Healers taking the brunt of the Cataclysm

85 Blood Elf Priest
4590
fail.
10 Orc Hunter
0
I'm a shammy and having a hell of a time with it.
91 Human Priest
5135
12/17/2010 11:50 AMPosted by Lemures
Except no. I have a 70k mana pool and I very *very* rarely oom. You're doing it wrong.


Likely, it's not the healer but the tank trying to AE tank everything. The Cata dungeons actually require CC again, but few PUGs are actually doing that.


requiring CC is a nice idea that screws up their design goals of bring the player not the class and is a bit of a !@%@ move after a bunch of people leveled up and enjoyed non-CC classes in wrath. That would be fine if people could OT mobs the way they could in vanilla, but they cant. Mobs hit too hard and we dont have the mana to heal them through it.

Dont get me wrong, I like CC, but the current design fails in random groups.

It makes me mad that blizz is so bad at understanding these issues and solving them ahead of time because they get paid so much, get so much help from us, and still seem oblivious to things that are obvious to most any player. Things they were warned of over and over and ignored.

Re:healing

Making choices about what spells to cast based on efficiency SUCKS. its boring, painful, lame, puts us at odds with groups instead of inducing teamwork, and forces more bar and CD watching and less time for interesting responsive play and participation in the physical environment and the encounters.
91 Human Priest
5135
This is a perfectly named topic because healers ARE taking the brunt of cataclysm.

Its not difficulty level that turns most people off. Its the fact that you chose to let our jobs be miserable because you couldnt think hard enough about how to achieve your (not even very good) design goals any other way. Why should we pay $15 a month to shoulder the brunt of your careless design changes? You've got to be joking.

Your choice to move away from "play any dps class/spec you want" to "Bring CC or die" puts the workload on us to heal through the extra damage when your random is a dps DK, warrior, and feral druid.

Your attempt to force players to be more situationally aware just equates to more party healing with smaller relative heals.

Add to that the fact that your design for Healing is FUBAR and this healer exodus is going to keep on going until the game grinds to a halt.

Making choices about what spells to cast based on efficiency SUCKS. its boring, painful, lame, puts us at odds with groups instead of inducing teamwork, and forces more bar and CD watching and less time for interesting responsive play and participation in the physical environment and the encounters.
85 Tauren Paladin
3550
Making choices about what spells to cast based on efficiency SUCKS. its boring, painful, lame,


This.
75 Tauren Shaman
950
12/17/2010 8:43 AMPosted by Chart
Does this mean as a Healer I am going to need to run the normals until I get 346 and higher gear to be viable while DPS can rock Heroics at 333?


Yeah, isn't that fun?
85 Tauren Shaman
7315
12/17/2010 12:32 PMPosted by Eset
This is a perfectly named topic because healers ARE taking the brunt of cataclysm.

Its not difficulty level that turns most people off. Its the fact that you chose to let our jobs be miserable because you couldnt think hard enough about how to achieve your (not even very good) design goals any other way. Why should we pay $15 a month to shoulder the brunt of your careless design changes? You've got to be joking.

Your choice to move away from "play any dps class/spec you want" to "Bring CC or die" puts the workload on us to heal through the extra damage when your random is a dps DK, warrior, and feral druid.

Your attempt to force players to be more situationally aware just equates to more party healing with smaller relative heals.

Add to that the fact that your design for Healing is FUBAR and this healer exodus is going to keep on going until the game grinds to a halt.

Making choices about what spells to cast based on efficiency SUCKS. its boring, painful, lame, puts us at odds with groups instead of inducing teamwork, and forces more bar and CD watching and less time for interesting responsive play and participation in the physical environment and the encounters.


From the first announcements of how Cata was going to play, Bliz has been very up-front about how they expect the game to be played:

- all party/raid members take more responsibility for how much damage they receive
- mana costs go up to pressure healers to heal efficiently
- all classes get *some* kind of either damage mitigation, CC, avoidance, misdirect, evasion, etc to help get out of damage
- boss fight balance takes mana management into a greater account than in Wrath

You can certainly point out that you don't *like* these choices but saying that it's at odds with teamwork is completely wrong; the game pressures you to work more as a team. You can't fix other people's bad choices the same way you could before. You can't carry the whole party the same way you could before. If you are not the healer, you have to pay attention to your own health. You have to help your teammates by using more of your skills than just doing DPS.

That's why we all got these huge increases in HP, to give us time to step out of the fire and to refresh CC, DG the loose add away from the mage, do all kinds of stuff. Heals can't feel "strong" in this game anymore because if they were strong and mana efficient, we would go back to making up for mistakes, my mistakes, yours, the DPS, the tank, whoever. I'll be overjoyed when I see someone take damage and actually bandage themselves. The first time I ran Vortex Pinnacle, we had such good CC and teamwork, even though 4/5ths of the group had never been there before, we didn't wipe, we never came close and we had a boatload of fun all learning together. As a team.

