Topic (Sticky) Roguedom: Common Rogue Qs & As (Levels 1-85+)
Rfeann
Sentinels
Rfeann
85 Night Elf Rogue
7470
Edited by Rfeann on 5/11/12 5:48 PM (PDT)
Leveling. Dungeons. Raiding. PvP. Legendaries. Pandaria. Transmogrification. Stealth. Secrecy. Poison. Murder. Deceit. There's so much to know about being a rogue! It's exhausting. What's an aspiring ninja -- or a grizzled sensai in need of news and info -- to do?

Nothing. You're screwed. You'll never be any good.

Oh! Sorry; force of forum habit -- I meant the opposite of that.

In this sticky (which actually spans a number of threads, so don't be alarmed if you end up far from where you started), I -- along with PvP maestro Sheevah -- do our best to answer commonly asked questions on a wide range of topics relevant to every level and breed of rogue, and to serve you up only the top-notchiest of all the top-notch outside resources.

Sorry for non-working links; the forums are presently broked.

HOT TOPICS

          Rogues in the Mists: Upcoming Pandaria Class Changes

          Daddy’s Dentures (a.k.a. Fangs of the Father, the Legendary Daggers)
          http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2369742267#11
                (what they are ~ how to get them ~ how Combat axes/maces/swords compare ~ how to kill Creed and sneak through Gilneas)

          Transmogrification: It’s Not Just for Frankenstein Anymore
          http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2369742267#18
                (leather gear sets ~ visual item libraries ~ weapons you sheath on your back ~ weapons that won't display enchants)


PVE: QUESTING, LEVELING, HEROICS AND RAIDING

          Q & A: Below Level 85
          http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2369742267#5
                (basics ~ fun-ness ~ lockpicking ~ best spec ~ choosing weapons)

          Q & A: Level 85 -- The Basics
          http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2369742267#6
                (best spec ~ choosing talents ~ picking glyphs ~ are you ready for raiding? ~ soloing old dungeons/raids ~ when/how to use Fan of Knives)

          Q & A: Level 85 -- Stats
          http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2369742267#7
                (most important stats for each spec ~ hit caps ~ expertise)

          Q & A: Level 85 -- Gear and Weapons
          http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2369742267#8
                (which weapons in which hand ~ upgrading gear ~ reforging ~ using ShadowCraft ~ best gems and enchants)

          Q & A: Level 85 -- Succeeding in Dungeons and Raids
          http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2369742267#10
                (doing more DPS ~ DPS rotations vs. bosses ~ poisons ~ best professions ~ add-ons ~ macros)

          For More Information: A Guide to Guides
          http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2112091868#2
                (the Internetses' best rogue PvE resources)


PVP: MURDERING, FRUSTRATING AND OTHERWISE INCONVENIENCING OTHER PLAYERS

          Q & A: All Levels -- The Fundamentals
          http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2369742267#12
                (leveling tips ~ why stealth/Vanish don't always work)

          Q & A: Level 85 -- All Specs
          http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2369742267#14
                (guides ~ best race ~ best spec ~ best professions ~ strategies ~ videos ~ macros ~ non-combat pets ~ what Shiv dispels ~ druid stealth)

          Q & A: Level 85 -- Subtlety
          http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2369742267#16
                (stat priority ~ enchants ~ gems ~ glyhps ~ poisons ~ main-hand weapon speed ~ Backstab vs. Hemorrhage)

          For More Information: A Guide to Guides
          http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2112091868#3
                (the best the Web has to offer on further PvP guidance)


MISCELLANY

          Past and Present Rogue Changes
                • Patch 4.3 Rogue Changes: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3229086531
                • Patch 4.3 PvE Rogue Gear: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3595678000
                • Patches 4.1/4.2: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2416158935
                • Patch 4.0 (initial Cataclysm changes): http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1306101393

          Classic/Fun/Helpful/Thoughtful Links
          http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2112091868#4
Rfeann
Sentinels
Rfeann
85 Night Elf Rogue
7470
Edited by Rfeann on 3/18/12 8:39 PM (PDT)
PvE Guides: Questing, Leveling, Heroics, Raiding
========================================

Keep in mind that, while the guides below are spiffy, many were also created much earlier in Cataclysm, so they're not quite as fresh now as they were when they were first written. Still, if I've listed them here, it means there's still plenty of great info to learn within their pages.

