Returning tank

80 Human Paladin
4255
Hey all:

So, took a couple months off the game and am returning now. Looking to tank again and read up on all the changes post 4.0, etc. Is an understatement to say that a lot has changed.

Basically, I just want to make sure that I understood everything I read. Last I played, everything was EFFECTIVE HEALTH...meaning stam+armor. Now it seems that, with the removal of defense, the priority is getting that 102.4 avoidance, correct?

I re-gemmed and re-enchanted and reforged just about every piece of gear I had and just want to make sure everything looks ok and I didn't gimp myself somewhere in the process.

My goal was to get the 87.4 (which I just barely attained) without sacrificing stam...still lost about 2k health and the cloak armor enchant. Even had to put a full parry gem in a red slot, which was tough due to my EH mindset. I also sacrificed hit down to just above 8% and expertise down to 16 (glyphed Seal of Insight to get it up to 26, which should be the cap, correct?)

So really just want some of y'all to take a look and say "Yup, that all looks good" or "Well, you can tweak this and this" or "HA HA noob, you just wasted your gold, go spend a ton more and do this, this and this which you should've done the first time"
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
8600
Basically we have a clunky priority rotation now that involves combo points...I mean um, Holy Power. DI is gone, Holy Shield is only Holy Shield in name now... Consecrate is pretty much dead... This class should be called the Warougeadin now because that's what it plays like imo. It says I'm still a Pally, it just doesn't play like one any longer. Anyways...

Tanking basics still apply. Hit and expertise atm is our biggest threat stats. Hit cap is 8% and you want your expertise between 26 and 55. After that try for EH and 102.4 avoidance, lol. Good luck!
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
9205
Basically we have a clunky priority rotation now that involves combo points...I mean um, Holy Power. DI is gone, Holy Shield is only Holy Shield in name now... Consecrate is pretty much dead... This class should be called the Warougeadin now because that's what it plays like imo. It says I'm still a Pally, it just doesn't play like one any longer. Anyways...

Tanking basics still apply. Hit and expertise atm is our biggest threat stats. Hit cap is 8% and you want your expertise between 26 and 55. After that try for EH and 102.4 avoidance, lol. Good luck!

I think you just don't like the way the paladin is now. I think our rotation is actually fairly smooth is pretty static for the most part and don't have threat issues. It can change a bit at the start if you are trying to build up enough threat on AOE tanking but other than that, it stays the same.

Right now don't bother going for 102.4% (87.4%) avoidance, it's pretty much impossible right now with the change to holy shield. You don't even have to be avoidance capped to do well anyways right now and won't have to be to start tanking raids at 85. It's still best to aim for that but it's not required.

The reason why I mention it's impossible because holy shield now gives 10% block (damage reduction) instead of 15% block chance like last patch. Basically, I find this a good change since we get 40% damage reduction when we block melee swings now.

From the looks of your profile, you are fine on your avoidance right now and were right to reforge to mastery. Basically a guide to know when to reforge to mastery is at around 21.5% for both parry and dodge off the top of my head if I recall. At that point diminishing returns kick in and mastery beats both parry and dodge. You can focus on mastery on a lower percentage for parry/dodge if you like but that's basically the focus.

Threatwise, you'll need 25 expertise (23 right now at 80 if I recall) and 8% hit rating like always. If you get the seal of truth glyph, you should be fine on expertise with your current gear.



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85 Blood Elf Paladin
8600
I think you just don't like the way the paladin is now. I think our rotation is actually fairly smooth is pretty static for the most part and don't have threat issues.



You're right, I do not like the class changes as far as giving us combo points, etc.

Our rotation is far from smooth compared to the 969 rotation where something was always off a GCD. Now that (among other things) is reliant on rng procs. If you don't proc an AS CD at the right time you will be sitting on your hands a few seconds doing nothing. It breaks the cadence of a "smooth" rotation which makes it have a clunky feel.

Threat isn't much of a problem on single targets as long as people use aggro dumping abilitys and misdirects. AoE threat can cause problems (yes I know how to TAB) particularly if fighting for aggo with a DK or Druid tank.

Personally I do not find tanking with a Paladin any easier or any more difficult than it used to be. I do however find it clunky, annoying and heavily reliant on rng. Probably just going to move on to my DK tank truth be told.
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4 Blood Elf Hunter
0
sorry gonna have to disagree. our rotation to me certainly doesn't feel clunky. Feels smooth and i have no problem with it other then not haven't enough threat at the start of a fight which blizzard already corrected in cata (when its released)

And AoE threat is no problem at all for me. any time a dps pulls a mob from me its their own fault as blizzard intended.

these problems you talk about runs down to personal taste. these changes may not be your cup of coffee. with such extreme changes not everyone will be happy with them. sorry you don't enjoy the class as it is now. But for this nearly 6 year paladin I'm enjoying it immensely.
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85 Human Paladin
6435

Our rotation is far from smooth compared to the 969 rotation where something was always off a GCD. Now that (among other things) is reliant on rng procs. If you don't proc an AS CD at the right time you will be sitting on your hands a few seconds doing nothing. It breaks the cadence of a "smooth" rotation which makes it have a clunky feel.


Our rotation is not dependent on AS procs. Very much the opposite. AS procs are an after thought for us. CS -> J -> CS -> X -> CS -> ShoR. If you have AS off cooldown you place it in the X, otherwise use HW, and if for some odd reason both are on cooldown you use Cons. There should never be a few seconds where you do nothing.
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