Please give missiles back

Why is it necessary at all to make arcane missiles require a proc that's removed by brain freeze and hot streak?

Why can't it just be stronger, as it was before, for arcane with a proc but still usable for frost and fire specs?

It seems like completely unnecessary removal of a fun spell from 2/3 mage specs.

Edited by Buglamp on 12/1/2010 8:59 AM PST
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85 Draenei Shaman
9805
Because everyone complained that they wanted to use Fire and Frost spells, respectively.
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It doesn't have to be used in a raid rotation to still be available to all specs.

I can still cast arcane blast as frost. I can still cast frostbolt as fire. Etc.
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90 Goblin Mage
5995
Agreed, well timed arc missles were another one of those subtle differences that separated strong arena mages from average. I was definitely dissapointed to see this go - it had a unique niche and was not even close to overpowered.
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85 Blood Elf Mage
5890
Don't spec Brain Freeze or Hot Streak if you want to keep your Missiles?
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2 Dwarf Hunter
0
1. Because there were a million threads about, "I'm X spec and don't want to be forced to use Y school. If I wanted to use Y school I would have speced into that tree instead"

2. Brain Freeze and Hot Streak can arguably be more powerful than AM (I don't know the numbers on this so this is ballparking). Both are instant so there isn't fear of interrupt and you can remain mobile, and both do good damage.

3. Flavor?

4. Because it makes the game easier. You remove certain options that only highly skilled players took advantage of and the spec becomes more friendly to mediocre players. Lowering the skillcap is a good way to remove outliers.
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90 Goblin Mage
5995
1. Because there were a million threads about, "I'm X spec and don't want to be forced to use Y school. If I wanted to use Y school I would have speced into that tree instead"

2. Brain Freeze and Hot Streak can arguably be more powerful than AM (I don't know the numbers on this so this is ballparking). Both are instant so there isn't fear of interrupt and you can remain mobile, and both do good damage.

3. Flavor?


None of this explains why I can't spend mana to cast an unprocced, untalented AM.

4. Because it makes the game easier. You remove certain options that only highly skilled players took advantage of and the spec becomes more friendly to mediocre players. Lowering the skillcap is a good way to remove outliers.


I guess if your goal is dumbing down the game, then yea, mission accomplished. Lame.
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2 Dwarf Hunter
0
1. Because there were a million threads about, "I'm X spec and don't want to be forced to use Y school. If I wanted to use Y school I would have speced into that tree instead"

2. Brain Freeze and Hot Streak can arguably be more powerful than AM (I don't know the numbers on this so this is ballparking). Both are instant so there isn't fear of interrupt and you can remain mobile, and both do good damage.

3. Flavor?


None of this explains why I can't spend mana to cast an unprocced, untalented AM.

4. Because it makes the game easier. You remove certain options that only highly skilled players took advantage of and the spec becomes more friendly to mediocre players. Lowering the skillcap is a good way to remove outliers.


I guess if your goal is dumbing down the game, then yea, mission accomplished. Lame.


Actually, it kind of does.

They wanted more randomness so fire/frost already had their random proc, arcane needed one too. In order to reduce redundancy (i.e. getting hot streak and AM procs) and after listening to countless threads about it (I DONT WANNA CAST FROST SPELLS AS A FIRE MAGE!!!!!) it's likely that they decided to have the fire/frost specific proc talents override it.

I'm no claiming to know why it is the way it is in any way, shape or form. I'm simply tossing out observations based on how I've seen the game change. Being able to hardcast them would probably incur a hefty mana cost and goes a bit counter to how it seems they want the spec's to play.
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They would not be cast in PvE for Frost or Fire so all that is irrelevant. :|

Mostly, PvP Mages want them back because they were our only option for damage on LoSing targets. We don't need them to deal enough damage as non-arcane specs that they end up forced into fire or frost PvE rotations.

