City Tabards and BC Dungeons

(Locked)

90 Blood Elf Warlock
10775
It's probably technical, especially if you consider that rep gain in BC is dungeon specific , i.e. each dungeon provides reputation to one faction only
85 Troll Shaman
4520
It's probably technical, especially if you consider that rep gain in BC is dungeon specific , i.e. each dungeon provides reputation to one faction only


That works, but doesn't explain 68-79 normal wrath instances. **Wrath tabards never gave rep in normal instances but those tabards specifically stated level 80 instances**

per the hotfix post that was linked in the blue post on this thread it states:
"Players should now be able to champion a capital city and earn reputation in Heroic and normal Wrath of the Lich King dungeons while wearing that city's tabard."

Heroic AND Normal. This was not specified as Normal 80 only. If it's just 80 normal, and heroics then please state that.

Also, the non 80 wrath instances give Horde Expedition/whatever the alliance version is. While wearing a city tabard do you still get rep with Horde Expedition/allyfaction?
100 Orc Warrior
13225
Is there any particular reason you don't want to allow rep from 60-79? It just seems odd that all of a sudden you start doing outland quests and the you stop getting rep when you go into the dungeons.


I agree that it definitely seems odd from a player perspective.

However, I think you're exaggerating to assume that the designers "don't want to allow rep" in certain situations (like from 60-79). It seems more likely that they simply never thought about the 60-79 dungeons.

It doesn't help that the tooltips on the new tabards are vague to the point of being misleading. The Orgrimmar Tabard says: "You champion the cause of Orgrimmar. All reputation gains while in dungeons will be applied to your standing with them." Players put on the tabard, found that it didn't work the way the tooltip said, and submitted bug reports.

To compare, the WotLK tabards had much better tooltips. "You champion the cause of the Kirin Tor. All reputation gains while in level 80 dungeons will be applied to your standing with them." This gives much better guidance about which dungeons will be affected by the tabard.


But going back to the new City tabards, note that the tooltip does not promise that you will get any particular amount rep. You could get zero rep. The tooltip only promises that if you do get rep, the rep will apply to your standing with the city you are championing.
Edited by Inushi on 12/2/2010 11:57 AM PST
Community Manager
Is there any particular reason you don't want to allow rep from 60-79? It just seems odd that all of a sudden you start doing outland quests and the you stop getting rep when you go into the dungeons.


http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1127000356?page=2#32 :)

I can see how the current tooltip(s) for the new faction tabards may be confusing, though, and will be happy to pass those concerns along to our designers.
100 Tauren Shaman
12785
As the heroic keys remain for outland dungeons, people should be getting the appropriate reputation for the dungeon they are in to get heroic keyed for these anyways.
85 Troll Shaman
4520
Is there any particular reason you don't want to allow rep from 60-79? It just seems odd that all of a sudden you start doing outland quests and the you stop getting rep when you go into the dungeons.


<a href="http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1127000356?page=2#32" target="_new">http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1127000356?page=2#32</a> :)

I can see how the current tooltip(s) for the new faction tabards may be confusing, though, and will be happy to pass those concerns along to our designers.


This still doesn't answer why no rep with regular non 80 wrath instances while wearing the city tabard.
85 Gnome Priest
1160
Is there any particular reason you don't want to allow rep from 60-79? It just seems odd that all of a sudden you start doing outland quests and the you stop getting rep when you go into the dungeons.


<a href="http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1127000356?page=2#32" target="_new">http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1127000356?page=2#32</a> :)

I can see how the current tooltip(s) for the new faction tabards may be confusing, though, and will be happy to pass those concerns along to our designers.


This still doesn't answer why no rep with regular non 80 wrath instances while wearing the city tabard.


