Prot PvP Flag Carrier Guide

85 Blood Elf Warrior
5415
This is a guide on how to Prot PvP FC in RBG's. Here see such things as gemming/forging priorities, tactics, addons and videos of Prot PvP FCing.

Prot PvP Flag Carrier Guide
I. Spec
a. Gyphs
II. Gear
a. Enchants
b. Reforging
c. Gemming
III. Macros/Keybinds
IV. Tactics
V. Addons
VI. Videos
VII. Live Stream
VIII. Debate
IV. Questions
I. Spec
As a flag carrier you are not looking to a big damage numbers person, let your DPS do that job, but you are to be a control type person. You want to be Silencing mages and aoe stunning large groups. Your job is also to survive while you are being focused and to stun/silence those on your healers, mind controlling teammates and mana burning.
A common FC spec is 7/3/31
<a href="http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/mannoroth/shoukon/talent/secondary">http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/mannoroth/shoukon/talent/secondary</a>

Arms Tree: The first two tiers is great for prot warriors looking for survivability.
-Blitz (2/2): So as the teams mass stunner on Defense this is a useful talent and will be explained more in the Tactics section.
-Field Dressing (2/2): Get more heals
-War Academy (1/3): Just trying to get down the tree & save points for prot tree.
-Second Wind (2/2): You will constantly be immobilize and stunned when you're running from their base to yours so getting the rage to Spell Reflect or Intercept or intervene or Shockwave etc + the 5% health (.05x175k team buffed= 8,750 healed each stun/immobilizing effect) is a healers dream.

Fury Tree: There is no need to go deep into the Fury Tree for there is nothing obtainable that will help survivability.
-Bloodcraze (3/3): This talent did get nerfed in Cata, but for a FC it is priceless, valuable and a must. Video 6 shows where a few k of hp made the difference in cap or death.

Prot Tree: Here I will explain the talents not taken for the ones taken are more than obvious.
-Incite (0/3): Heroic Strike is fishy at the moment.
-Improved Revenge (0/2): With a good weapon devastate still hits harder than revenge and it is better to save your talent points for the arms/fury tree for HP regen.
-Impending Victory (1/2): Honestly 1 put was put into it because I had one left over. In the many games I have played I have not seen it all too often and do not have much opportunity to use it since you’re trying to stay rite on the flag cap and not chasing down a target.
-Heavy Repercussions (0/2): Good talent but held out for survivability talents.

a. Glyphs
Glyphs are pretty straightforward for a survival FC spec.

Prime Glyphs: Really no other choices for this. I played with the overpower glyph but devastate did more damage.
Glyph of Devastate
Glyph of Shield Slam
Glyph of Revenge

Major: All of these are about survival.
Glyph of Shield Wall- Bump your disarmable Damage Reduction to 60%.
Glyph of Spell Reflection: You are always spamming SR while under fire so get as many in as you can.
Glyph of Shockwave: A life saver for yourself and your teammates. Have it as much as you can.

Minor: There are no truly helpful glyphs here so choose as you like, but not the sunder glyph.
Glyph of Demoralizing Shout- I try to keep this up when under fire and that extra 15 seconds helps keep it out of my rotation.
Glyph of Battle: In case you don’t have a DK or dps Warrior in the group.
Glyph of Command- In case you don’t have a Priest in your group.
Edited by Shoukon on 8/11/2011 7:22 PM PDT
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85 Blood Elf Warrior
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II. Gear
Gear isn’t too hard for a prot pvp. Get everything with resilience on it. I will only talk about such items as trinkets where there are different choices.