Inevitably someone will look at my profile and say "u hazn't heald heroic n00b", and that person will completely miss the whole point. I can't heal heroics because I don't have the gear yet, and that is a fantastic choice on Bliz's part. When I get the gear, I'll heal heroics. Until then, I'll heal normals. While I'm healing normals, I'll be participating in ways I wasn't really allowed to before. In all of Wrath, I was never asked to hex pull. Not once. In Cata, I'm a full part of the team, contributing to the pull, the fight, a minor amount of damage but more importantly, I'm expected to do more than just what the little icon next to my raid frame says.

91 Human Priest
5135
12/17/2010 1:13 PMPosted by Hirano
Does this mean as a Healer I am going to need to run the normals until I get 346 and higher gear to be viable while DPS can rock Heroics at 333?


Yeah, isn't that fun?


That's one word for it.

Blizzard, you guys are making tons of money. Since you've made healing a job no one wants to do maybe you should think about paying us.

Making choices about what spells to cast based on efficiency SUCKS. its boring, painful, lame, puts us at odds with groups instead of inducing teamwork, and forces more bar and CD watching and less time for interesting responsive play and participation in the physical environment and the encounters.
85 Human Paladin
0
Hey! I've stopped taking damage for a moment! The healer is busy with the tank! I HURT SO MUCH!

...What's this "bandage" do?

+5000 HP
+5000 HP
+5000 HP

OMG! I R HEALZ!

Seriously, as DPS, take initiative and save the healer whatever you possibly can. The fights can be long, and anything to spare a healer trouble is nothing but a plus.

75 Tauren Shaman
950
12/17/2010 1:16 PMPosted by Emarkham
That's why we all got these huge increases in HP, to give us time to step out of the fire and to refresh CC, DG the loose add away from the mage, do all kinds of stuff. Heals can't feel "strong" in this game anymore because if they were strong and mana efficient, we would go back to making up for mistakes, my mistakes, yours, the DPS, the tank, whoever. I'll be overjoyed when I see someone take damage and actually bandage themselves. The first time I ran Vortex Pinnacle, we had such good CC and teamwork, even though 4/5ths of the group had never been there before, we didn't wipe, we never came close and we had a boatload of fun all learning together. As a team.


Chances are, more often than not, you will get grouped into a PuG that does not follow this criteria. I actually had fun making up for the mistake of others back in wrath.

Now, I can't deal with them anymore, so I just stopped healing altogether. Game is not fun in it's current state and in fact I canceled my account -- just waiting my subscription to expire in 8 days. Yay!
85 Tauren Shaman
7315
12/17/2010 1:27 PMPosted by Hirano
That's why we all got these huge increases in HP, to give us time to step out of the fire and to refresh CC, DG the loose add away from the mage, do all kinds of stuff. Heals can't feel "strong" in this game anymore because if they were strong and mana efficient, we would go back to making up for mistakes, my mistakes, yours, the DPS, the tank, whoever. I'll be overjoyed when I see someone take damage and actually bandage themselves. The first time I ran Vortex Pinnacle, we had such good CC and teamwork, even though 4/5ths of the group had never been there before, we didn't wipe, we never came close and we had a boatload of fun all learning together. As a team.


Chances are, more often than not, you will get grouped into a PuG that does not follow this criteria. I actually had fun making up for the mistake of others back in wrath.

Now, I can't deal with them anymore, so I just stopped healing altogether. Game is not fun in it's current state and in fact I canceled my account -- just waiting my subscription to expire in 8 days. Yay!


I've played soccer with people who aren't any fun and don't want to work as a team. I've played basketball with people who aren't any fun and don't want to work as a team. Sometimes the answer is to rise to the occasion. Sometimes the answer is to play on another team. I joined a guild to play with people I like. If i'm PuGging and it's completely falling apart and I have to drop group, I'll go dig up artifacts until I can queue again.

Someone above mentioned that they bangage themselves... I love that!
75 Tauren Shaman
950
12/17/2010 1:35 PMPosted by Emarkham
I've played soccer with people who aren't any fun and don't want to work as a team. I've played basketball with people who aren't any fun and don't want to work as a team. Sometimes the answer is to rise to the occasion. Sometimes the answer is to play on another team. I joined a guild to play with people I like. If i'm PuGging and it's completely falling apart and I have to drop group, I'll go dig up artifacts until I can queue again.


I think I like my solution better. Take my money elsewhere. I don't pay to be frustrated the vast majority of time.