She edited her post. It seems they decided to have them not reward reputation either.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1127000356?page=1#9

I'm sad :( I wanted a tiger before I hit 80.
Edited by Hiyotiyo on 12/2/2010 12:13 PM PST
85 Troll Shaman
4520
Is there any particular reason you don't want to allow rep from 60-79? It just seems odd that all of a sudden you start doing outland quests and the you stop getting rep when you go into the dungeons.


<a href="http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1127000356?page=2#32" target="_new">http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1127000356?page=2#32</a> :)

I can see how the current tooltip(s) for the new faction tabards may be confusing, though, and will be happy to pass those concerns along to our designers.


This still doesn't answer why no rep with regular non 80 wrath instances while wearing the city tabard.


She edited her post. It seems they decided to have them not reward reputation either.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1127000356?page=1#9

I'm sad :( I wanted a tiger before I hit 80.


Thats just not reasonable though. Outland instances are understandable as you need the rep to get the keys to even do heroic. But there is no reason you need to get horde expedition/ally version.

So because I didn't know that it was 1-60, then 80 normal and heroics that only give rep and didn't find out til I was in outland on my alt now I have to wait until 80 to start getting rep? I read forums and mmo and keep up to date with things but this is still an ongoing discussion.

Not to mention that leveling is super fast now and I was in outland within 3 days of troll druids going live.

I can understand that if you overpower the instance they don't want you to get the same amount as if it were heroic, but make it so level 80s get less rep if it's not heroic? They did that with the 1-60 instances why not wrath 68-80 normals?
85 Tauren Druid
9460
so its 1-60 then 80 and heroic 80 and up.


Correct. If you find any errant behavior beyond that, be sure to drop our Quality Assurance department a note in the Bug Report forum. :)


I have to be honest. This position (the designers' assertion that you not be allowed to gain city rep in that 61 to 79 band) doesn't make much sense at all. What is the rationale?
Community Manager
This still doesn't answer why no rep with regular non 80 wrath instances while wearing the city tabard.


Similar to Outland dungeons, there are technical limitations which we must first overcome for this to be possible. It's a bit complicated, but hopefully I can explain.

In Wrath of the Lich King, we implemented a system that allowed players to champion factions by wearing a corresponding tabard; however, that system was limited and only supported level 80 dungeons (including Heroics). Fortunately, we were able to incorporate the new city tabards into this system through a hotfix, but the same rules and restrictions still apply. If we want to allow the new city tabards to provide reputations gains in all Northrend dungeons, we'll have to completely retrofit the entire Wrath of the Lich King tabard system -- which is something we may consider tackling in a future patch.

Does that make sense? If not, let me know. :)
30 Undead Warlock
400
I have to be honest. This position (the designers' assertion that you not be allowed to gain city rep in that 61 to 79 band) doesn't make much sense at all. What is the rationale?


The rationale is that you need to read more then one post. This has been answered by blue 3 times in this thread. If you still cannot understand it then perhaps you should try another game.
Community Manager
Alright, you crazy diamonds. I'm seeing a lot of repeat questions in this thread that have already been answered. If you're interested in this topic -- which I know many of you are, and that's actually really cool -- then I'd sincerely encourage you to read through all of my posts from the beginning. Quite of bit of information has been shared that should address your concerns. Don't worry about having to scroll, though; you can easily hop from response to response by clicking on the little "BLIZZ" button in the right-hand corner of each blue post.

Thanks!
85 Troll Shaman
4520
This still doesn't answer why no rep with regular non 80 wrath instances while wearing the city tabard.


Similar to Outland dungeons, there are technical limitations which we must first overcome for this to be possible. It's a bit complicated, but hopefully I can explain.

In Wrath of the Lich King, we implemented a system that allowed players to champion factions by wearing a corresponding tabard; however, that system was limited and only supported level 80 dungeons (including Heroics). Fortunately, we were able to incorporate the new city tabards into this system through a hotfix, but the same rules and restrictions still apply. If we want to allow the new city tabards to provide reputations gains in all Northrend dungeons, we'll have to completely retrofit the entire Wrath of the Lich King tabard system -- which is something we may consider tackling in a future patch.