Trinkets:
1. Ruthless Gladiator's Medallion of Tenacity- Resil + 2 min removal.
2. Ruthless Gladiator's Emblem of Tenacity- This trinket came out recently with Resil + 20k hp buff. This trinket is great to use when you are getting blown up and have a /cast trinket /cast last stand /cast enraged regeneration moment.
3. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7yznMIXQOkQ is a link that shows how to use two different Ruthless Gladiator's Emblem of Tenacity as human.

a. Enchants:
Enchanting you can go a few ways. You can enchant more str/crit if u want to have a tad bit more damage as prot as so when you are trying to clear out a room in RBG or go full survivability. If you want to have damage output just enchant as you would fury/arms. For survivability enchant as if you were a PvE tank for the most part, excluding expertise.
Head: Arcanum of the Earthen Ring
Shoulder: Greater Inscription of Unbreakable Quartz
Cloak: Enchant Cloak - Protection or Formula: Enchant Cloak - Greater Critical Strike
Chest: Enchant Chest - Mighty Resilience
Bracers: Scroll of Enchant Bracer - Major Stamina or Enchant Bracer - Dodge or Enchant Bracer - Greater Critical Strike
Hands: Enchant Gloves - Greater Mastery (block)
Legs: Drakehide Leg Armor
Boots: Enchant Boots - Lavawalker or Enchant Boots - Earthen Vitality (depending on meta)
1h: Enchant Weapon - Windwalk
Shield: Enchant Shield - Mastery

b. Reforging:
Reforging is a balancing act. This is where you want to try to make sure your Hit is at 5% or closest to it and then reforge heavily into Mastery. I know many will ask about expertise and I don’t reforge into it for the simple fact not many of our critical moves are based on it, for instance shockwave, so I just keep my expertise at 3. I will admit sometimes I regret that when a concussion blow is dodged, but not enough to take Mastery out for it. Also I have been running 3% hit to get more mastery and it hasn't hindered so If you want a bit more mastery go for it.

c. Geming
Gemming is pretty strait forward of resil/stam/str. A good goal is to try to reach 40% damage reduction from resil then stack str/hp on top of that. You’re really trying to make sure the incoming damage is not a huge threat (resil) and when it is your last stand + enraged regeneration +trinket hp regen get a boost from your high hp pool since last stand is a +30% of your total hp and etc. Also, remember Strength=Parry.
-Gems to use most frequently.
- Sovereign Demonseye -Steady Dream Emerald
- Mystic Amberjewel -Effulgent Shadowspirit Diamond
- Resplendent Ember Topaz
Edited by Shoukon on 8/1/2011 3:36 PM PDT
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85 Blood Elf Warrior
5415
III. Macros & Keybinds
Your macros should be constantly evolving as you learn what enemy teams are trying to do to you to get you down and how to do your job faster. Even in the video I’ve linked in this post you see my bartender change throughout the games with added macros. So once you have a set of macros keep adding and tuning them.

Intervene: I have a separate macro for each of my healers per game that I just click instead of clicking them in the frame and then pressing intervene. This is a MUST macro for it will break you out of all roots and give the healer you intervened Safeguard + you take a hit for them that you can spell reflect off.
#showtooltip intervene
/target YourHealersNameHere
/cast defensive stance
/cast intervene

Defensive Stance: I have this in my battle stance only for when I change to use Shattering Throw or hamstring.
/cast defensive stance

Hamstring: Just to slow down people who love to run.
#showtooltip hamstring
/cast battle stance
/cast hamstring

Oh Crap Button (All your heals): Use this when healers die or are all in CC and you are getting blown to hell.
#showtooltip enraged regeneration
/cast last stand
/cast bloodthirsty gladiator's emblem of Tenacity
/cast berserker rage
/cast enraged regeneration

Shield Wall: This really is my Shield Wall macro for when I am arms but I still use it in my prot if for some reason I accidently have a 2h out. Can’t hurt to have it, only helps. Don’t forget to Glyph into Shield Wall.
#showtooltip Shield Wall
/stopcasting Heroic Strike(Rank 13)
/cast Defensive Stance
/equip vicious gladiator's right render
/equip Vicious Gladiator's Shield Wall
/cast Shield Wall
/cast Shield Block
/cancleaura Bladestorm

Spell Reflect: Spam this constantly. Weapon change in there in case you have a 2h out (don’t ever have a 2h out as prot).
#showtooltip Spell Reflection
/stopcasting
/equipslot 16 Vicious Gladiator's Right Render
/equipslot 17 Vicious Gladiator's Shield Wall
/cast Spell Reflection

