Are people actually just spamming "Heal"...

85 Night Elf Priest
6920
or are they lying through their teeth?

I haven't completed a heroic yet, but I have done a couple bosses from a few different ones, and to complete them (after a few wipes from figuring out the mechanics and a strategy) I've had to use the following spells;

-Heal
-Flash Heal
-Greater Heal
-Prayer of Mending
-Prayer of Healing
-Hymn of Hope
-Divine Hymn
-Renew
-Chakra
-Holy Words (both Heal and PoM's Chakra's Holy Words)
-Light Well (actually being used now by DPS hurray!!!)
-Shadow Fiend
-Holy Nova (Great from breaking chains on the first boss in H BRC, and it tops people off!)
-Cure Disease
-Dispel Magic
-Mass Dispel
-Power Word: Shield (more to help people move out of aoe quicker than anything else)
-Leap of Faith (very situational, but very useful!)


I have never been happier, having to actually use all of these spells is awesome! Now I'm not saying I have been spamming these spells, the opposite in fact. But what I am trying to say is that I am making progress in learning the new system, and its already becoming easier for me to heal heroics with just a few upgrades!

The new system needs some polishing sure, but it is doable! I am by no means an amazing healer, I'd consider myself among the majority here, a casual. But I AM progressing.

I think people need to really give this new system a shot, coordinate your group. Plan pulls, plan fights, position properly, make mistakes and learn from them! This is all fresh content, instead of focusing on the negative aspects, try focusing on the fun that there is to be had.

Healing, in my opinion, is more fun than it has ever been. But its not just because of the new healing system...

Its because groups are having to work as a unit, even in 5 mans, to progress. Nobody is carrying anyone anymore, and we're all being given a chance to shine...

I don't know about the rest of you, but I intend to shine like a star!

Pocket <3

PS: Cuddos to Blizzard, I love the new system!
Reply Quote
85 Goblin Priest
2680
Yay, Gnome priest! Er, excuse me there, but anyways, I am in 100% agreement with you. We priests have a massive amount of tools at our disposal, when used properly make healing extremely fun and very effective.

I've said this in some other posts: what is astounding is that people are not quite grasping the concept that the expansion hasn't even been out a week yet!! We don't have the spiffy gear that makes things easy; we're in the process of getting that gear. I think people have either forgotten, or they just never played in groups during the days of gearing up and struggling through new content.

I'm willing to bet a lot of these people who are having problems are running with totally random groups through the LFD. I tanked a bunch of instances yesterday with a group of friends, and we had a Holy priest who raids as Shadow and was readjusting to healing with us. And we did exceptionally well, especially since it was the very first time we stepped into Grim Batol and Halls of Origination. We were careful in our pulls, used crowd control to make things easy (and faster), and I used my cooldowns and my self healing abilities whenever I could.

Once people start realizing we're at the very bottom of the gear curve, we'll see less of these complaints. Well, ok, I'm being optimistic about that. I am perfectly happy with the way things are, I'm very excited to learn how to best use all my fun healing abilities.
Reply Quote
85 Night Elf Priest
8700
I think the issue is proportion. Heal choice is still clearly part of the present design. The effect and therefore proportion of "substantive" heals compared to middle-heals is mitigated by the presence of the middle heal...which many do not find to be fun or interesting.

Note that isn't a comment about things being do-able...it's a comment about the fun derived from the process of doing. I do not discount your enjoyment, but is the presence of heal adding to, or taking away from fun in general?
Edited by Arauial on 12/12/2010 12:43 AM PST
Reply Quote
85 Dwarf Paladin
7025
Nobody is carrying anyone anymore, and we're all being given a chance to shine...

I beg to differ. I'm carrying the @*%@ out of these idiots in normals. I'm going to hate my random queues in 85 Heroics....

Seriously... I have about 15 stories you don't want to hear just from the 5-10 odd instances I have run while leveling. Just when I think "They can't get worse than that" some fool proves me wrong the next random I run.

*sigh*

My friends can't always be grouped with me. :|
Reply Quote
85 Night Elf Priest
6920
12/12/2010 12:43 AMPosted by Arauial
I think the issue is proportion. Heal choice is still clearly part of the present design. The effect and therefore proportion of "substantive" heals compared to middle-heals is mitigated by the presence of the middle heal...which many do not find to be fun or interesting.

Note that isn't a comment about things being do-able...it's a comment about the fun derived from the process of doing. I do not discount your enjoyment, but is the presence of heal adding to, or taking away from fun in general?


