Cataclysm PvE Holy Paladin Theorycrafting

6 Troll Shaman
0
One last thing, my conviction modeling is inaccurate. I predicted we needed 30% crit to keep conviction up most of the time. This is clearly not the case. So there are a couple of potential culprits I can see.

1) PotI - Do PotI crits proc conviction? If so, the number of heals in my models almost doubled.
2) HR - Pop this, and you WILL have conviction up.

I don't consider beacon "crits" because beacon crits are really the crits of the first heal being transferred.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
8650
Pretty sure PotI crits do proc Conviction.

[00:41:44.507] Rayocell Protector of the Innocent Rayocell +0 (O: 9330)
[00:41:44.507] Rayocell's Conviction is refreshed by Rayocell

Then later:

[00:41:45.312] Rayocell Protector of the Innocent Rayocell +0 (O: 6147)
[00:41:45.715] Palvantu's Illuminated Healing is refreshed by Rayocell (Remaining: 1309)

Not sure why my log didn't show crits, but the first one was clearly a crit.
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6 Troll Shaman
0
And I redid my old math, allowing PotI to proc conviction, accounted for HS's extra 10% crit.

We need just under 20% to keep Conviction up most of the time.

(5 Normal Casts, 2 Holy Shocks and 7 PotI heals in 15 seconds)

Add 5% from raid buffs, and I happen to have that. Good to know.
Edited by Lylthe on 12/30/2010 10:20 AM PST
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
4195
Let me just say thank you for not saying anything about what a healer is, what a tank is, or what DPS stands for. Seriously I see so many guides that feel like they have to explain that stuff and I /facepalm. Nobody reaches max level where a guide like this actually matters and has no idea what those things are.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
8650
12/28/2010 1:58 PMPosted by Adt
Lylthe how come you suggest Aura Mastery in your spec? Is there some math and logic behind it? or do you just like to move superfast on your mount every now and then and feel this joy should be shared with all Holy Paladin on their way to a raid?

i kinda look at it as an option VS imp judge 10yrds.


Aura Mastery + Resistance Aura mitigates a LOT of damage in certain situations. It's very powerful for 1 talent point.
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6 Troll Shaman
0
12/28/2010 2:23 PMPosted by Rayocell
Aura Mastery + Resistance Aura

Pretty much this.
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85 Dwarf Paladin
7025
I finally was able to record my own Mastery data using Skada, since Recount appears to still not be working. I did continue running Recount as a backup to ensure accuracy... *shrug*

This is a Heroic - Note: My stats have changed since then.
Mastery - 1322 @ 19.222%

Absorbs - 1720630
Total Healing - 18756456

DL - 5320616
Beacon - 3185697
HS - 2189304
WoG - 2328575
PotI - 3094124
HL - 815607
HR - 757092
LoD - 711839
FoL - 114651
Enl. Judg. - 238951

Expected Absorbs - 2206746
% Absorbed - 14.987%
% Loss - 26.66% AKA - 73.34% useage

Net Effectiveness - 44.891%

Edit: Some things to note.
- My tank was a druid, her absorbs are almost as high as mine... wow... does that have any effect on whether mine get used or not? Might... or maybe mine get used up first. Or maybe they both got used up pretty often regardless... *spins*
- The run was about as versatile as you can imagine. Great geared group, strong DPS and tanking, but we wiped a few times to silly things. Typical group, nothing unrealistic like a perfect run - this is how it gets used.
- I play differently, I use a lot of Divine Lights. I like to use it for generating Holy Power as well as healing up group members. They are lazier for it, sure, but I encourage that - why not have a good time if we can handle it for the most part? Yes, I do overheal like crazy in Heroics now...

Either way, the ultimate answer still depends on how you heal, and still results in something along the lines of "build them up about equally". I've already adjusted my stats to a more appropriate ratio, almost equal. :D

Edit: I did have quite a few errors here with the math and while the overall result wasn't much different after correcting the math several times I have it pretty well nailed down I think. The difference is about 6% less than the first set of results, and more considering I had to remove the overheal stats. The above 44% is accurate for this data.
Edited by Rabel on 1/5/2011 12:37 AM PST
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6 Troll Shaman
0
12/29/2010 6:22 PMPosted by Rabel
Total Healing - 14508287

DL - 5157506
Beacon - 2513547
HS - 1993575
WoG - 1946444
PotI - 946517
HL - 728405
HR - 575651
LoD - 444400
FoL - 114651
Enl. J. - 77880

Is this section Effective healing or total healing (effective+overheal)? Wanted to run the numbers myself.

First page is updated for mastery.
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85 Dwarf Paladin
7025
Note: This is now incorrect, but I preserved it as a response to the above question.
First section is effective healing (without overheal included), second is overhealing alone.

