What happened to the RP?

90 Draenei Mage
9795
Interestingly, in relation to Belf Age, go listen to Arator's conversation with the Honor Hold commander. It implies that Belfs age as humans do.
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During my time on WrA, I've come to notice three different "camps" of roleplayers: The serious roleplayers, the "lol" roleplayers, and the new roleplayers.

Serious roleplayers, ones like me, roleplay for pretty typical reasons; we like to immerse ourselves, we prefer to just converse and make friends rather than fight or be confrontational though that doesn't mean we aren't able to. We like to engage others and we try to be as respectful as we can in the hopes said respect will be returned in kind.

"lol" roleplayers live to bend the rules as much as they can, and more often than not end up breaking them. These are the ones who roleplay as children, vampires, house cats, and other such concepts. They like to find new creative ways of being intrusive/loud/noticed, often using /yell, various cosmetic effects, and clever MRP descriptions. And while they technically have as much a right to rp as serious roleplayers do, their very presence tends to irk serious roleplayers.

New roleplayers are just as they sound: new to rp, prone to make occasional mistakes, with their personality ultimately deciding whether they become a serious or "lol" rp'er.

Sadly, it seems at times that the "lol" rp'ers have a bigger presence than serious ones and that can really discourage both serious rp'ers and new rp'ers looking to find serious rp. Hopefully the scales will tip once Cata comes out but even so, if a little persistence is the price I pay for finding quality serious rp, I'll pay it gladly.
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90 Human Rogue
7665
...someone can't be a serious roleplayer and RP as a child?
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80 Blood Elf Rogue
2595
Children don't exist in WoW lore.

Those are all gnomes in the orphanage. Plotting.
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90 Human Rogue
7665
Damnit, I knew it. That explains why all of Senkha's baby pictures involve pink pigtails.
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12/04/2010 4:36 PMPosted by Eragìos
Interestingly, in relation to Belf Age, go listen to Arator's conversation with the Honor Hold commander. It implies that Belfs age as humans do.


Arator is a special case. He's a half-elf; his father is human. His conversation shouldn't be taken as representative of normal blood elf aging.
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85 Undead Rogue
4945
Q is a Grand Master billiards player with a pet cheetah.
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90 Troll Hunter
10605
12/04/2010 3:53 PMPosted by Vennel


Thats about how I am, but I read wowwiki to learn the lore about my character and what I should no. But Chris "Retcon/moneybags" metzen and his "you shouldn't get all your lore from one source, you should pay me for dozens of additional sources so you can actually know wtf is going on" policy (i paraphrased, so sue me) kind of pisses me off. So I'd much prefer reading that information for free than buying into this scam of his.



AAaaand this is when I stopped paying attention. The underlined part. Yeah.

Look, it sounds to me like you want to QQ. At every suggestion and shrug you go 'yeah, but-' and then go off on a whine fest like the above.

Yes, I am being blunt. Sorry, I just had to watch Due Date. My brain ceased functioning in its proper manner after the little dog doing a human and ew action part.

Anyway. Here's the deal.

You deal with it. We cannot control what other people do. Whining about immersion is kinda absurd when we have addons flashing all over the place, can see the whole body of our avatar (unless you are REALLY dedicated and do the uber-zoom thing), have a bar of attacks at the bottom of the screen, have to type every action and everything we say, AND when we say something speech bubbles appear.

Immersion is what you make of it. You can choose to react to these people ICly like they are insane. For instance, the guy biting your arm off. Act like the guy said out loud he turned into a dragon and bit your arm off and proceed to act like he is crazy. There, immersion issue solved. I am sure a lot of people have head injuries from the war and magic mishaps that can explain the multitude of insane people.

And because I know you will ask, the reason that line made me go -ppffhhht- is that this is a game. A game that has over 1000 people, way over that many, all contributing to lore. A game which has been alive for ten years. To expect that a whole complete story that is constantly growing can be found in this game is ridiculous. It would be impossible, unless this was designed like final fantasy. It isn't.

