Holy Pallies, Why Crusade???

85 Blood Elf Paladin
2500
Crusade seems a popular talent in holy pally builds now - this talent seems fairly situational and pretty much for trash and not boss fights. It just seems like a lot of points to spend on trash. Maybe I'm missing something? Is there nothing better?
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85 Human Paladin
6435
Holy Shock healing increase.
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
0
Right it's not for the 300% increase on holy light, It's for the 30% increase on Holy Shock.
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100 Draenei Paladin
5960
If you happen to have Crusade as Holy while leveling Cata, it's an indirect DPS increase through saving your Holy Power. You can Holy Light after a kill to get your health back for very cheap mana, while your Holy Power is dumped on Inquisition.
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85 Human Paladin
0
We were taking Crusade before they added the Holy Light increase, because it's plain and simple the best three points we can take outside our own tree. If we happen to pull off a last-second Hammer of Wrath or Holy Wrath on a trash mob, then the massive Holy Light we get is completely awesome. Eternal Glory is pure RNG without a decent Power Aura and Divinity is underwhelming. None of the other first-tier talents directly affects our healing.
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
6070
12/13/2010 9:30 AMPosted by Jantilla
Eternal Glory is pure RNG without a decent Power Aura and Divinity is underwhelming. None of the other first-tier talents directly affects our healing.


Even if EG is RNG, it's still win. If Bliz doesn't have a decent PA for it, make your own. I agree that divinity is a bit lackluster at the moment though.

This would probably be my favorite holy spec currently:

http://www.wowhead.com/talent#sMIbzrkuufz0bZcbh:VcaqrfcMz
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85 Tauren Paladin
4645
Thanks Altruistic. Don't know what I was thinking for going 31/0/10 instead of 31/5/5. I guess for wiggle room i could go 31/3/7 with points being taken from eternal glory and moved to pursiuit of justice or 2 in rule of law.
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5 Orc Warrior
0


Also, you should be judging every cooldown for mana and that splashes to the beacon as well.


Wait, you get mana back from judging a target? Wasn't that only for Prot/Ret spec? If I'm completely missing something, please enlighten me.
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100 Blood Elf Paladin
13400
12/13/2010 10:30 AMPosted by Imaka


Also, you should be judging every cooldown for mana and that splashes to the beacon as well.


Wait, you get mana back from judging a target? Wasn't that only for Prot/Ret spec? If I'm completely missing something, please enlighten me.


Any paladin casting Judgement with Seal of Insight active gains 15% of their base mana. Judgement costs 5%, so it's a gain of 10% base mana every 8 seconds. Not huge, but it has saved my life a few times.
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85 Tauren Paladin
2410
12/13/2010 10:36 AMPosted by Ehcks
12/13/2010 10:30 AMPosted by Imaka


Also, you should be judging every cooldown for mana and that splashes to the beacon as well.


Wait, you get mana back from judging a target? Wasn't that only for Prot/Ret spec? If I'm completely missing something, please enlighten me.


Any paladin casting Judgement with Seal of Insight active gains 15% of their base mana. Judgement costs 5%, so it's a gain of 10% base mana every 8 seconds. Not huge, but it has saved my life a few times.


Cast on cooldown over a long fight it is a lot of mana back (and also a small self heal with enlightened judgement). If you can spare the cooldown, its win-win, and can really make your mana stretch on fail groups (i did a 10 minute fight on the first boss in H SFK last night because dps were retarded and not able to interupt) keeping mana with judgement spam.
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85 Human Paladin
0
12/13/2010 9:52 AMPosted by Altruistic
Divinity is underwhelming? Divinity is one of the best talents you can take and has been proven to be mathematically superior to any talent outside of the holy tree. With the new healing model, Divinity is even more powerful due to how little overhealing is done.

You would take a 15% chance to crit on WoG over 6% additional heal on every spell? Not to mention that LoD is in almost every situation a better use of HP over WoG due to the Beacon splash on the tank.

Edit - On topic, you rarely get the crusade proc for the big HL. It is a 30% buff to a spell that is used on every cooldown, not to mention there is no better place to put the talent points. To me, the spec is pretty much set in stone with the only wiggle point is between taking one point out of Enlightened Judgements and moving it to Improved Judgement.


I think Divinity is underwhelming compared to 30% more healing on Holy Shock, yes. I still take it, but Divinity comes after Crusade in my talent choices. Context, folks, context.

And a point in Improved Judgment over Enlightened Judgments is no contest - the extra healing from Enlightened Judgments transfers through Beacon. There's no way I'm gimping my healing for 5 yards on Judgment.
Edited by Jantilla on 12/13/2010 2:02 PM PST
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