General Class Resources

          • Encrypted Text
            Down-to-earth overviews and updates on rogue issues by Chase Christian (aka Madsushi@Azgalor). Chase has a knack for explaining complicated topics in terms that casual or dense players (like me) can understand. (At WoW Insider)
            http://wow.joystiq.com/category/encrypted-text/

          • Shadow Panther's Rogue PvE Resources
            Detailed charts that break down the best gear and gear enhancements at all levels. (By Zodar, at ShadowPanther.net)
            http://www.shadowpanther.net/pve.htm


Basics and Leveling

          • Leveling Basics: "Rogue Leveling FAQ"
            Nice rundown of recommended specs, gear choices, glyphs, etc., for the climb to level 85. (By Aeriwen)
            http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1083749119

          • More Basics: "Newbie Rogue Pointers"
            Basic rules of the road and suggestions for folks who are relatively new to the class. (By Wolfy, at the EU Forums)
            http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1535585708

          • Spec Overviews: "Leveling Your Rogue in Cataclysm"
            Excellent, succinct advice on what to expect from each of our three specs. (By Chase Christian, at WoW Insider)
            http://wow.joystiq.com/2011/08/31/wow-rogue-leveling-guide-catalcysm/

          • By the Numbers: "Rogue Leveling Tips"
            Detailed suggestions on specs, weapons, heirlooms, races and more. (By Zodar, at ShadowPanther.net)
            http://www.shadowpanther.net/leveling.htm


Raiding

          • All Specs: "Cloak and Dagger Compendium"
            In-depth overviews and explanations of every key facet of prepping your rogue for success in Cataclysm raids. (By Caera)
            http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2369743517

          • All Specs: "Cataclysm Raiding FAQ"
            Primer on some key things a raiding rogue should know about the optimal ways to play his/her class. (By Aldriana, at Elitist Jerks)
            http://elitistjerks.com/f78/t110016-cataclysm_raiding_faq_updated_11_29_11_a/

          • All Specs: "Cataclysm 4.0.x Raid Mechanics"
            Boss-by-boss breakdown of rogue abilities that will come in handy during specific Cataclysm raid fights. (By Zulkeir, at Elitist Jerks)
            http://elitistjerks.com/f78/t111200-cataclysm_4_0_x_raid_mechanics/

          • Assassination: "The Mathias Manuscript"
            Comprehensive look at the optimal... well, everything... for level-85 Assassination rogues. (By Verelyse)
            http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1658707015

          • Assassination : "Assassination Guide for Cata"
            The seminal, no-nonsense, min/max runthrough of the "best" everything for a raiding Assassination rogue. (By ieatpaperbag, at Elitist Jerks)
            http://elitistjerks.com/f78/t110134-assassination_guide_cata/

          • Combat: "Combat PvE 4.3"
            An overview of every aspect of raid prep, including the logic behind many of our recommended choices. (By Backstabi)
            http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3711312735

          • Combat: "Combat Guide for Cata"
            The seminal, no-nonsense, min/max runthrough of the "best" everything for a raiding Combat rogue. (By ieatpaperbag, at Elitist Jerks)
            http://elitistjerks.com/f78/t111329-combat_guide_cata/

          • Subtlety: "Sub PvE Guide 2.0"
            Overview of optimal heroic/raid setups for a level-85 Sub rogue; by the same author as the sticky, but more comprehensive. (By Haileaus)
            http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/4139869493

          • Subtlety: "Subtlety Compendium"
            The masters of rogue mathematics sticky a guide for Sub raiders. (By Pathal, at Elitist Jerks)
            http://elitistjerks.com/f78/t119013-subtlety_compendium
Rfeann
Sentinels
Rfeann
85 Night Elf Rogue
7470
Edited by Rfeann on 5/22/12 11:26 AM (PDT)
PvP Guides: Murdering, Frustrating and Otherwise Inconveniencing Your Player Opponents
==========================================================================

(Deepest thanks to Sheevah for co-authoring this section and ensuring it's up to date.)