Heck, if a book of any beloved fantasy series had the option to be remade and re-edited and retconned whenever the author wanted, you would be shocked to see how many authors would RUSH to change their works. WoW's big and expansive lore and open status allows it, so it isn't surprising that it happens.

And when they write books to aid in the story, yeah, of course they are going to ask you to pay for it.

Now, do I think they could do a better job at least highlighting some key things that happened in the books in-game? Yeah. But really, this last run they did a much better job with the whole Cairne and why Thrall is gone stuff. Not so good with Fandral and Malfurion, but eh. At least they are improving.
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82 Blood Elf Paladin
2975
12/04/2010 7:32 PMPosted by Dziewanna

AAaaand this is when I stopped paying attention. The underlined part. Yeah.

Look, it sounds to me like you want to QQ. At every suggestion and shrug you go 'yeah, but-' and then go off on a whine fest like the above.

Yes, I am being blunt. Sorry, I just had to watch Due Date. My brain ceased functioning in its proper manner after the little dog doing a human and ew action part.

Anyway. Here's the deal.

You deal with it. We cannot control what other people do. Whining about immersion is kinda absurd when we have addons flashing all over the place, can see the whole body of our avatar (unless you are REALLY dedicated and do the uber-zoom thing), have a bar of attacks at the bottom of the screen, have to type every action and everything we say, AND when we say something speech bubbles appear.

Immersion is what you make of it. You can choose to react to these people ICly like they are insane. For instance, the guy biting your arm off. Act like the guy said out loud he turned into a dragon and bit your arm off and proceed to act like he is crazy. There, immersion issue solved. I am sure a lot of people have head injuries from the war and magic mishaps that can explain the multitude of insane people.

And because I know you will ask, the reason that line made me go -ppffhhht- is that this is a game. A game that has over 1000 people, way over that many, all contributing to lore. A game which has been alive for ten years. To expect that a whole complete story that is constantly growing can be found in this game is ridiculous. It would be impossible, unless this was designed like final fantasy. It isn't.

Heck, if a book of any beloved fantasy series had the option to be remade and re-edited and retconned whenever the author wanted, you would be shocked to see how many authors would RUSH to change their works. WoW's big and expansive lore and open status allows it, so it isn't surprising that it happens.

And when they write books to aid in the story, yeah, of course they are going to ask you to pay for it.

Now, do I think they could do a better job at least highlighting some key things that happened in the books in-game? Yeah. But really, this last run they did a much better job with the whole Cairne and why Thrall is gone stuff. Not so good with Fandral and Malfurion, but eh. At least they are improving.


Fair enough, perhaps I should have been a bit more clear. Retcon in and of itself isn't a problem. Too much retcon, too much additional stuff, ends up taking away from something.

Perhaps I am whining/@*#@@ing, what have you, a bit much. But the point stands that they should at least have a good enough bit of the lore on their main page for those that want it. We shouldn't have to pay more for the full story of a game when it's there. If WoW were any genre OTHER than a ROLEPLAYING game, I'd not have as many issues. But as a roleplaying game, it would behoove one to assume atleast a handfull of people will want to immerse themselves into the game. As such, I would hope they'd not make us pay for books to learn the whole story.

As for the retconning thing, some of it I'm happy for, if you looked at the original warcraft games (warcraft I & II) were very... well, flat, rather two dimensional. There wasn't a very deep story involved, mostly "heres some orcs from another planet, they fight humans, have fun." But other things, like the worgen, who were initially the product of a madman who looked for a way to make humans immune to the undead plague, and created the worgen. Only for two expansions later, to be retconned as the result of an ancient night elf who had a magic stick that infected people with druid wolf form stuff. Made little sense to me to be honest. Or even the draenei, who look like just something to give the alliance to make up for the fact they gave blood elves to the horde. In BC, there was rather sparse lore covering the draenei who land on azeroth, enough to explain their relation to the broken and the eradar and why they're here, but not enough to give them any sort of importance in the following two expansions. They're kind of just along for the ride.