Charge/Intervene/Intercept: I have a hard time letting go of this Macro since it took so long to make this, so I keep it to the side and I primarily use it if I need to click one of my dps to Intervene them since I won’t have a special macro for them.
/cast [help,stance:2]Intervene;[help,nostance:2]Defensive Stance;[combat,harm,nostance:3]Berserker Stance;[nocombat,nostance:1]Battle Stance;[combat,harm,stance:3]Intercept;[nocombat,stance:1]Charge

Shattering Throw: Get those BOP’s off your targets and pally bubbles etc.
#showtooltip shattering throw
/cast Battle Stance
/cast Shattering Throw
Edited by Shoukon on 2/20/2011 9:40 AM PST
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85 Blood Elf Warrior
5415
IV. Tactics
The Tactics you use as a FC are very situational but there are a few rules that seem to be golden and apply at least 92% of the time.

1. When you are finally in the flag room and waiting to cap and there is a rogue on the enemy team, Always save you trinket and Heroic Leap for when he drops smokebomb because (1) You cannot intervene out of it & (2) He and all his pals just blew all their cc’s to get you down in the smokebomb so ruin that for them. In the video of Not Recruiting v Argent Dawn you see how quickly you can be downed in smokebomb and I took my sweat time getting out of it and died.

2. Choose wisely when you will use intervene/intercept/charge/heroic leap. try to predict what the enemy team will do and tell your healers where to be placed. Also don't be scared to charge/intervene pets to get yourself ahead. General rule is to use HL last. 1:23-1:50 Video 6.

3. DON’T get too far ahead of your healers. You will die if you do. Walk back to them if you have to. You see me doing this in one of the Not Recruiting Video's where I ask my healers how far ahead of them I am and they say "A mile away" so I go back.

4. Don’t be afraid to charge back to help your healers move forward. The enemy team will be CCing and killing your healers on the way to your flag room so do them a favor and charge the enemy/shock wave/silence them so you can move on forward.

5. Once you have capped a flag leave the room to go get the next flag. Don’t stay there and fight to clear out the room. You are just wasting time you could be spending traveling to get the next flag. Also once you get good at this you can do a dance after a cap to insult them and keep on going. VIdeo 6 (2:25-2:47)

6. When you and your healers/dps are sitting on the cap waiting for your other DPS to kill their FC, make sure to be shutting out a caster. The easiest one for me to shut out is a priest. They like to mind control/mana burn so just make sure they’re useless. Charge/intercept/shield bash/ heroic throw silence/BE silence of BE/concussion blow. Train that on them over and over again to make life easier on your healers. Also prioritize shutting out Arcane mages.

7. Do not get too far from your cap unless you know you will have the instant mobility to get onto the flag cap. I will sit on the Flag cap until I see I have a trinket & heroic leap up. You aren’t the dps and your job isn’t to kill the enemies, your first job is to (1) Survive (2) Cap (3) Shut out a caster (priest/mage) (4) Save your healers (5) Then help kill.

8. When you see the enemy flag carrier go down use spell reflect when you are trying to cap & LoS. Dk’s love to death grip you off the cap so death grip them to you. Also druids like to cyclone you can’t cap etc. WSG is the only bg you can LoS so use it when you can.
8a. Boomkins can blow you off the stand and Ele can do the same and spell reflect won't help you so If you see one of them there make sure to silence/stun them long enough for the cap to happen or be ready to charge back at them immediately after they blow you off.

9. Hide your battle standards. In WSG try placing it almost in the wall inside the cap. TP just find a corner to put it in.

10. Keep constant communication up with your healers. Find out which needs a peel and when their CC’s are up or down. Also tell them where you want them to be for fast intervenes.

11. When Pummel is up, use it if you know it'll help you in the long run. I know this seems counter intuitive because you want to use it to interrupt, but now many classes are almost exclusively instant cast so just silence them for 5,2,1 seconds every 10 seconds. I mainly use this against holy paladins, that like to heal threw Power Word + Holy Shock then another Power Word/ Light of Dawn etc, so to shut the pally down while my teammates are blowing up his beacon. I sometimes do this with Heroic Throw also, but sparingly.


