What I'd like to see for ret

I've been gearing up as prot lately in the hopes that blizz finally realizes how craptacular ret is, especially in pvp, and was thinking it should function a bit closer to how prot does. My thinking is that our dependance on auto-attacks for our "fun" procs should be changed to work more like the grand crusader talent in the prot tree. here's the idea:

- When your crusader strike and divine storm deal damage to their primary target, they have x% to grant the hand of light effect.

Now of course a few other things would need to be tweaked as well. Divine storm need to generate holy power. That way it works just like hammer of the righteous for an actual aoe rotation.

Art of war could also benefit from the grand crusader treatment as well, here's an idea:

-When your "filler" attacks deal damage/crit? to their primary target, they have x% chance to grant the art of war effect.

Hopefully those changes would put us in a better position, especially in pvp. I'm pretty sure everyone hates depending on auto attacks and the trouble it causes for not being in range in a pvp setting.

Just a couple more things that I'd think would smooth out the jagged edges of the spec:

-Seal of Truth: stacking censure via auto attacks is t3h suck. Our ramp up is long enough as it is...make our abilities stack it, get rid of stacking, reduce them....something.

-Inquisition has got to go. As prot I find it totally useless..not sure about holy, and for ret its still bad. Make it some sort of filler attack that does damage to a single target, and increases holy damage by x%. Still has a bit of its old flavor, but now used single target to replace holy wraths senseless murder of critters and robbing our dmg. Holy wrath would now become a part of the aoe rotation and go back to it's old effect, no more meteor.

-Just give cs/ds the 3 sec cd they deserve. Ds should proc a holy power as stated above.

-Sanctity of battle to reduce cd on hammer/repentance to reflect cs cd change. A bit more control in pvp would be nice.

-Retribution aura is very lack luster, maybe make it like the old Sanctity Aura

-Seal of justice is balls...make all melee attacks(inc. cs/ds/tv) slow the target by x/y/z and prevent them from moving over 100%.

-Selfless healer...again...not very well liked, and since our survivability is rather low as it is right now just have it increase the effectiveness of our WoG's as a whole. This also gives a bit more choice in the tree as opposed to the choice of not taking it.

-zealotry...does the same thing, but hand of light procs extend duration by x seconds, making them not feel like they are robbing you.

-deadzone on long arm of the law removed, resistant to snares for x sec of its duration

-mastery redone to holy damage again.

-divine purpose would work like the grand crusaer talent

So our basic rotations would be:
cs,judge,cs,inq,cs,tv ...single target not including procs
ds,judge,ds,hw,cs,tv ...multi-target not including procs

Hope you like my ideas. Feel free to add whatever i missed/comment, and sorry for the long post. Hopefully blizz gets on the ball and gives us some proper fixing soon.
Edited by Odinvance on 12/17/2010 9:19 AM PST
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87 Blood Elf Paladin
8120
i agree as well i feel useless in aoe situations, not to mention frustrated out of my mind waiting for the rng to be in my favor. everything being all over the screen is annoying too, haveing to see when i have 3hp making sure inquisition is always up, but burning the 3 hp just to put it back up... There is a lot of jagged edges. i dont think blizz will do all that you sugested but even if they do a couple it might redeem pallys from this lolret v2
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
8155
12/17/2010 5:27 AMPosted by Odinvance
-Seal of Truth: stacking censure via auto attacks is t3h suck. Our ramp up is long enough as it is...make our abilities stack it, get rid of stacking, reduce them....something.


This is due to WotLK. It broke retribution really hard.

-Inquisition has got to go. As prot I find it totally useless..not sure about holy, and for ret its still bad. Make it some sort of filler attack that does damage to a single target, and increases holy damage by x%. Still has a bit of its old flavor, but now used single target to replace holy wraths senseless murder of critters and robbing our dmg. Holy wrath would now become a part of the aoe rotation and go back to it's old effect, no more meteor.