Edit: I have changed the data above and CORRECTLY done my math now, and it is still close to the same results (slightly off). The above NOW shows total healing, including both overhealing and effective healing, which is the only correct way to judge the value of Mastery without bias.
Edited by Rabel on 1/4/2011 11:30 PM PST
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85 Goblin Shaman
1890
Lylthe, thank you for taking the time to write this up, .
<3
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
8650
Why is this on the 4th page?!?!

Been working on a spreadsheet to play around with numbers and rotations. How are you guys going about fitting crit and mastery into your calculations? I would think that crit, like Lylthe stated in her posts, that you can average crit out by dividing it in half and multiplying it by your healing done, and that's what I'm doing. Mastery I'm assuming that it's fully absorbed per heal, although that is the best-best case scenario.

And what about Infusion of Light?

I've been trying to include in combat mana regen, SoI procs (if you're using Crusader Strike), and judgements into account, too. I think I might have it down, but I'm probably calculating use of Judgement wrong. If we assume it's used on CD, that means we trigger another GCD. So am I wrong in taking that into consideration in my HPS calculations?
Edited by Rayocell on 1/3/2011 1:09 AM PST
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6 Troll Shaman
0
There aren't any paladin stickies at all, and continually bumping my own thread feels a bit too spammy :P Plus I've been busy with the holidays.

It seems like fully absorbing the mastery per heal is a safe assumption, but we're only finding about 60% of the shields are used, and only 50% of our total (effective+overheal) is eligible for mastery.

I didn't consider IoL. This is a weakness in the analysis, but one I sort of magic hand wave away because it's an RNG proc and unreliable.

SoI cannot proc off Crusader Strike. CS is generally a bad option to use, unless you need to hit lots of people with LoD.

Judgement consumes a GCD, so it's not wrong to consider that "lost" time in the HPS calculations. You're going to net 10% mana per judgemenent.
Edited by Lylthe on 1/3/2011 9:00 AM PST
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
8650
01/03/2011 8:59 AMPosted by Lylthe
I didn't consider IoL. This is a weakness in the analysis, but one I sort of magic hand wave away because it's an RNG proc and unreliable.


Makes sense, but can't you assume you'll have it up X amount of times based on your HS crit chance? Maybe it's something you'd have to model based off of fight time and spell priorities.

SoI cannot proc off Crusader Strike. CS is generally a bad option to use, unless you need to hit lots of people with LoD.


Where do you see that SoI cannot proc off CS? Not that I'm disagreeing with your assessment on using CS, but I could've sworn CS procced seals at the same rate, and the text on SoI states single-target melee attacks. And since I was assuming that CS procced SoI, I was getting some strange numbers.
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6 Troll Shaman
0
01/03/2011 10:24 AMPosted by Rayocell
Makes sense, but can't you assume you'll have it up X amount of times based on your HS crit chance? Maybe it's something you'd have to model based off of fight time and spell priorities.


Yes you can. HS should have an additional 15% chance to crit. Over a "long" period of time, you can average in this bonus HPS. It's the same thing we did with crit in general.

Original CS Math:
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1406258637?page=2#32
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1406258637?page=2#36

Jantilla's, CS doesn't proc SoI
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1406258637?page=2#37

I have tested in game that CS won't proc Seal of Truth, but I don't believe I have SoI logs to confirm it. I thought another source confirmed this, but I can't find the post.

Faelyne's Update:
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1406258637?page=3#41


Judgement Math:
12/13/2010 1:09 PMPosted by Lylthe
Judge on cooldown. Judging on CD is the single largest source of mana you can have. Each judge will net you 2342 mana (15%-5%). On CD that's 1464 mp5. More realistically, if you judge 1/10 seconds, that's 1171 mp5. Don't do any of this stuff if it will kill someone.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
8650
I guess I'm going to do some testing on CS and seal proccing when I get home. It always used to be that CS could proc seals, and I thought it wouldn't be any different here. Not that it's going to change my thought about using CS as holy, but I'm really curious now.

I'll have to include some LoD stuff in my sheet, and I forgot that the GCD incurred by CS isn't affected by haste...oops...
Edited by Rayocell on 1/3/2011 11:16 AM PST
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6 Troll Shaman
0
01/03/2011 11:16 AMPosted by Rayocell
I forgot that the GCD incurred by CS isn't affected by haste...oops...

Haha yeah, I made the same mistake too.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
8650
Crusader Strike DOES proc Seal of Insight on hit!

http://www.durashack.us/Pics/WoWScrnShot_010311_191121.jpg

If you look at the combat log, CS hits, then immediately after, Seal of Insight procs. In fact, the only seal I couldn't get to proc with CS was Seal of Truth. It can't apply Censure, but it can apply the additional holy damage with a 5 stack.

Makes me wonder if that's an intentional change. I remember CS being able to stack SoV, but that was a while ago.

EDIT: Not that I care about it in Holy, anyways. Using CS is a pretty bad way to play, in my opinion.
Edited by Rayocell on 1/3/2011 4:34 PM PST
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