12a. Regardless if you get interrupted or not with SR up, it is good to have SR up while capping a flag because you will sheep/hex/cyclone/blind/fear a whole lot of people.
Edited by Shoukon on 8/9/2011 9:37 AM PDT
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85 Blood Elf Warrior
5415
13. One good tactic I'm using on teams that are very heavy O for WSG/TP is to have your healers spread apart in a triangle. One on the cap, another directly in front of the first one but about 20-30 yards and the third to the east or west of them, mattering where the clutter fight is at. Use intervene to each of those healers to kite the crowd of Offensive enemies. So say I have a healer to the east, kite the enemies to the west then intervene your eastern healer ( the one farthest away). It gives a breather for your healers. Also in case your heroic leap is down you can intervene to your healer on the cap to cap. If the enemy team's O is all casters I don't use this strat since this is mainly to disrupt melee dps. Just LoS/SR and shut down a caster in that case. I"ll have a video of this tactic up soon.

14. People try to get fancy and dps/heal from 2nd of 3rd floors of TP/WSG. If you don't have a DK to death grip them down you need to simply LoS them. On WSG LoS under the 2nd floor as if you are running down the ramp. That gives space so you guys can spread out and the enemy cannot take advantage of any aoe crowd control or damage. This also will make sure you will not be LoS from your healers if you or they are feared away. Do not hide all stacked on the flag cap in WSG. We tried that and they threw smoke bomb, feared heals away and almost destroyed me in seconds and everyone needed heals since there was a bladestorming warrior.
-In TP hide under the 2nd floor ledge near the water. Make them jump down. If they don't want to jump down then they're doing nothing. This is also a good way, on both maps, to suck in their melee dps to LoS their healers, that are on the roof, and you have an opportunity to blow them up quickly.

15. Don't always be in a rush to use berzerker rage to get out of fear/sap. It is sometimes better to eat the fear when there is no danger than to blow it then get refeared at another time when you need to be capping the flag. Early on I would always use BR when it was up...then one time when I went to cap I got spam feared/cycloned and missed a cap and if I had BR it would of been no problem. So if you know the EFC mite go down soon, make sure all your CC breakers/reflecters are available.

16. Use the new GY locations to your advantage. Have your team keep open communication about the GY rez timer or keep track of it yourself. In video six you see me suicide and take advantage of this. Video 6 4:00-4:31.

17. Have your pally Freedom/BoP you when you initially get attacked when getting flag, it'll get you out of a pinch unless you get sheeped (pally make sure mage is stunned in process). Video of this at 4:15-4:30 of Video 3 FC Section.

18. Keep your best healer on the cap for intervenes for caps. Also there is a delay on when your O clicks the flag and the flag actually returning/you being able to cap so make note of this delay. 9:07-end of Video 3 FC Section shows this delay and what you should do to make sure you cap.

V. Addons: Can all be found on Curse.com

1. Bartender4: Just to clean up your space and have everything compacted and orderly.

2. Cooldown 1.3.6: Lets you know how many seconds are left until your CC is useable again.

3. DotTracker; Lets you know when Rend/Hamstring/Sunder Armor need to be reapplied to your target.

4.Target Assist: Lets you know what your target is and what everyone is targeting for CC and such. Don’t piss people off by breaking sheeps and hunter ice traps.

5. FindTheHealers: This puts a + on top of all the enemy healers heads.

VI. Videos
Here I will try to make video’s that show Prot PvP action so others can see things I forget to talk about or things that are situational and see how to and how to not react to them. If you have any trouble with links look up Shoukon32 on youtube and all video's are there.

