Save Alter Time!

They better not take away another of our end game abilities, they already took away our time warp. Alter Time is a perfect spell, it has a huse skill cap, defensive vs offensive, positional, dispelable,

A mage without time warp is a bm hunter without a pet.

I think its the PVERS crying its bugged

I have a fix , make it a skill "the level 15 tree" alter time / time warp / Ice flows (buffed a bit)

make pom and blazzing speed baseline
Edited by Freon on 1/29/2014 9:00 AM PST
make aoe spec specific flamestrike/blizz or AE (wouldc ut 2 buttons) , cone of cold (if they don't return the snare ever), they could get rid of ffb and make bf proc frostbolts that shatter,

why reduce buttons at all, this isn't diablo, there are 100 keys on a keyboand, x4 (alt,ctrl,shift,normal)
once they get over 400 buttons, then we talk.

I hate pve clickers that feel overwhelmed.
90 Troll Mage
3910
(we cant have blizzard and arcane explosion the same button. sometimes I use those spells separately, unless we are removing any and all signs of a different spec, based on the spec you choose... which Im not sure how I feel about that already... I dont want to be forced to use frost bomb over LB just because I chose frost as my spec.)

Ultimately the age old proverb: You cant make everyone happy.
This game has been around for a long time, so saying anything is kind of like moving a boulder, but.....

I've seen plenty of games, either in beta, or official, that constantly keep tweaking things back and fourth trying to make old school players happy while trying to bring in new players. In the end I've never seen it work. the old loyal players finally give up, while the new ones dont even try because they notice "Hey.. those people dont want to play this anymore?.... maybe theres something else out there..."

I doubt it, but if anyone if familiar with quakelive.com .... I partly left wow because I went to QL.com. I was in the beta for years, I even went to quakecon quite a few years in a row.
(its a webbased version of the old quake 3 arena game. my childhood game.)

At its peak it had something of upwards 20k players. we had huge que times to get on to play. Things were going awesome and great, we all felt like this would make a real comeback. fast forward a few years and the devs kept making dumb changes, stating it was to "help bring new people in"
After a while, the game stopped growing, instead reversing, and once devs stopped listening to the loyal players of how to make changes... The game fell flat on its face. the forward moving steam was lost.

Now I think a total of 50-100 people play it. Good luck finding a game. I cancelled my subscription and slinked my way back to WoW.

All Im saying is: Its never good to keep shaking things up, you wont make everyone happy, and the ones who really want to stick around will leave, and it will be too late to fix it.

I hope someone bothers to read that.
100 Gnome Mage
16050
01/29/2014 08:22 AMPosted by Akraen
Meh all you and Masta do is white knight Lissanda


I "white knight" for anyone when the discussion diverges from the topic at hand to belittling that player in order to devalue their viewpoint.

I'm sure Lhivera and Mumrit can both attest to my vehemently disagreeing with their viewpoints on several issues on these forums, but when people diverged from the topic to attack them, I defended them as well.

01/29/2014 08:40 AMPosted by Lhivera
I do think it's reasonably likely to become a pure utility cooldown.


It's possible, but as I said earlier. Due to the sheer amount of design/testing time that would be involved in making changes to an ability as complicated as AT, I don't think it seems likely.

01/29/2014 09:28 AMPosted by Beryii
I hope someone bothers to read that.


I did. Those are valid points you made.
Edited by Grizzlebeez on 1/29/2014 9:45 AM PST
90 Troll Mage
3910
I cant take any side on this topic really. I think I fall into the category of person that blizzard is looking at when they talk about AT.

True it seems like a difficult spell to use, and Ive been trying to play with it more... but as a "new" player, I just dont find a way to fit it in... Its true, I have a lot to keep track of, and in the heat of a PvP, I dont have time to question using/learning AT. (And when I PvE... it seems useless to me... I know its not, Im sure its a bit easier to use in PvE, but I havent even tried yet.)

I almost dont care if they remove the spell, but I also dont want to see haphazardly changes back and fourth. the mechanics of its use seem intriguing and I would like to see it stay. The biggest thing that gets me is the fact that it returns you to a spot... thats what seems useless to me, I cant get very far in 6 seconds, so why return me when I might not even move?
(Granted I guess in PvP I could AT, blink, and then return, thus really throwing someone off... but like I said, Im that posterchild new guy still trying to work so much stuff into my "almost"full action bars.

I want a minimalist play style. I purposely keep LOTS of stuff off my action bars, and I try my best to play with a little as possible. I am in NO WAY asking for a 2 button play style, and as a person who likes to tinker, I fully love and understand the "customization" and "combinations" of many buttons... but sometimes I just dont see the importance of something and I dont want to use it, or be forced to use it.... The story starts to change when you are getting frustrated and wondering why you cant keep up in PvP... makes you say "Do I need to mash more stuff?"
95 Night Elf Mage
16550
01/29/2014 08:34 AMPosted by Lissanda
That's why I am on the offensive.


The fact people have opinions and experiences that differ from your own is totally acceptable. Blizzard doesn't design the game around the idea that players have to agree on anything at any point in time. The debate isn't about people, it's about spells and design. Making the debate about people and their armories is utterly and entirely pointless.