They want us to keep track of something, not just hit 1,2,3,4 and be 'awesome'. I like inquisition, once again, our problem is just the procs.


12/17/2010 5:27 AMPosted by Odinvance
-Just give cs/ds the 3 sec cd they deserve. Ds should proc a holy power as stated above.


Agree on the DS thing. Either that or increase our AoE capabilities. Sucks to depend on DS without a HoPo, Consecration on that huge CD (and mana) or Holy Wrath (which isnt really an AoE ability).


12/17/2010 5:27 AMPosted by Odinvance
-Sanctity of battle to reduce cd on hammer/repentance to reflect cs cd change. A bit more control in pvp would be nice.


I would love to have repentance on a duration higher than the CD for PvE reasons. Don't care about PvP, and a nice way to do it, IMO, is giving Repentance a 30s cooldown, 45s duration and 2s cast. Problem solved for PvE at least.

12/17/2010 5:27 AMPosted by Odinvance
-Retribution aura is very lack luster, maybe make it like the old Sanctity Aura


Well, it's free damage. It's the worst aura we have, but if every other buff is granted, it's better than Crusader Aura in a fight.

12/17/2010 5:27 AMPosted by Odinvance
-Seal of justice is balls


True, but I don't PvP, so I don't know if it's useable there.

12/17/2010 5:27 AMPosted by Odinvance
-Selfless healer...again...not very well liked, and since our survivability is rather low as it is right now just have it increase the effectiveness of our WoG's as a whole. This also gives a bit more choice in the tree as opposed to the choice of not taking it.


Selfless healer is there for flavor. If you think you can help other the healer sometimes, do it. I prefer doing it with Holy Radiance, though. Or even hard casting a Divine Light. But that's me.

12/17/2010 5:27 AMPosted by Odinvance
-zealotry...does the same thing, but hand of light procs extend duration by x seconds, making them not feel like they are robbing you.


This one, IMO, could be revamped. It's against our current state. We live of procs atm (got them? Good! Didnt? Sink to the bottom) and zealotry is pretty much the opposite. "Ignore procs (except HoL) and just hit CS and TV! Forget those AoW procs you got! And Divine Purpose doesn't exist AT ALL!"

12/17/2010 5:27 AMPosted by Odinvance
-mastery redone to holy damage again


I'm in favor of removing one RNG dependancy on us, yes. Don't think your solution is the way to go though.

So our basic rotations would be:
cs,judge,cs,inq,cs,tv ...single target not including procs
ds,judge,ds,hw,cs,tv ...multi-target not including procs


You are simplifying our rotation. Don't really like that. In LK, we could get close to a mob and stare at a timer and kill the target without ever looking at the screen. Sure, you mentioned procs, but IMO the way they are now is the problem, not the rest of the 'rotation'. Lower the proc dependancy and keep Inquisition is a better solution for me.
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Thanks for the feedback

So our basic rotations would be:
cs,judge,cs,inq,cs,tv ...single target not including procs
ds,judge,ds,hw,cs,tv ...multi-target not including procs


You are simplifying our rotation. Don't really like that. In LK, we could get close to a mob and stare at a timer and kill the target without ever looking at the screen. Sure, you mentioned procs, but IMO the way they are now is the problem, not the rest of the 'rotation'. Lower the proc dependancy and keep Inquisition is a better solution for me.


Not really...grand crusader procs fit nicely in to the prot rotation in place of the fillers which could also be the case for ret. As far as keeping track of something..thats why we have holy power and procs..inquistition still sucks and doesnt even help what should be our best 2 abilities.
Edited by Odinvance on 12/17/2010 9:17 AM PST
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After doing some arena yesterday as ret I couldnt help but think how some of these changes would really help the spec out. Once i got tired of the go-go-gadget autoattack procs and lack of survivability i decided I'm sticking with prot for arena until blizz figures out what the hell their going to do with ret. Soon as I swapped my gear and spec the difference was amazing...my 3's team went undefeated the entire time i was prot.
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