Prot PvP FC Video's:
Link to all video's.
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=shoukon32&aq=f (Shoukon32 @Youtube)

Edited by Shoukon on 10/16/2011 6:46 PM PDT
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85 Blood Elf Warrior
5415
VII.Stream

I'm going to be streaming my Rated BG Games instead of making movies this season for Angrysnake on my team will be making movies. Games are usually Sunday,Monday,Tuesday,Thursday starting at 7pm EST so keep an eye out of that if you want to see live prot action!.
http://www.xfire.com/live_video/shoukon/

VIII. Debate

Piercing Howl Debate
So there is a debate on whether to get Piercing Howl as a full time Rated BG FC or to get Second Wind.
This is my reasoning for getting Second Wind over Piercing Howl. First it's about roles.
Roles.
My team has clearly stated what people's roles are in the team. My role is to First Survive, Second Stay Mobile and Third To Cap or Defend a Node Flag. So knowing my role I looked into how to spec. All things come down to if you want to AOE Slow people down or every time I'm rooted/stunned/double hamstringed/dk rooted etc etc I gain 5% of my total health. Well, I was told my first role was to survive so I went with gaining 5% of my health each time one of these events happen, and I will tell you it happens often. FC Video 2 I Second Wind Procced 23 Times between start game to first cap (while I had flag). So, 182,000 * .05 =9100 * 23= 209,300HP potential HP gain from Second Wind just from the first run from their base to finally capping. I feel that is much more significent than a slow. Of course though :Disclaimer: your Second Wind will get overlapped for people stun on top of stun and roots so that's why Potential HP gain. FC Video 7 3:15-3:35 Second Wind Procs 2-3 times, but the Important part is that for those 11 or so seconds I was under dire attack Second Wind was healing me the whole time and as you can see in the video my HP bar goes completely gray, so the only thing that saved me to give my Pally enough time to give me LoH and for me to Intervene out was second wind. Also 11 seconds of Second Wind at 182,000buffedhp is 9100hp. That 9100 (actually less because I had less max hp there) made all the difference. Also if you use Last Stand and Trinket and Standard, that all raise your Max HP, it will heal and tick for even more.
Second, it was about Play style and Team Work.
I worked a lot with my healers to make sure I could always be mobile, yet always safe if smoke bomb 2x was dropped on me. For instances, once you're in the WSG room, Piercing Howl becomes lightly effective since the room is so small you have little room to kite. If you kite outside that room, which you may have to at some point, you CANNOT cap which isn't a good thing since one of my roles is to cap. So, with proper positioning of healers and proper tactic on who to charge and when to get my priest to grip me to the roof, piercing howl isn't needed and constantly getting the 5% health is a great bonus. Also, the role of the warrior/mage of the team is to peel for me while I'm running mid field so frost nova/rings/piercing howls etc are going out for me so I can save my rage to do other things. I really believe with good team work your tank and worry more about hard survivability than trying to peel for himself.

IV. Questions
Here I'll be posting the questions others have asked in the thread as well as their answers so you don't have to re-ask a question or go searching for it.

1.
Should I still be stacking resil?

Yes mostly resil then str/stam with Resil gems to your liking.

2.
05/24/2011 08:13 PMPosted by Metaru
What trinkets should I use? I race changed to human and I have an empty spot.

Vicious Gladiator's Badge of Victory with Vicious Gladiator's Emblem of Tenacity. So you still have two trinkets with max resil, you'll just be able to do some more damage on burst. This will go well next patch when we can pop Recklessness, yet stay in prot stance, so you'll have extra blow up power.

3.


How much resil should I have? 4k?

Getting as close to 4k as possible.


When to use Incite

If I could have 3 specs, I'm limited to one arms for when I need to dps RBG's and my 1 prot spec for FC, my third spec which would be a dps prot spec that would trade 2/2 thunderstruck and 1/2 Impending Victory for 3/3 Incite. But honestly even when I'm dpsing in gilnaeus/ab as prot I'm still using cleave because I'm the flag watcher and using Thunder clap on CD so rend is always being spread. Incite is really for random bg, to push out the damage, or if you're doing arena with a prot spec.
Edited by Shoukon on 8/11/2011 7:56 PM PDT
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81 Undead Warrior
750
Awesome post already voted to sticky thank you for taking the time to post it .
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Nice, but I don't know if Second Wind is better than Piercing Howl for this job.