The reason why I have green text is because I spend time worrying about people who aren't the best players in the world, because I believe that for Blizzard to be successful, they can't just cater to the small number of people who are totally perfect, hardcore, 14/14 Heroic raiders. Instead, they have to listen to a range of opinions, even from casual players whose lives are just too busy to care about what their up-time is on a particular spell, but instead care more about having fun and enjoying their life. So, I care about mechanics from a broader and bigger picture that is more important than myself. Blizzard wouldn't be a successful company if they had players vote on changes, or if they only listened to a tiny fraction of their player base.

Instead, it is okay for people to disagree - it is okay for me to not play totally perfectly because I have told the community many times that I stepped down from hardcore raiding to put my work focused on improving the lives of kids with autism and getting my PhD in psychology ahead of my DPS in raids. I think having WOW be something I do sub-optimally for fun doesn't make me a worse person, but just changes what my focus is.

I'd rather have spells that didn't kill me for raiding a couple hours at night when I'm tired after I'd been working 10 hours that day. I really don't expect Blizzard to actually change the game to make the spells work correctly and not be broken, but I can still dislike things I think are broken - and I can still enjoy playing my mage even if I make the choice to put work ahead of the game and retired from hardcore raiding 6 or so years ago.

For example, when you brought up Killing Spree: It's certainly unacceptable to me that if you use it on a surface that isn't flat, you have a chance of falling through the world and suffering death as a result. Sure, you could play better by only using killing spree on flat surfaces, but why shouldn't Blizzard just fix the problem where they designed a spell that randomly kills you?


Don't you even attempt to justify your green text by how you help others in a way that insinuates that I do not. I spend nearly a full time job's worth of time helping out mages at all item levels. Particularly those in-game who are int he 400's still.

Don't presume to have any idea how much other people, without green text, help others.

WoW relies on people without MVP tags assisting others. It's just about the only thing that keeps the community from degrading even further.

Now you've finally offended me, Lissanda.
100 Orc Shaman
10840
01/29/2014 05:30 AMPosted by Mumrit
A few of those aren't used in arena, three are engineering specific (I'm not one) and you can combine 40/41 into one button with a smart macro. :)


i wasnt supposed to use macros. thats why i just listed my ascendance once and not 4 times.

i dont want to put my mounts in a macro. i want to have a ground mount bound and a flying mount bound.

i also forgot to list a few (i was busy while making that list and lost a few while tabbing back and forth). like mage food, arena water, and didnt list any of my talent changes. even though primal elementalist gives me several extra binds due to pet abilities. but if you want to disqualify the list thats fine. i think its pretty clear i have 50 binds without any macros but w/es

01/29/2014 05:30 AMPosted by Mumrit
battle standard into his 'keys he always uses' in arena


i DO use battle standard in arena.

01/29/2014 05:30 AMPosted by Mumrit
And more pertinent to the original topic - Does the 'fun' of alter time outweigh it's negatives enough to justify it remaining in the game?


There are 0 negatives to alter time.

and i DO pve on my mage, i have yet to die or lose procs because of alter time.

01/29/2014 08:34 AMPosted by Lissanda
, because I believe that for Blizzard to be successful, they can't just cater to the small number of people who are totally perfect


I never understood why people can admit theyre bad at this game and still be adamant of trying to act like the 14/14heroic raider. If you know something is too skillful and above your head, just dont use it. Alter time is just like binds. If you cant handle it, dont try. If you are an amateur skate boarder, and you know you arent as good as Tony Hawk, why would you think you can jump on the half pipe and try to copy what he does? If you are a casual player just dont use alter time, until you can handle it. If its a source of confusion and frustration, just stop trying to force it.
100 Human Mage
15060
01/29/2014 10:00 AMPosted by Jkspiritlink
There are 0 negatives to alter time.

More than a few have been listed in this thread. Ignoring them doesn't make them go away. Because you like the ability (which is fine) doesn't mean they don't exist.

01/29/2014 10:00 AMPosted by Jkspiritlink
I never understood why people can admit theyre bad at this game and still be adamant of trying to act like the 14/14heroic raider.

There's a MASSIVE jump between 'bad' and 'perfect.'

If you've killed all the bosses on normal or even breached 2k in arena, you're likely in the top 10% of players in the world. Most players who post on the forums tend to be way above 'better than average' simply because they've played the game longer or invested time into learning it's mechanics.
Edited by Mumrit on 1/29/2014 10:10 AM PST
90 Troll Mage
15140
01/29/2014 10:00 AMPosted by Jkspiritlink
and i DO pve on my mage


Yo man I'm agreeing with what you're saying but don't lie.
MVP
90 Human Mage
10015
First, ad hominems are bad.

Second, JK: Taken in isolation, I could agree that AT is fine.

Taken in the context that Blizzard wants to reduce both the number of rotational buttons in general, and the number of DPS cooldowns specifically, AT is fair game for a culling. Personally, I hope it sticks around in a pure utility capacity, and think it will. But as a DPS cooldown, it seems a likelier candidate than spec-specific abilities like Icy Veins, Frozen Orb, Arcane Power, and Combustion. Mirror Image is also a very likely candidate. I'd bet a beer that MI goes away, and AT gets a utility-only revamp.