I wouldn't say its taking away from my enjoyment, but its not adding much either. I do enjoy how the developers incorporated some synergy to the spell with its current affect on Chakra. Having it add to the duration of renew has saved me alot of mana over the duration of some boss fights, especially since in some cases I am able to have the same Renew rolling on the tank the entire fight (this alone saves me thousands of mana points during the encounter).

So no the spell itself isn't adding to my enjoyment, but its affects on my other spells does add to it.

I'm looking forward to seeing how well our heals will scale with gear, though, as I said in my original post, healing does seem to be getting easier (provided the group plays well) with each upgrade.

With just the gear I have attained over the past two days, my mana regeneration has improved, my heals are doing more, and my haste has improved.

All in all I am enjoying the new system because of the teamwork that is now needed to advance. This is an MMO after all, and we all need to work together.
Reply Quote
85 Blood Elf Priest
6805
On easy trash packs, I do the following:

Renew on tank
Heal spam on tank
Renew on DPS/self if health below 30%

On harder trash packs and bosses, I do the following:

Renew on tank
Chakra
Heal spam, Holy Word: Serenity every cooldown
Greater Heal if health below 50%
Guardian Spirit/Flash if health below 20%
Renew on DPS if health below 30%
Flash on self if health below 30%

Just to give you a basic idea. I cast Heal more than any other spell, by far. Also, some bosses are better for using Prayer of Healing chakra state. Power Word: Shield, Prayer of Mending and Circle of Healing are almost gone from my spell selection.
Reply Quote
85 Night Elf Priest
8700
I agree that synergy between heals is interesting, but I see no particular reason that the middle heal needs to be the spell that provides that synergy when a more interesting spell could do the job. "Fun neutral" spells I think are problematic for design. Also, I think your appraisal of the amount of fun it is, based on feedback, is probably more generous than some would give.

I should add, it turns out that heal at least doesn't scale as well as other direct heals for priests relative to spellpower...so in later content, we may be asked to use the spell to trigger effects when we'd otherwise not want to use the spell at all.
Reply Quote
85 Blood Elf Priest
6805
Blizzard messed up my keybinds. I had Flash Heal on the 0 key (troll my keybinds if you want, I'm left handed though) for almost 5 years. When 4.0 came out, I heard that Heal supposedly going to be viable again, and out of lack of anywhere better to put it since my keys had been ergonomically very good for forever and a day, I put it on a fairly awkward Shift-0. I ended up not using it much between 4.0 and Cata so I left it there.

Once I started doing Halls of Origination, I realized that Heal was going to be used way more, and Flash Heal I'd probably only use for Surge of Light procs, so I swapped them. It's been messing with my head ever since, for the most part.
Reply Quote
85 Night Elf Priest
6920
12/12/2010 1:03 AMPosted by Arauial
I agree that synergy between heals is interesting, but I see no particular reason that the middle heal needs to be the spell that provides that synergy when a more interesting spell could do the job. "Fun neutral" spells I think are problematic for design. Also, I think your appraisal of the amount of fun it is, based on feedback, is probably more generous than some would give.

I should add, it turns out that heal at least doesn't scale as well as other direct heals for priests relative to spellpower...so in later content, we may be asked to use the spell to trigger effects when we'd otherwise not want to use the spell at all.


Then perhaps rather than removing the spell and replacing it, they could simply scale it so that it will still be useful at later gear levels.

As to its affect on chakra, perhaps Blizzard could add Flash Heal to the activation of that particular embodiment of the spell, so that we have a choice between a filler when not much healing is needed, and having a quick spell to fire off when we need chakra up, but don't have the time to just cast heal.

We'd save mana by casting Heal to activate Chakra, or we'd save time and lose mana by using Flash Heal to activate it.

Healing is all about choices now, the more we have the better, so I see no reason to not Flash Heal as an activating spell in the synergy.
Reply Quote
85 Troll Druid
4805
12/12/2010 12:35 AMPosted by Sathelihta
Yay, Gnome priest! Er, excuse me there, but anyways, I am in 100% agreement with you. We priests have a massive amount of tools at our disposal, when used properly make healing extremely fun and very effective.

I've said this in some other posts: what is astounding is that people are not quite grasping the concept that the expansion hasn't even been out a week yet!! We don't have the spiffy gear that makes things easy; we're in the process of getting that gear. I think people have either forgotten, or they just never played in groups during the days of gearing up and struggling through new content.