Many of the guides below have not aged especially well as the Cataclysm era has gone on. Please consider all of these guides to be entry-level primers only; they're OK for getting a general gist for how to play competitive PvP at max level, but in terms of up-to-date nuts and bolts, most of these are a little lacking. (Some of them are even a lot lacking.)

The only PvP guide we know of that is up to date and being maintained is stickied in this forum:



In addition, the following threads don't provide complete PvP guides, but they do have (mostly) up-to-date information regarding various aspects of PvP:

          • Gear: "Shadow Panther's Rogue PvP Resources"
            Impressively detailed charts that break down the best gear and gear enhancements (from a damage-dealing standpoint) for PvPing rogues of all levels. (By Zodar, at ShadowPanther.net)
            http://www.shadowpanther.net/pvp.htm
          • Twinking: "Shadow Panther's Rogue Twink Resources"
            Also-Impressively detailed charts that break down the best gear and gear enhancements for rogue twinks in all level ranges. (By Zodar, at ShadowPanther.net)
            http://www.shadowpanther.net/twink.htm
          • Videos: "Rogue Class Guide"
            A collection of vids from some of the world's best, including Reckful and Neilyo. However, only some vids can be watched without having to pay. (At Skill Capped)
            http://www.skill-capped.com/classguides/rogue/
          • Being Evil: "Ganker's Kit of Ganking 2.0"
            An encyclopedia of in-game items that can help you befuddle, incapacitate and aggravate your enemies. (By Tantojutsu)
            http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1020802238


Lastly, here is a list of some of the older guides and threads that were more relevant earlier in Cataclysm. Just for reiteration, the following guides should NOT be used or followed for playing in the current game, though some may still contain helpful nuggets of information and advice.

          • The Basics: "A Starters Guide to Rogue PvP in Cataclysm"
            Exactly what it says it is. :) (By Truewann; last updated 12/7/2011)
            http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1869217043
          • Leveling Advice: "@Low-Level Rogues (Especially Sub)"
            A heads-up on making the slow, painful transition from PvPing as a low-level rogue to PvPing as a level-85 rogue. (By Laéf; last updated 1/24/2011)
            http://www.threadmeters.com/v-1GgG/Lowlevel_Rogues_especially_Sub/
          • Advice for Rogues Just Starting PvP at 85
            A cool collection of down-to-earth posts responding to a player frustrated by his/her repeated deaths. (Last relevant post was in July 2011)
            http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2140191184
          • Assassination and Subtlety: "The Art of Roguecraft"
            A thorough guide to PvP basics for level-85 Assassination and Subtlety rogues early in the Cataclysm era. (By Riodian, at Arena Junkies; last updated 1/21/2011)
            http://www.arenajunkies.com/topic/185898-guide-the-art-of-roguecraft/
          • Combat: "The Combat PvP Guide"
            A thorough runthrough of optimal approaches to this little-played spec. (By Celinne; last updated 12/19/2011)
            http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2548835327
          • Arena Strategy: "'Control' by Reckful"
            In which the fabled PvP rogue walks us through his strategy in three arena matches. (At Skill Capped; uploaded 7/13/11)
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nl8MixWnV6E
Rfeann
Sentinels
Rfeann
85 Night Elf Rogue
7470
Edited by Rfeann on 3/10/12 9:33 PM (PST)
Fun Stuff and Random Bits of Helpfulness/Thoughtfulness
===============================================

Helpful:



Thoughtful:



Fun:

Firstwind
Shandris
Firstwind
85 Night Elf Rogue
3565
I looked and thought: "Another rogue has my name?"