Grizzle: yeah, it's a significant change — but this is when they make such changes.
100 Human Mage
15060
01/29/2014 10:23 AMPosted by Lhivera
Mirror Image is also a very likely candidate. I'd bet a beer that MI goes away,

This would make me sad. So sad.
90 Troll Mage
3910
wait what?? Why would they remove MI?

I use that. ALL the time. thats pure DPS being taken away, not to mention a tank save when I get swamped in PvE.

I cant see a reason to remove Mirror AT ALL.

Are you going to give me a overall DPS boost and a longer lasting shield I can use while casting?

This "Remove MI" comment seems like a DUMB idea...
95 Night Elf Mage
16550
Mirror image is the reason I can solo some harder things.

Removing that would sap a lot of enjoyment out of the game.

Why do these things need to be removed? I just don't get it. I don't get the philosophy or the mindset.

Change them if they're causing a problem. If the pressure is on the DPS, then remove or lower the DPS. I'd take a DPS-less Mirror Image that still is a threat dump and decoy over removing it. It's a fun cosmetic and thematic ability as well.

Illusion magic is something I wish they'd give us more of, not less.

Doesn't just the fact that we're living in fear of losing abilities bother anyone else?
100 Human Mage
15060
01/29/2014 10:29 AMPosted by Beryii
I use that. ALL the time. thats pure DPS being taken away, not to mention a tank save when I get swamped in PvE.

They'd give us damage elsewhere to compensate. We would lose the button that we pressed, but gain more damage baked into other abilities.
100 Orc Shaman
10840
01/29/2014 10:21 AMPosted by Xiun
Yo man I'm agreeing with what you're saying but don't lie.


I'm not lying. I did CM's. Yes, i did one.

01/29/2014 10:08 AMPosted by Mumrit
More than a few have been listed in this thread. Ignoring them doesn't make them go away. Because you like the ability (which is fine) doesn't mean they don't exist.


They dont exist. The problems you have listed arent problems with the ability, its problems with the user. You use it incorrectly, of course its going to cause issues. Alter time is a tool, and like any other tool, if you use it improperly you're going run the risk of injury.

Posted by Jkspiritlink
I never understood why people can admit theyre bad at this game and still be adamant of trying to act like the 14/14heroic raider.

There's a MASSIVE jump between 'bad' and 'perfect.'

If you've killed all the bosses on normal or even breached 2k in arena, you're likely in the top 10% of players in the world


You missed the point entirely. If you accept that your dps isnt going to be amazing, why still try for "amazing"? Why not set a more realistic goal? If you are an average player, why not set for "above average" instead? You can ignore alter time completely and still hit your goal of "above average" DPS.
100 Orc Shaman
10840
01/29/2014 10:26 AMPosted by Mumrit
This would make me sad. So sad.


01/29/2014 10:29 AMPosted by Beryii
wait what?? Why would they remove MI?

I use that. ALL the time. thats pure DPS being taken away, not to mention a tank save when I get swamped in PvE.


Because its a garbage cooldown that doesnt add anything interesting to the class. Its been garbage for DPS since WOTLK, in Cata, its best usage was temporary tank when things hit the fan. Now in MoP they removed that.

01/29/2014 10:31 AMPosted by Mumrit
They'd give us damage elsewhere to compensate.


probably not. MI is so garbage there's no point. Its most likely just going to be removed and you'll just do the teeny bit less damage.
MVP
90 Human Mage
10015
MI is one of the highest DPET spells in our repertoire. Not sure where you're getting the idea that it's damage is bad.

But yes, it'd be more interesting as pure utility. Beef up the health, keep the damage animation but no numbers.
Edited by Lhivera on 1/29/2014 10:41 AM PST
90 Worgen Mage
11790
Soloing things without MI is just as easy. I wouldn't miss that button one bit.
90 Troll Mage
3910
Im still not enjoying this idea. What am I supposed to do? Go back the old days when I was lvl20 and I just let stuff keep hitting me in the face while I waited for them to die? Part of the fun of being a mage was the fact that... Oh.. I dont know... I was CASTING SPELLS FROM AFAR? The biggest killer for me is fighting stuff in my face. I might as well be a warrior since I didn't get to see the "spell animation" take flight...

It IS the little things that make you want to play something, right? I dont fine enjoyment at casting stuff thats going to go the same distance that I could just hit them with a sword.

What do you expect? that retarded thing of a "pet" you have given me to handle the tanking? Half the time I have no idea where he has wandered off too and- Oh look! he brought back friends with him! oh joy.
90 Troll Mage
3910
This surprises me. I didnt know there were so many people who disliked MI.

Remove it and give nothing else in return? Sigh.
This topic has reached its post limit. You may no longer post or reply to posts for this topic.

Please report any Code of Conduct violations, including:

Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.

Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.

Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.

Forums Code of Conduct

Report Post # written by

Reason
Explain (256 characters max)

Reported!

[Close]