Melee is a liability without LotP/JoL.

85 Blood Elf Paladin
0
The attacker-healing components of Judgement of Light and Leader of the Pack were originally designed to offset the large amount of additional damage inherent to melees doing their jobs. I can understand toning these abilities down to match the new healing paradigm, but removing them completely only makes melee purely a liability on and an additional drain on healers that ranged DPS does not suffer from.
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85 Night Elf Rogue
8920
Melee requires so many more heals it's insane. I typically take 1.5 -2x the damage of a ranged dps over the course of a heroic run.

It's really funny. I always get outdps'd because I am dodging melee penalizing ability # 238432. I take more damage from most passives, have to dodge more from random abilities that randomly target players.

I just don't understand. Dungeon design atm makes me hate playing melee. And it only gets worse when raids come out.

edit: Anecdotes always help right?

So I just killed Karsh Steelbender in Heroic Blackrock Caverns. You get adds over the course of the fight that when killed (you almost always have to kill them) drop a lava pool. The boss also has to be dragged in and out of the pools to allow dps on him.

After we killed the boss the mage in my group remarked that this really was just a tank fight; everyone else had simple jobs.

I simply /boggled. The mage stood there and dps'd the boss/adds. I dodged lava that was appearing around me, avoided cleaves as the tank dragged the boss around the room, desperately trying to keep my rotation going with limited uptime on the boss.

As a melee, I took more damage, did less damage, and had a harder time doing damage than I would have had I been a ranged dps class.

This is how I feel on the majority of heroic encounters.
Edited by Leonin on 12/10/2010 6:30 PM PST
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85 Blood Elf Hunter
6355
If it makes you feel any better I have to down grade to MM just to survive heroics : / Sad that a glyphed 9 second interval heal for 5% and losing quite a bit of overall damage feels vital now.

The unavoidable damage being thrown around is basically fire you can't move out of most of the time. Even what you can move out of ticks so hard that there are bosses/larger mobs where I can't comfortably stand still long for more than a few seconds because one extra tick is so dangerous now.

I'm all for a higher skill requirement but, I pity melee right now. Just glad I shelved my rogue main.
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85 Goblin Warrior
6175
I'm fine with it, I still top dps like a boss.

I like the challenge.
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Chain heal, circle of healing, wild growth, holy hadouken, etc.

Melee take more damage and receive more heals.
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85 Goblin Warrior
6175
12/10/2010 6:44 PMPosted by Tashre
Chain heal, circle of healing, wild growth, holy hadouken, etc.

Melee take more damage and receive more heals.


Amazing point.
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85 Night Elf Rogue
8920
12/10/2010 6:44 PMPosted by Tashre
Chain heal, circle of healing, wild growth, holy hadouken, etc.

Melee take more damage and receive more heals.


Literally none of those favor melee (unless holy hakouken = holy word: sanc). They are smart heals - they heal targets that have the lowest hp.

If they heal melee more than range, it simply proves the point; melee take more damage.
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90 Night Elf Druid
9615
very rarely when i cast wild growth in a 5 man does it not hit 4 people, range get a big chunk as much as melee.

melee getting more heals is a product of melee taking more damage. Every instance there's some melee dude pretty much dying while trying to do their job, meanwhile the ranged are really just standing there dishing out nukes probably reading a book or something.

point is, unless its an intended random target spell or large area aoe, ranged aren't taking much damage at all, comparatively. I love seeing 3 ranged dps when i get into a random.
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
4375
12/10/2010 6:57 PMPosted by Mewz
very rarely when i cast wild growth in a 5 man does it not hit 4 people, range get a big chunk as much as melee.

melee getting more heals is a product of melee taking more damage. Every instance there's some melee dude pretty much dying while trying to do their job, meanwhile the ranged are really just standing there dishing out nukes probably reading a book or something.

point is, unless its an intended random target spell or large area aoe, ranged aren't taking much damage at all, comparatively. I love seeing 3 ranged dps when i get into a random.


If melee did more dmg it'd be one thing, but that's most definitely not the case. At some point PuGs are going to look like "LF3M NO MELEE" for a 5 man.
Edited by Jenseits on 12/10/2010 7:01 PM PST
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12/10/2010 6:51 PMPosted by Leonin
If they heal melee more than range, it simply proves the point; melee take more damage.


Yes. Correct.

12/10/2010 6:57 PMPosted by Mewz
Every instance there's some melee dude pretty much dying while trying to do their job


If the melee are dying doing their job, it means the healer isn't doing theirs.
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
4375
12/10/2010 7:00 PMPosted by Tashre
If the melee are dying doing their job, it means the healer isn't doing theirs.


And if the melee are just taking that much dmg and no one is doing something wrong?
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85 Night Elf Druid
2975
What is this thread about? Are they removing LOTP?
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90 Night Elf Druid
8280
12/10/2010 7:18 PMPosted by Ailee
What is this thread about? Are they removing LOTP?


Well, it's self only now
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85 Night Elf Druid
2975
Ah I didn't even notice that. Guess it's cause I haven't instanced in Cata yet.
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85 Night Elf Rogue
8920
12/10/2010 7:18 PMPosted by Ailee
What is this thread about? Are they removing LOTP?


They removed passive heals in Improved Leader of the Pack and Judgement of Light that historically have favored faster attacking melee. At the same time, they introduced heroics that seem to penalize bringing melee dps to your group (due to the fact that they take more damage).

This thread is basically a WTF BLIZZ.
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85 Night Elf Druid
2975
Nah, LOTP had an internal 6 second CD, so it didn't favor fast melee.
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