Does that make sense? If not, let me know. :)


Yes, I was not aware that the Wrath normal instances had the same technical limitations as Outland instances, that and the original link that stated the hotfix made Wrath normal and heroic give rep made it seem like *all* normal 68-80. Thank you.
I have to be honest. This position (the designers' assertion that you not be allowed to gain city rep in that 61 to 79 band) doesn't make much sense at all. What is the rationale?


In the beginning there was no such thing as tabard rep.
And dungeons never gave any rep.
That mechanic did not even exist.

In BC they introduced specific dungeon rep.
Specific dungeons gave rep for specific factions. Hellfire Citadel gave rep to Thrallmar or Honor Hold. That's it. Specific dungeon for specific faction.

In Wrath they introduced the mechanic of "tabard rep" but only for level 80 and Wrath heroic dungeons.

They were able to easily translate the "tabard rep" mechanic to the new City tabards and include the 60 and below dungeons.

They would have to drastically reprogram the BC dungeons and the non 80 Wrath dungeons to meld them into the tabard rep mechanic.

As the Blue said, there is a possibility in the future that this may be done.
Edited by Grunkag on 12/2/2010 12:54 PM PST
90 Gnome Rogue
14725
...but if they did change BC dungeons how would I ever get my Cenarion War Hippogryph ? If they did that it would be:
a) Unobtainable as the exalted rep could only be got with specific dungeons (though the collifang armorments would get you there eventually in this example), though I suppose you could still grind without a tabard.
b) To easy by providing every faction with a tabard, leading to much QQ from people who have spent ages dungeon grinding to exalted.

Personally I think it should stay as it is until such time as the Outland is redesigned at some time in a future expansion.
Edited by Korquel on 12/2/2010 1:34 PM PST
85 Worgen Warlock
7700
Alright, you crazy diamonds. I'm seeing a lot of repeat questions in this thread that have already been answered.
I saw a mention of the phrase "crazy diamonds"... are you speaking directly at people with the Insane title who also have Shen'dralar exalted or are you dropping hints about the Shen'dralar FoS? Personally I'd like to see something like a title or an award for people who had the insane title with Shen'dralar exalted to go along with the FoS, because that was the hardest thing I ever achieved in this game, and it was really fun. The fact that Bliz nerfed the achievement so anyone can get it by facerolling a few easy reps is really a sore point for me. Of course you can feel free to ignore me, because I tend to babble and you would too if you had done that achievement. I also bark at cars sometimes and yawn repeatedly during business meetings, but only if someone is asking me a question.
100 Goblin Priest
14090
...but if they did change BC dungeons how would I ever get my Cenarion War Hippogryph ? If they did that it would be:
a) Unobtainable as the exalted rep could only be got with specific dungeons (though the collifang armorments would get you there eventually in this example), though I suppose you could still grind without a tabard.
b) To easy by providing every faction with a tabard, leading to much QQ from people who have spent ages dungeon grinding to exalted.

Personally I think it should stay as it is until such time as the Outland is redesigned at some time in a future expansion.


or more likely, when wearing a tabard you gain the tabard factions rep and when when not wearing one you gain rep with the faction of that dungeon
90 Gnome Rogue
14725
I saw a mention of the phrase "crazy diamonds"... are you speaking directly at people with the Insane title who also have Shen'dralar


I think is just a pink floyd reference, but if you have the Insane you can make of it what you will
28 Night Elf Druid
180
I saw a mention of the phrase "crazy diamonds"... are you speaking directly at people with the Insane title who also have Shen'dralar


I think is just a pink floyd reference, but if you have the Insane you can make of it what you will


second this one - and you beat me so very closely ;)
This topic is locked.

Please report any Code of Conduct violations, including:

Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.

Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.

Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.

Forums Code of Conduct

Report Post # written by

Reason
Explain (256 characters max)

Reported!

[Close]