I'm willing to bet a lot of these people who are having problems are running with totally random groups through the LFD. I tanked a bunch of instances yesterday with a group of friends, and we had a Holy priest who raids as Shadow and was readjusting to healing with us. And we did exceptionally well, especially since it was the very first time we stepped into Grim Batol and Halls of Origination. We were careful in our pulls, used crowd control to make things easy (and faster), and I used my cooldowns and my self healing abilities whenever I could.

Once people start realizing we're at the very bottom of the gear curve, we'll see less of these complaints. Well, ok, I'm being optimistic about that. I am perfectly happy with the way things are, I'm very excited to learn how to best use all my fun healing abilities.


read his first sentence which says 'i have yet to complete a heroic' thats the problem. People can't GET gear if they can't complete runs because of the issues that are there with this 'amazingly' new system they put in.
Reply Quote
85 Night Elf Priest
6920
12/12/2010 2:56 AMPosted by Twîstedkìtty
12/12/2010 12:35 AMPosted by Sathelihta
Yay, Gnome priest! Er, excuse me there, but anyways, I am in 100% agreement with you. We priests have a massive amount of tools at our disposal, when used properly make healing extremely fun and very effective.

I've said this in some other posts: what is astounding is that people are not quite grasping the concept that the expansion hasn't even been out a week yet!! We don't have the spiffy gear that makes things easy; we're in the process of getting that gear. I think people have either forgotten, or they just never played in groups during the days of gearing up and struggling through new content.

I'm willing to bet a lot of these people who are having problems are running with totally random groups through the LFD. I tanked a bunch of instances yesterday with a group of friends, and we had a Holy priest who raids as Shadow and was readjusting to healing with us. And we did exceptionally well, especially since it was the very first time we stepped into Grim Batol and Halls of Origination. We were careful in our pulls, used crowd control to make things easy (and faster), and I used my cooldowns and my self healing abilities whenever I could.

Once people start realizing we're at the very bottom of the gear curve, we'll see less of these complaints. Well, ok, I'm being optimistic about that. I am perfectly happy with the way things are, I'm very excited to learn how to best use all my fun healing abilities.


read his first sentence which says 'i have yet to complete a heroic' thats the problem. People can't GET gear if they can't complete runs because of the issues that are there with this 'amazingly' new system they put in.


Um, thats not a problem, its a form of progression. If people stand in fire they die, and won't get loot.

I have completed multiple bosses in heroics, have some gear from heroics, and am progressing my character.

Its a team effort now, its not Blizzard's fault that you, or the people you're grouping with can't avoid AVOIDABLE damage.

There is no problem with the current healing system, in my opinion.

Many people are completing HEROICS (Meant to be hard when you don't over gear them) with relative ease. You learn the fights, you execute a strategy, kill the boss and loot the corpse.
Reply Quote
85 Draenei Priest
11670
I use heal ALMOST as much as I used to use flash heal in wrath dungeons! I really don't understand this complaint. It's not simpler, it's just a slower cast time. Is that really what's bugging you? And yeah, with the heal chakra I use the power word serenity and renew all the time, as well as POM if there's aoe and COH/POH if there's really nasty aoe and flash/greater heal in emergencies. Healing is no duller than it ever has been. I like having the 2 seconds every cast to plan my next move instead of dully playing whackamole on the health bar that went down with a huge heal that will instantly fill it.
Reply Quote
85 Night Elf Priest
6920
An excellent example of a fight that requires execution in exchange for less damage to your group is the second boss in H BRC.

You have two dps and a healer in the beams, they need to follow the strategy or the mob will evolve and a lot of damage gets dished out.

All of this damage is avoidable. Once my group figured out the mechanics, I never went below 75% mana.

We downed the boss and moved on to the next. Who we also ended up killing after a wipe or two to figure the fight's mechanics out, and as before, execute a strategy.


The heroics are doable, healing is completely viable as it is.

The people you run heroics (meant to be hard remember), need to play like they're in a heroic, not the level 81-84 version.
Reply Quote
85 Night Elf Priest
6920
12/12/2010 4:11 AMPosted by Gimpheala
I use heal ALMOST as much as I used to use flash heal in wrath dungeons! I really don't understand this complaint. It's not simpler, it's just a slower cast time. Is that really what's bugging you? And yeah, with the heal chakra I use the power word serenity and renew all the time, as well as POM if there's aoe and COH/POH if there's really nasty aoe and flash/greater heal in emergencies. Healing is no duller than it ever has been. I like having the 2 seconds every cast to plan my next move instead of dully playing whackamole on the health bar that went down with a huge heal that will instantly fill it.


