iWin button in PvP because the explosion was hitting for 100,000 on resil. The obvious fix was to reduce the damage and the cooldown, you can keep that 500dps used on cooldown without it being a massive burst cooldown, at two minutes it would only have to be 60k in PvE, which is 40k in PvP or about the same as a single crit lavaburst (LOL).

Instead they went with this extremely convoluted backwards fix of making the burst at the end useless and changing it officially to our third straight up "this button buffs your damage" cooldown by removing a bulk of the guardians damage while increasing the buff it gives you.

Now we have the exact some problem we had with the original 100k explosion version (I call this the original because it was the first version that was balanced in at least one aspect of the game, before this version it was awful for a long long time, then retarded OP with 380k explosions for a few days), when we are able to pop GoAK+ AW + Zealotry on a target we will be able to absolutely annihilate them inside a HoJ. For the benefit of the non-rets that don't know what all these cooldowns do, a 20 stack(it takes 10-15 seconds to build to 20 stacks) GoAK gives +20% strength, AW gives + 20% damage, and zealotry makes your CS give max combo pts. With all three up at full strength at once you can expect 50k TV crits every other GCD essentially, it gets very dirty very fast. Ret is the new three minute mage, run into us when we have everything off cooldown expect to die veyr very quickly, the rest of the time we are a free HK.
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
10155
I'm really annoyed that they insist on giving us three dps CDs. 2-5m CDs are suppose to be exiting or an incredible emergency button. From what I've seen of zealotry it's crap and from what i keep seeing about GoAKs, it's been mostly crap. The problem is they can't have us balanced and makes those abilities fun. If they give us three good dps CDs, we'll be OP (sounds like we're OP if we can pop them all at once anyways). If they make them balanced, well one or more of the abilities are crap (just to reiterate, it seems like we can put out retarded dps when all three are up) and we end up being gimp.

I know, they wanted to increase the skill cap. I'm not convinced that three dps CDs raises the cap, nor am I convince that zealotry is ever going to do that. For the love of god, just let Zealotry die in fire, readjust retribution dps with the idea that we have two dps CDs (you can lower GoAK's CD for ret and tweak the dps gain to a more acceptable level, if AW is the only thing that needs to be factored in - hell even more the 3HP generation to GoAK). I just see this three dps CD route not making anyone happy in future, we're not going to like being weak without all three up and people are going to whine when we succeed catching them with all three. I think the devs are being stubborn and don't want to admit that zealotry is a failure of an ability and that giving ret three dps CDs is a bad idea.

The lowered the number of talent points because they realized they could do more with less. Now they just need to realize that, as far as, dps CDs go, less is actually more for ret.
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85 Tauren Paladin
13215
http://www.warcraftmovies.com/movieview.php?id=167409

fast forward to 6:35. lol


That video is amazing. Thank you so much for posting it.
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7 Tauren Shaman
0
turn us into the guardian for ret form
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85 Goblin Mage
2765
Its not a pet. having it doesnt make you a pet class. you have no control over it. therefore you arent a pet class. (or should i say SPEC since ret is a spec not a class)

It needs to be improved. drastically.
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