Thank you Blizzard

12 Dwarf Priest
50
Getting shifted out of fights like Cho'gall where killing adds is important really shows that you did it perfect with ret! Since we don't have good,reliable aoe and dps maintenance, we are pretty useless for fights with add killing.
Again, thx a lot, keep up the good work.
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10 Gnome Rogue
50
What are you counting as reliable AoE?

in what way is DS failing?
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100 Blood Elf Paladin
17045
12/20/2010 6:09 PMPosted by Gidgite
in what way is DS failing?



HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

...oh gid. ;P
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10 Gnome Rogue
50
I'm not disagreeing, I'm just wanting the OP's take on the matter.


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100 Dwarf Paladin
10860
It flat out sucks on anything less than 5 targets and even then its only just break even. Combine that with abysmal Consecrate and Holy "meteor" Wrath and we literally have the weakest aoe in the game period.
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10 Gnome Rogue
50
' literally . . . period. '

care to back up vague QQing with numbers?
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100 Dwarf Paladin
10860
Okay numbers... I will point you to Worldoflogs and look for any fight that has appreciable AoE and you will find pallies at the bottom of the barrel but if that is not enough then I will use our Warrior brethren as an example.

Cleave
30 Rage Melee Range
Instant 3 sec cooldown
Requires Melee Weapon
A sweeping attack that strikes the target and a nearby ally, dealing (6 + $ap * 0.562) physical damage.

Whirlwind Berserker Stance
25 Rage
Instant 10 sec cooldown
Requires Melee Weapon
Requires Berserker Stance
In a whirlwind of steel you attack all enemies within 8 yards, causing 65% weapon damage from both melee weapons to each enemy.

Meat Cleaver Rank 2
Dealing damage with Cleave or Whirlwind increases the damage of Cleave and Whirlwind by 10% for 10 sec. This effect stacks up to 3 times.

So lets see here we have Cleave which when glyphed hits up to 3 targets for 56.2 percent of the Warriors AP. Keeping meat cleaver up is 30 percent more on top of that. Whirlwind which equates to 95 percent weapon damage with meat cleaver up. 3 and 10 second cooldowns respectivley.

Now lets look at the pally versions:

Divine Storm
5% of base mana
Instant cast 4.5 sec cooldown
Requires Melee Weapon
An instant attack that causes 80% weapon damage to all enemies within 8 yards. The Divine Storm heals up to 3 party or raid members totaling 25% of the damage caused.

Holy Wrath Level 85
20% of base mana
Instant cast 15 sec cooldown
Sends bolts of holy power in all directions, causing (0.61 * holy power + 2435) Holy damage divided among all targets within 10 yds and stunning all Demons, Dragonkin, Elementals and Undead for 3 sec.

Consecration
55% of base mana
Instant cast 30 sec cooldown
Consecrates the land beneath the Paladin, doing (81 * 10) Holy damage over 10 sec to enemies who enter the area.

So lets see this toolkit. DS which is 80 percent weapon damage every 4.5 seconds seems pretty good at first glance until you factor in Meat Cleaver for both Cleave and Whirlwind which when used together are spammable. Consecration isnt really worth the mana cost due to the absurdly long cooldown. Holy Wrath scales with Holy Power but is bound by a long cooldown itself and if you wait til you have 3 hp to cast it you just wasted lots of TV damage.
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1 Draenei Warrior
0
Reasonable question so here are numbers:

Consecration
55% of base mana
Instant cast 30 sec cooldown
Consecrates the land beneath the Paladin, doing (81 * 10) Holy damage over 10 sec to enemies who enter the area.

Holy Wrath
20% of base mana
Instant cast 15 sec cooldown
Sends bolts of holy power in all directions, causing (0.61 * holy power + 2435) Holy damage divided among all targets within 10 yds and stunning all Demons and Undead for 3 sec.

D.S. only has a 20% chance to proc HPP needed for our "signature move" and shares a cool down with our only consistent HPP generator of CS.

Divine Storm
5% of base mana
Instant cast 4.5 sec cooldown
Requires Melee Weapon
An instant attack that causes 80% weapon damage to all enemies within 8 yards. The Divine Storm heals up to 3 party or raid members totaling 25% of the damage caused.

Notice the lack of Holy Damage that DS has. Now look at our level 81 talent for Ret.

Inquisition
Instant
Consumes all Holy Power to increase your Holy Damage by 30%. Lasts 4 sec per charge of Holy Power consumed.
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
5750
I'm fairly certain that the wording on Holy Wrath is just odd, and that it actually scales with Spell Power, not Holy Power. It is just worded that way since it scales with Holy-type Spell Power, and back before they just made Spell Power a stat, there were pieces that actually increased specific types of spell schools.

So it will do the same damage at 1 HP as it does at 3.
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100 Dwarf Paladin
10860
No it scales with Holy Power... i tested it the damage goes up with 3 charges of holy power.... but to make it remotely useful you have to HOLD the HP in an AoE situation and the fact that it is a meteor effect makes it all the crappier.
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10 Gnome Rogue
50
Notice the lack of Holy Damage that DS has. Now look at our level 81 talent for Ret.


Personally I think that's the problem.

DS really ought to be holy damage so it scales with inq.


Alternatively it could deal out seal damage.
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1 Draenei Warrior
0
I know, 25% of my 80% of my weapon damage split among 3 people isn't that great unless you have a lot of mobs. The breakeven point had been calculated at 5 mobs verses CS-TV and I suspect that is still the case.

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