Healing is a lot more strategic now, and with a good team to back you, its very enjoyable. Its no longer a twitchy spamfest, which is great because it moves us away from instant tank deaths if someone gets a quick lag spike, misses a click, etc.
Reply Quote
80 Undead Priest
4120
12/12/2010 4:00 AMPosted by Pocketpriest
Its a team effort now, its not Blizzard's fault that you, or the people you're grouping with can't avoid AVOIDABLE damage.


It is Blizzard's fault because for two years they allowed completely horrible players to be carried* through easy "heroics"** (and raids) and now they are punishing them for playing as Blizzard has taught them to play.

It is like raising a kid with no discipline and then once they are a teenager suddenly expecting them to exhibit self-control and good manners. As soon as I heard about the new plans for Heroics I high five'd the air and then vowed to not run randoms until all the bads had learned how to play.

Random group selection and hard content will not work unless Blizzard implements PVE ranking (gear score is worthless) algorithms. If you are running Heroic randoms you shouldn't be surprised at the fail.

* When I was playing my warrior I had terrible PuG's where all the DPS would die on the first boss of PoS and runs that went for over an hour because I did most of the damage as a tank. Those bads are still in your queues today.

** Most Wrath Heroics were on par with TBC normals. Only a few instances had trash or bosses that approximated TBC heroic difficulty (eg Loken), and none of them were as consistently difficult.
Reply Quote
85 Night Elf Priest
6920
12/12/2010 4:21 AMPosted by Ellah
12/12/2010 4:00 AMPosted by Pocketpriest
Its a team effort now, its not Blizzard's fault that you, or the people you're grouping with can't avoid AVOIDABLE damage.


It is Blizzard's fault because for two years they allowed completely horrible players to be carried* through easy "heroics"** (and raids) and now they are punishing them for playing as Blizzard has taught them to play.

It is like raising a kid with no discipline and then once they are a teenager suddenly expecting them to exhibit self-control and good manners. As soon as I heard about the new plans for Heroics I high five'd the air and then vowed to not run randoms until all the bads had learned how to play.

Random group selection and hard content will not work unless Blizzard implements PVE ranking (gear score is worthless) algorithms. If you are running Heroic randoms you shouldn't be surprised at the fail.

* When I was playing my warrior I had terrible PuG's where all the DPS would die on the first boss of PoS and runs that went for over an hour because I did most of the damage as a tank. Those bads are still in your queues today.

** Most Wrath Heroics were on par with TBC normals. Only a few instances had trash or bosses that approximated TBC heroic difficulty (eg Loken), and none of them were as consistently difficult.


And now Blizzard is correcting their past mistake.

What do you expect them to do? Hold a seminar with a power point presentation to explain every encounter to people?

Its a Heroic instance, its going to be tough. Its a "hard mode", if you don't like it, well theres nothing in the ToS that says you have to do them.

Heroics are doable, people need to learn the fights, its been less than a week.
Reply Quote
85 Draenei Priest
11670
Why are you guys so mad about the changes solely based on the random dungeon finder? Do you really not have any friends or anyone else you trust to invite to a group on your server?
Reply Quote
85 Night Elf Priest
6920
12/12/2010 4:28 AMPosted by Gimpheala
Why are you guys so mad about the changes solely based on the random dungeon finder? Do you really not have any friends or anyone else you trust to invite to a group on your server?


Thats not even the point....

People haven't had a chance to see, let alone learn to execute, all the fights yet! How can people expect to down every new boss fight in the first week?

Thats absurd! This isn't some half asses video game, every fight requires a strategy, some fights don't have any commonly known ones yet...

its going to take some time, but eventually people won't be wiping as much.
Reply Quote
80 Undead Priest
4120
12/12/2010 4:25 AMPosted by Pocketpriest
And now Blizzard is correcting their past mistake.

What do you expect them to do? Hold a seminar with a power point presentation to explain every encounter to people?


Well going back to the old system of having a daily quest for extra emblems/points instead of having it built into the LFD tool would be nice (as I don't enjoy running with bads, but eventually those extra points will tempt me to risk it).

12/12/2010 4:25 AMPosted by Pocketpriest
Heroics are doable, people need to learn the fights, its been less than a week.


Oh that wont happen IMO. Most of the bads will just stay bad and blame Blizzard for making content too hard instead of just learning to play a fairly simple game (I haven't seen the first "I pay my $15 and so should be able to do all content even though I suck at wow" post yet, I miss those from TBC). But eventually they ratio of bad to competent will swing towards competent.
Reply Quote

Please report any Code of Conduct violations, including:

Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.

Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.

Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.

Forums Code of Conduct

Report Post # written by

Reason
Explain (256 characters max)

Reported!

[Close]