Now, with that all said and done, are there other things I dislike? Yes of course, and there are also just as many if not more I do like, which are all the results of retcon. However, I think theres a bit too much retcon for the sake of retcon happening in a few areas, just to try and keep up with certain aspects of the game that break the cohesive feeling, preexisting facts/details give you when in WoW.
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100 Undead Rogue
9565
12/03/2010 9:08 PMPosted by Demitri
Harry Potter fanfiction


http://myimmortalrehost.webs.com/

Read that, and suddenly, you almost find yourself applauding sons of Arthas to be good RP'ers.
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90 Troll Hunter
10605
12/04/2010 10:56 PMPosted by Saino
12/03/2010 9:08 PMPosted by Demitri
Harry Potter fanfiction


http://myimmortalrehost.webs.com/

Read that, and suddenly, you almost find yourself applauding sons of Arthas to be good RP'ers.


Tried to read it. Got about 1 chapter in with laughter before it just became sad.

I still hope it was a troll. Boy, do I still hope it was a troll....

Of course, my favorites were the anime-Harry potter mash-ups. You know, the edgy american girl who didn't wear the uniform, had oddly colored eyes, a japanese nickname, and had some uber-special power that would ONLY be seen in anime?

Yeah. Good times, good times.

I still remember once sending a review filled with questions. Nicely phrased, but pretty much asking how this and this would be possible. The person send back a hate-filled not about how she was now 'going to go kill herself now, you jerk'.

Ah, teenagers.
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36 Orc Mage
170
12/04/2010 7:32 PMPosted by Dziewanna
Anyway. Here's the deal.

You deal with it. We cannot control what other people do.

Agreed. Consider it a test of your roleplaying skills.

Suppose someone named "Pallykillr" did try to start a roleplay with you. Upon beginning the roleplay, they introduce themselves as "Pallykillr". How would your character react? And suppose said person wasn't taking the roleplay seriously and used a lot of chat speak in their character's speech: lol, rofl, wtf, and so on. Don't react as you, the player, would; react as your character. Keep it as roleplay and challenge yourself with this kind of confrontation. Does your character think Pallykillr is crazy? Hit on the head too many times? Is offended because your character is a Paladin? Or maybe they're extremely curious (like the Gnome stereotype) and think the chat-speak is fascinating, thinking of it as a foreign language and trying to give some definition to those words.

Roleplaying servers are supposed to have different naming policies that can be reported, but I've heard of little action actually being taken against those who have broken those policies. Personally, I think Blizzard should take their roleplaying realms more seriously. There is no tutorial and little to no explanation of what a roleplaying server is or how the rules are different there. To the rest of the WoW community, roleplaying servers tend to be presented as "PvE servers with bad progression". Personally, I do think Blizzard should make more of an effort to show the difference of RP and RPPVP servers.

No matter what, though, there will always be trolls come to bother the roleplayers. It's pretty much a fact of WoW. Ignore it, report it or cope with it and move on.
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80 Tauren Warrior
4195
In regards to aging, the idea that long lived races age significantly slower than humans is odd to me. Look at our own history. Once upon a time an average lifespan of a normal male human was roughly 35 if not less. Did this mean that said human male was a full grown adult at a much younger age than a modern human male with a life expectancy in the 60's? Perhaps they aged at the same rate and matured at roughly the same rate (signs actually point to humans physically maturing earlier now than even a few hundred years ago), their classification in their respective culture was different though.

At 28, I would be considered fairly old in a hunter gatherer society. As it is, I still consider myself fairly young and can look to my late 50's parents as still active and not ancient. Our culture has changed and our expectations of what certain ages are responsible for and what social classification they fall in changed as well. No longer is it common in your early teens to have a few children popped out by 16, and to know your life could very well be half over by then.

My contention is that they aging rates are probably close to humanities, but the various races and cultures attached to them view the aged individual differently. To suggest after 13 years a blood elf is still an infant seems a tad... crazy to me. In theory, this would make the shortest lived races rather brilliant and able to pick up on skills far, far faster than the turtle paced developing long lived races. This idea doesn't make sense to me. I would suggest that that 13 year old blood elf would not be physically an infant, but would not hold the social status and responsibilities of a 13 year old let's say. The expectations of the culture and the race as tailored to their life spans, living conditions, cultural norms, expectations, and many other factors would be the decider in how that 13 year old was viewed.