If Bobby Kotick / Michael Morhain all care about their product making as much money as possible, then I shall speak in an language they can understand and see that they cannot keep their customers forever, if their customers become dissatisfied with their product.
Edited by Hirano on 12/17/2010 1:42 PM PST
85 Tauren Shaman
7315
12/17/2010 1:40 PMPosted by Hirano
I've played soccer with people who aren't any fun and don't want to work as a team. I've played basketball with people who aren't any fun and don't want to work as a team. Sometimes the answer is to rise to the occasion. Sometimes the answer is to play on another team. I joined a guild to play with people I like. If i'm PuGging and it's completely falling apart and I have to drop group, I'll go dig up artifacts until I can queue again.


I think I like my solution better. Take my money elsewhere. I don't pay to be frustrated the vast majority of time.

If Bobby Kotick / Michael Morhain all care about their product making as much money as possible, then I shall speak in an language they can understand and see that they cannot keep their customers forever, if their customers become dissatisfied with their product.


They knew full well that a vocal minority of people would leave when they made Cata. They knew that another vocal minority would try and frame the changes as "gamebreaking" or "effing stupid" and remain to post all kinds of inflammatory comments in the forums. Happens every expansion. But for the most part, the player base would be interested in seeing the new content.

Cata has already broken sales records, if that minority stops playing, it's a fair price to pay for all the new purchases. And on top of it, the PvE game is fun (for people like me).
91 Human Priest
5135
@ Emarkham

look, if you want to tow the line for blizzard be my guest, but if you want to discuss the issue with me we're going to have to get past the surface understanding of this all being a matter of "party and/or healers should L2P".

I know that people need to l2p. its a new xpac and humans are apparently slow learners after they put their adolescent years behind them..

1. choosing your heals due to mana efficiency and not a response to the situation isnt fun. just like you said, the huge mana pools mean you wait to cast your efficient heal rather than cast an appropriate heal. I disagree that allowing you to cast an appropriate heal instead of an efficient one means that we will be able to make up for mistakes. If you want a mistake to cost, you make it cost. You dont make it a perpetual choice for the healer to make about when to start letting people die. I would even argue that healers should be able to do some amount of mitigating mistakes, but you should have to pick the heal, absorb, hot, or dispel that's actually going to be appropriate for the situation and save them.

2. making a change in cc requirements is great but since they didnt actually give all classes CC or the ability to offtank it results in more party damage which is a burden on HEALERS.

3. increasing the difficulty and odds of taking party damage is the l2p issue, but even under ideal circumstances with intelligent players who've figured out the cata paradigm you're still going to have more party damage. That makes your efficiency healing game suck even more. Blizz, if you want to do healers a favor make AE encounter damage kill dps outright. Another suggestion I saw from a healer, which is a GREAT one, is to make the AE reduce the players damage output - something about which they actually care and for which they take personal responsibility.

"It will get better when they L2P" doesnt solve the fact that healing is painful. This isnt about difficulty. Its about bad scaling and bad design, and putting the bulk of the responsibility for their design changes (some good, some really bad) on healers.
75 Tauren Shaman
950
12/17/2010 1:50 PMPosted by Emarkham
They knew full well that a vocal minority of people would leave when they made Cata. They knew that another vocal minority would try and frame the changes as "gamebreaking" or "effing stupid" and remain to post all kinds of inflammatory comments in the forums. Happens every expansion. But for the most part, the player base would be interested in seeing the new content.

Cata has already broken sales records, if that minority stops playing, it's a fair price to pay for all the new purchases. And on top of it, the PvE game is fun (for people like me).


Don't count on that, I think they're more interested in retaining the player base actually -- after all, 3 months of subscription is more than the game itself, if they're able to retain a player for 6 months, that's more than double than the game itself... see where I'm going?

Moreover, I think I belong to the average demographic that forms the player base for this game: the casual. If just 5% of the total fanbase does not renew their subs, that is 9 million dollars a month that they will stop receiving.

The problem is actually that the average player cannot see the new content without growing frustrated and if that does not change, they will just go somewhere else. Simple as that.

Heck, in fact, I'm actually contributing to the frustration of others, as I simply stopped healing. And I will not resume healing unless things change -- if things changes for the better, then blizz can have my business again and I will resume paying 15 dollars a month for their service.

Top 1% player base can rejoice, but blizz could see itself losing millions of dollars on the long run, and actually as early as 3 months from now.
Edited by Hirano on 12/17/2010 2:17 PM PST
75 Tauren Shaman
950
Posted by Mainstreet
Lol. Nobody would play the game. But I see your point.


Well, I was under the understanding that everyone here that disagreed with anyone that complained about the lackluster, boring performance of healing at the moment did so due to the fact that they wanted a challenge. This would bring a challenge yes?


Let's share the fun healing currently is to the other classes!
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