Edited by Explodee on 7/17/2011 10:53 PM PDT
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85 Worgen Warrior
1770
Reflecting Death Grip reverses the effect. You grip the DK to you. :) At least that is what it did for me the last time I used it.
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85 Blood Elf Warrior
5415
Nice, but I don't know if Second Wind is better than Piercing Howl for this job.

Also,

8. When you see the enemy flag carrier go down use spell reflect when you are trying to cap & LoS. Dk’s love to death grip you off the cap so death grip them to you. Also druids like to cyclone you can’t cap etc. WSG is the only bg you can LoS so use it when you can.


Good advice, but Death Grip can't be reflected.

Yea you'll death grip the DK to you. Also 2nd wind is better because the team will constantly immobilize and stun you when you're running from their base to yours so getting the rage to Spell Reflect or Intercept or intervene or Shockwave etc + the 5% health (.05x175k team buffed= 8,750 healed each stun/immobalizing effect)> aoe slow that targets become immune to. Also I always have a frost mage doing his/her thing to help me across so I have no worries about slowing down a group. And if I do need to slow down A group I just shockwave.
Thank you for the critique and I have reflected the outcome in the guide.
Edited by Shoukon on 2/19/2011 6:34 AM PST
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85 Blood Elf Priest
2720
Great guide!
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90 Orc Warrior
8475
Why would you want to be prot to carry flags. Seems like a terrible idea and a waste of a slot in a 10 man rated bg team. Other classes can fill the role of flag carrier without sacrificing everything else good about their class in PvP.

Also your spec seems very fail without heavy repercussions.
Edited by Klankster on 2/19/2011 6:45 AM PST
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85 Blood Elf Warrior
5415
Why would you want to be prot to carry flags. Seems like a terrible idea and a waste of a slot in a 10 man rated bg team. Other classes can fill the role of flag carrier without sacrificing everything else good about their class in PvP.

Also your spec seems very fail without heavy repercussions.

Try carrying a flag in 2k+ games without being prot n tell me how it goes.
Also the lack of Heavy Repercussions was explained in the guide.
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85 Dwarf Warrior
NND
8205
Why would you want to be prot to carry flags. Seems like a terrible idea and a waste of a slot in a 10 man rated bg team. Other classes can fill the role of flag carrier without sacrificing everything else good about their class in PvP.

Also your spec seems very fail without heavy repercussions.


Shoukon is absolutely right. You pretty much need a prot to run the flag versus good teams.
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85 Orc Warrior
2650
I like this guide. The UI layout in the video was very tidy, something I'll have to try myself.

Perhaps you might alter your intervene macro in the guide to say
#showtooltip intervene
/target Nameofyourhealerhere
/cast defensive stance
/cast intervene

so as not to confuse the macro newbies.

Great guide. Bump for justice.


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85 Blood Elf Warrior
5415
Ty yea I'll do that. Also a few more tactics added.
Edited by Shoukon on 2/20/2011 9:55 AM PST
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90 Goblin Warrior
5005
Can you make that vid playable on mobile devices? Thanks.
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90 Human Warrior
4560
One thing that I like to do is to go on the 2nd floor of twin peaks or the roof in WSG. If one of my healers is getting focused, they can just drop down with the melee usually following them. This takes any pressure/cc off of my teammates on "higher ground" so that healers can basically freecast to heal the person that dropped down. I also like this spot because I can easily heroic leap to cap when I need to. My opponents cant get to the flag to pick it up again before I've already heroic leaped over there.

EDIT: Just watched your video and see that you're no stranger to this strat ;)
Edited by Guthrum on 2/21/2011 4:07 AM PST
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90 Draenei Warrior
5460
I'm sure this is a wealth of information, but I couldn't help but crack up when I saw the title.

Prot PvP Flag Carrier Guide:

1. Pick up flag
2. Hit autorun
3. Go to kitchen irl to get a beer
4. Talk on the phone
5. Return to keyboard to discover you've capped the flag
6. Repeat

Also note that when I run the flag as prot I find that it helps to type '/yell KEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKEKE' a lot.
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90 Human Warrior
4560
Would prob work too with a few clutch life grips hah
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