There could invariably be some differentiation in how fast or slow a race develops physically and matures, but I do not think that it would vary as dramatically as some suggest. Think of cats and dogs. Different species, same general places in eco-spheres, and same general maturation rates. So it would seem logically that the playable races in WoW would follow suit.

This is of course my own personal opinion on the topic, take it how you will.
Edited by Okwáho on 12/5/2010 1:37 AM PST
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12/04/2010 8:32 PMPosted by Vennel
But other things, like the worgen, who were initially the product of a madman who looked for a way to make humans immune to the undead plague, and created the worgen. Only for two expansions later, to be retconned as the result of an ancient night elf who had a magic stick that infected people with druid wolf form stuff.


Actually, no. The plot following the night elf with the staff was in the original game. You followed a quest in Ashenvale out to Duskwood where you recovered the staff and put it into safe hands. Read the article at http://www.wowpedia.org/Velinde_Starsong and follow the quest links under "References"; from those pages you can visit the Wowhead pages and see that the quests are listed as "obsolete" by Blizzard, but there are comments on them dating from patch 2.0.

The Scythe of Elune is well-established and not a retcon. Blizzard merely elaborated on what happened to it once you put it into supposed safe hands.
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85 Tauren Druid
5685
"lol" roleplayers live to bend the rules as much as they can, and more often than not end up breaking them. These are the ones who roleplay as children, etc et al


Thoroughly untrue. RP concepts like children can be done and done well if the right "work" is put into making the character. My guild is full of very excellent, very serious RPers and we have two Tauren kids in the guild, this character being one of them. She's got two PC'd parents, one of whom just died in the Shattering. I've RPed with people who've played Blood Elf kids who were excellent RPers as well. A good backstory, good story writing skills, and a Small Feast goes a long way.

Bottom line: there's exceptions to every "rule".
Edited by Énapay on 12/5/2010 10:50 AM PST
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85 Worgen Warlock
4455
What happened is pretty simple.

Many folks in Blizzard actually were very avid about making this a grand experience for role players, since there was a community of folks that already did it in online matches in WC 3 and on forums and such-not. So they obviously wanted to finally appeal to this role playing medium in their MMO.

But it didn't stay long. Too many references to Pop-Culture, Fourth-Wall-Breaking vanity pets and other gadgets of those kind, people committing "RP War-Crimes" (Making guilds that are kingdoms, breaking lore, etc.) and ret-cons in the Lore impossible to ignore made role-playing in World of Warcraft a laughable notion to a lot of veteran D&D players and role-players. When several of those folks gravitated away, Blizzard stopped focusing on the RP community. And as far as I know, Metzen really doesn't have any interest in the role-playing community.

At least, that's what I think.

Either way and for whatever reason, the sort of role-playing communities and such Blizzard hoped to attract and wanted didn't come. They had no way to really enforce their role-playing realm/server policies, so Blizzard really stopped caring about it so much and gave up on it.

That and Metzen made the "Lore Department" re-write so much stuff once he got his position to write his stories a lot of serious-minded role-players steered clear and went to Lineage or Guild Wars or something else that actually advocated role-playing.

~Kalrechan

P.S. I don't have anything against Chris Metzen, I thoroughly enjoy his books and as stated in the Terms of Service, Blizzard has a right to change their game anyway they want to. I just feel like it's a mark against his creative ability when he has all this Lore that is really varied and well-written and very well thought out that he has to change it outright to write his story-lines.
Edited by Kalrechan on 12/5/2010 6:46 PM PST
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85 Human Mage
0
12/05/2010 7:07 PMPosted by Lohana
Perhaps I'm looking in the wrong places but I haven't seen any roleplay about since I started here on WRA.

Again - perhaps I'm not looking in the right spots, but Moon Guard(my old server) was chalk-full of the types that the OP mentioned.
Option A. Go to the home cities
Option B. Join a guild. They are awesome.
Option C. Roll Alliance. ^.^
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