Holy Shock was nerfed?

85 Draenei Paladin
4915
I do recall reading it somewhere a while back ago, I think mmo-champ's website with Blue post mentioning something about changes planned for Holy Shock, it was a while ago tho, and I agree I don't recall seeing a patch note mentioning it.

Generally they want us (it seems by force even, if necessary) to cast Holy Lights etc, as it was with strenght of HS, I could do entire heroic randoms without casting HL even once, just kept Shocking people and then WoG (with 30% of it not using up HP, sometimes even 5 times in a row), in bad moments used LoD and FoL.

We still will use it as an accelerator for Holy Light, it's about knowing what causes which reaction and using it smartly, it's just not as powerful as it was. It's not gamebreaking so don't jump out the window just yet :D you'll be fine.
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85 Draenei Paladin
3915
What a lot of people are failing to realize is that Holy Shock is about the only thing we can get off when focused, now we have to rely on fakecasting every time or holding onto WoG for ourselves and not using it on others.
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90 Human Paladin
9375
What a lot of people are failing to realize is that Holy Shock is about the only thing we can get off when focused, now we have to rely on fakecasting every time or holding onto WoG for ourselves and not using it on others.


With that being said though, PVP shouldn't be 3v1 or 5v1, and you shouldn't expect to win a fight with those odds, or even to survive through them, unless they're absolutely horrible.
With 3v3 or 5v5, if you're being focussed it's your teammates job to peel your adversaries off you, whether with knockback mechanics, stuns, fears, slows, snares etc. With myself and a warrior friend of mine we managed to go 2v7 in AB against average players for about 5 minutes before they finally chain stunned/silenced me for a good 7 seconds, in which time they killed me. between him pummeling casters, disarming phys dps, stuns, fears, my stun, bubble, LoH etc we did pretty well.

Even with the nerf to Holy shock (which I hate and really wish it wasn't so severe) holy paladins still do fine in pvp. The playstyle is more similar to what we were doing before 4.0 again, where we actually have to cast, though often we're relying on procs from HS before we can cast DL or HL.
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
0
Oh, is that what was happening?

I took a break from my Paladin after the patch a month ago, and started healing again recently. I thought I had a handle on the new healing. Then I entered a 25 ICC last night, and couldn't seem to heal very well.

I didn't notice the healing change to HS. What I did notice is that it seems to crit a lot less now. In fact, my HS crit so often before yesterday's patch that I never even realized IoL was proc-based - I thought it was automatic from casting a HS. Last night it wasn't uncommon to cast four HSs and have none of them crit.

Without the speed buff, it seems that by the time I cast a heal on someone, something like Chain Heal has already healed them. It's very discouraging.
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85 Draenei Paladin
3915
Priests- Renew, PoM. PW:Barrier, Desperate Prayer (Long CD, I know)
Shaman- Riptide, Earth Shield, CLEANSING heals as much as HS currently
Druids- HoTs and Swiftmend with equally powered casted heals.
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85 Draenei Paladin
3915
Yeah, the HS nerf was incredibly obvious.

Healing output sucks now.
Edited by Holysquid on 11/24/2010 3:30 PM PST
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
0
Word of Glory + Eternal Glory was what needed to be nerfed, if anything. It's far more powerful than HS.

It was that synergy (and Blessed Life), which brought frustration to so many, not HS.

I'd rather have a strong signature heal, and a weaker WoG.

EDIT - As an aside I think the Light of Dawn change was poorly thought out. Forcing Paladins to choose between WoG and LoD to spend their Holy Power is a bad move. On its face it seems reasonable: "choose between AoE and single target." In practice though I don't see it working out that way.

First there's the fact that WoG heals for a very nice chunk of health. Second, that heal can be 'splashed' (in a lesser amount) to two additional targets; the casting Paladin and the beacon. On top of this the spell has a 30% chance to not even use Holy Power.

That's a lot more attractive to me than a 5-player cone heal, even if it prefers lower-HP targets. Adding Light of Dawn to Eternal Glory might make the difference though.


uh... Glyphed its 6 targets... and then it also heals you and your beaconed target. So you didn't quite think that through. It's pretty insane.
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85 Draenei Paladin
3915
Yeah, it really is disappointing. I'm hoping some kind of response or something, Holy Shock really did become a bad heal.
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90 Human Paladin
10190
http://www.mmo-champion.com/content/2076-PTR-4.0.3a-Build-13316-Tol-Barad-Preview-6th-Anniversary-Blue-Posts

Holy

* Holy Shock base healing reduced by 33%, from [ 3943 - 4272 ] to [ 2628 - 2847 ]

I did see this in advance. It did need to be in the patch notes. It's a black mark against Blizzard that it wasn't (I'm sure their crying crocodile tears of sorrow over the omission). After 4.0.3a was patched and I cast my first Holy Shock, I immediately recognized that the note above was correct. Yes, it has negatively impacted my healing.

I healed a 25-man ICC last night. I literally respent my points and jumped into the raid five seconds after. The healing done by myself, a disc priest, and 2 out of 3 druids was 4000-5000 and 5000-6000 (druid number three as doing 1000-2000 less than the rest of us) HPS on the first six boss fights. I was healing the MT who never died during the raid.