Brain Freeze and Hot Streak are also just not talents you can really afford to skip just to keep missiles.
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2 Dwarf Hunter
0
Honestly I don't know why they haven't changed the LoS channel thing yet. There is no way a channeled spell should continue to hit after someone has gone out of LoS (heal or damage spell). When a caster gets away from a melee, the melee doesn't finish their autoattack and land one more ability before being considered out of range (Yes I primarily play melee but I've played enough games as casters to know how good using channeled spells to snipe people LoSing is).
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It's a good mechanic I think, other than on mana drain which shouldn't exist anyway.

Mages are irritatingly weak to being LoSed as we have no significant DoTs except as lolfire, and missiles certainly wasn't and still isn't overpowered damage either.
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- World of Warcraft
90 Human Mage
10015
Because if it's stronger than the other nukes but always available, it's all you use. If it's weaker, you never use it. They wanted it to be available and attractive to Fire and Frost while leveling, when we had relatively few buttons to press, but to be attractive it had to be stronger than Fireball and Frostbolt. Therefore, it couldn't be available full time, or it would be the only nuke used.
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85 Night Elf Druid
7500
missiles being removed from frost/fire really made no sense at all =\
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90 Draenei Hunter
10330
Old AM would solve no LoS deficiencies whatsoever.
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90 Goblin Mage
5995
Because if it's stronger than the other nukes but always available, it's all you use. If it's weaker, you never use it. They wanted it to be available and attractive to Fire and Frost while leveling, when we had relatively few buttons to press, but to be attractive it had to be stronger than Fireball and Frostbolt. Therefore, it couldn't be available full time, or it would be the only nuke used.


We're not talking about PVE here. :( As far as the justification you listed, they could have made it available as a proc while leveling, but still castable for mana (just like it was pre-4.0)...

In a PVP setting, it was ONLY used to combat LoS. It didn't do incredible damage, nor was it mana efficient. Think of it as a DPS utility spell.
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85 Orc Warlock
5930
It kind of feels like they turned AM into a training wheels proc. If you level a Mage (Dwarf at least, I can only presume the same is true for other starter zones) right now you get a quest at like level 6, to go outside and attack a training dummy until AM procs, and then use it. They make you do this a couple of times to get an understanding of the proc system, and recognize the Power Auras thing they put on there. They then take that proc away (well, they give you the option, but you're gonna take those instant cast pyroblasts, lets face it) if you went Fire or Frost and give you a totally different proc to worry about, putting AM on the backburner.
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Because if it's stronger than the other nukes but always available, it's all you use. If it's weaker, you never use it. They wanted it to be available and attractive to Fire and Frost while leveling, when we had relatively few buttons to press, but to be attractive it had to be stronger than Fireball and Frostbolt. Therefore, it couldn't be available full time, or it would be the only nuke used.


It doesn't need to compete with Frostbolt damage or have any affect on PvE at all, to still be an important tool for PvP.

Frost doesn't have anything else to take the place of Arcane Missiles for doing damage to LoSing targets, so we will use it even it's not stronger than other nukes, because sometimes a channel that does weak damage is > a nuke in PvP.


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- World of Warcraft
90 Human Mage
10015
Sharki, unless you're talking about something that literally does not touch PvE in any way, you are always talking about PvE, whether or not you mean to.

And it might, just might, be that they weren't particularly interested in supporting the use of an ability to violate LOS rules.

Bidby, yes, that's essentially right, I believe. It helps new players get used to the idea of abilities that are available on procs and preferable to the abilities you use the rest of the time, and then gives way later on to more spec-specific procs.
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We are serious, it literally would no touch PvE in any way.

Frost and Fire didn't cast missiles in PvE before, and missiles haven't been buffed to be superior to scorch or fireball or whatever fire DPSes with, or frostbolt/IL damage. They'd still be an Arcane only thing in PvE.

Mind Flay and Drain Life/Mana are both stronger than missiles and still ignore LoS so I don't think they have an issue with "violating" LoS rules. And...arcane can still ignore LoS with missiles so...yeah.
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- World of Warcraft
90 Human Mage
10015
I didn't say they were deliberately trying to prevent it from violating LOS rules. I said they probably had no interest in supporting its use for such a purpose. Meaning that it's unlikely that they would give much consideration to the effect on that use when making changes that they felt would improve the leveling experience (which is one type of PvE).
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