I experienced no mana disasters (such as nearly going oom with no options) until Festergut, who we did last out of the first six. We lost the disc priest and picked up shammy, so we had four raid healers. At the start of the fight, four party members were slain. (I got a report later than one ranged decided to run between two others, got hit by the Vile Gas, and wound up spreading it; three died and someone else died while the healers tried to heal those going down.) One of the dead in the ranged was a healer. On this fight only, my mana went to zero about half-way through because I was frantically spamming Flash of Light to try and keep the raid alive, and sure enough, ran out of mana. Holy Shock and WoG during this time? Their availability times were so far apart as to be nearly meaningless. Holy Light? I noticed for the first time a severe reduction in the number of triggered cast-time procs that make Holy Light castable (versus its normal deathly-slow speed). Also, I was Holy Power starved, but that was probably because I was using WoG on availability and wanted more. Daybreak typically triggered right after Holy Shock went on CD, and so wasn't particularly useful, except to try and distract me into trying to cast Holy Shock while it was on CD, which was somewhat frustrating.

No, I do not know why the RL put two druids healers out in the ranged where a Vile Gas mistake could kill one off, but I wasn't running the raid.

Otherwise, mana was barely acceptable during the raid overall. I was using a Mojo Flask, mana food, an Int scroll, and we had the mage Mana/SP buff.

I expect I would still be toast for mana on the LK fight. When I was on my only attempt on 10-man LK on this toon before 4.0.3a, I was running out of mana long before the fight was over and I and still expect no difference now. Even my mana-happy druid was almost dry on Monday's win against the LK. I am glad we did it before the increase to Rejuvenation's mana cost yesterday.

I saw someone praising Paladin mana efficiency further up-topic. I cannot disagree more. While pally mana efficiency is not quite as bad as post 4.0.1, we aren't in a great position. It can't even be rated as good. As I noted above, I would call it barely acceptable and basically useless against the LK. (We did take a guest pally healer with us on our 10-man ICC run on Monday who had dramatically better gear than my pally and he made it through. We chatted after the win and despite him being a stellar healer and player (he has Bane of the Fallen King), he also agreed that pallies had been severely disadvantaged since 4.0.1. The only place I find people praising pally healers is here on this forum. That's it. I know multiple pally healers from before 4.0.1 who have simply given up and gone prot or ret or rerolled. Finding tank healers lately has been difficult.)

Claims I should, "Wait until Cataclysm when you get the upcoming spells," will find no hold with me. My toon should work under the current environment, not some future environment, no matter how near.
Edited by Eyvn on 11/24/2010 4:58 PM PST
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85 Draenei Paladin
3915
Thanks for providing an actual link, hopefully it scales really well towards 85.
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85 Draenei Paladin
3915
Yeah, leaving it out of the notes really is a bit stupid.
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90 Human Paladin
10190
The amount of healing by holy shock definitely caught a nerf. I'm having to cast holy light in lowbie dungeons a LOT more, but then again, that was probably their intention.
Except that the speed-boost procs for Holy Light provided in 4.0.1 really don't go off as much anymore. Basically, Speed of Light was altered and provides a permanent small speed boost instead of a procing large boost; and so we get less procs and the permanent boost is too small to really help Holy Light.

If it weren't for the T10 4pc bonus, Holy Light would be beyond worthless. I know. I started out 4.0.1 still using T9 (with its non-functional 2pc bonus), and using Holy Light felt like wielding a dead hippopotamus. Only Infusion of Light and Speed of Light (4.0.1) proced at the same time made Holy Light usable. Only the addition of the T10 4pc bonus made Holy Light appear to be of any value (rather than simply be usable). The .4 second casting times I occasionally received made Holy Light a worthwhile spell. Now, in 4.0.3a, we've dropped to the very low edge of usability. Not fast enough anymore and generating no Holy Power on criticals, Holy Light is totally lackluster.

Of course, the T11 set has dropped the speed boost for Holy Light in favor of a crit boost. I don't know what they're thinking, but with the Speed of Light (4.0.3a) change, and with Holy Light criticals no longer generating Holy Power, Holy Light will be so slow and generate so few returns as to edge toward useless. Yet Holy Light is somehow viewed by Blizzard as being a major Paladin healing spell? What? Come again? What am I missing here?

When the scatology has hit the rotating blades and you need to cast a spell every second (or near second) you can't ever push the Holy Light button unless heavy speed boost procs are up, and they are up far less often in 4.0.3a and as gear upgrades come along, they'll be up even less. :(

Yes, I see that Speed of Light works with Holy Radiance. I have even seen Cataclysm beta videos where Holy Paladins praise Holy Radiance. Holy Radiance isn't yet available and I'm trying to heal now. My toon should work in the current environment, not in some future environment, no matter how "close" that new environment is to Blizzard. Pallies have been getting raked over the coals of an incomplete see-sawing tool set for weeks now.


Edit..I was going to mention the 33% healing reduction that they only mentioned once, on a PTR build, but seemed to leave it out of the live patch notes. I can't imagine any single good reason to leave such a significant change out of patch notes.
Blizzard has stated over and over again that not all changes will appear in the patch notes. If Blizzard thinks that this policy makes them look good in the eyes of their paying customers, I have news: it doesn't. In fact, it strongly points to something else.

Blizzard, is there any chance you might want to move on from operating as a CMM Level 1 organization to, I don't know, CMM Level 2 or 3?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capability_Maturity_Model#Levels
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85 Dwarf Paladin
6850
Holy Shock lost something somewhere. It could be a bug, a change in a talent that no longer effects HS, or maybe the ability itself actually was nerfed.

Sad day. Well, some things have to be done.
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