In other news, this is a really great and very useful thread, Rfeann. Thanks for starting and maintaining it.
Verelyse
Malygos
Verelyse
85 Night Elf Rogue
8185
Voted for sticky.
Verelyse describes state of rogue QQ:
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/1965837842#4
Lol. XD
Rfeann
Sentinels
Rfeann
85 Night Elf Rogue
7470
Tossed in a couple more links from my super-secret list and tweaked the formatting a bit. Please reply with any and all forum threads and outside resources you feel are worth letting other rogues know about; I hope this can ultimately grow into a useful reference tool for advice-seekers and advice-givers alike. (Or it can be met with utter disgust and fall completely flat. Whichever.)
Rfeann
Sentinels
Rfeann
85 Night Elf Rogue
7470
02/19/2011 2:46 PMPosted by Firstwind
Thanks for starting and maintaining it.


Oh. Crap. I'm supposed to maintain it? I'll need way more money, then.
Caera
Gorefiend
Caera
85 Blood Elf Rogue
Vex
8565
Edited by Caera on 2/19/11 10:07 PM (PST)
Thanks for starting and maintaining it.


Oh. Crap. I'm supposed to maintain it? I'll need way more money, then.


I have good news and bad news:

We're willing to increase your wages by 5% on top of your already 1G.

The bad news, we're going to have to increase your taxes by 4.78%.

But it comes with a free frogurt!
Rfeann
Sentinels
Rfeann
85 Night Elf Rogue
7470
That's good!
Rfeann
Sentinels
Rfeann
85 Night Elf Rogue
7470
Added a few outside links (Shadow Panther, Encrypted Text), as well as Aeriwen's leveling FAQ (so sorry, Aeriwen -- I forgot about your freaking *sticky*!) and Gerwulf's subtlety PvE videos. Also did another formatting pass to make the lists more readable.

Pretty light on Combat-related stuff at the moment, so if y'all have threads or outside resources to recommend... please do. :) I'm also considering adding a section that links to thoughtful, constructive threads or individual posts that discuss controversial/ongoing issues in rogueness, such as the value of expertise as Assassination or the places where Sap doesn't work quite right. If you remember any specific posts that explained or discussed these issues especially well, please pass 'em along!
Rfeann
Sentinels
Rfeann
85 Night Elf Rogue
7470
Added a link to WoWWiki's rogue macro page, which is one of the most complete lists I've been able to find. If anybody knows of better, though -- or wants to start a thread that's even betterer -- that would be swell.

Also, a repeat call for the stuff I mentioned just above: more Combat resources you know of, as well as threads/posts on these forums in which people talk to each other in a normal, human, productive, non-abusive manner about debate-worthy rogue issues or about bugs/difficulties affecting our class.
Sheevah
Kael'thas
Sheevah
85 Goblin Rogue
6485
Voted for sticky


Thanks Rfeann!
Rfeann
Sentinels
Rfeann
85 Night Elf Rogue
7470
Edited by Rfeann on 2/22/11 10:27 AM (PST)
Update time!

I've added another two links to the Sub PvE section (Pikawho's guide and Synek's overview in the EU forums), along with a note about why I've got so many links related to a spec that isn't even considered raid-viable. Any sub PvE rogues out there have feelings on which of the four guides I list is better or worse from a helpfulness/accuracy standpoint?

I've also added Ten Ton Hammer's broad overview of the entire rogue class. It's one of few umbrella-type looks at rogueness as a whole, and while it may be out of date in spots, it's still a great first step for anybody who's new to the class, considering rolling a rogue, or brushing off their rogues after a long hiatus.

Please reply with link recommendations or criticisms! This thread is still very light on Combat stuff.

p.s.: Truewann, quit changing the name of your PvP guide every other day. :P
Truèwan
Misha
Truèwan
85 Human Rogue
3995
Update time!

I've added another two links to the Sub PvE section (Pikawho's guide and Synek's overview in the EU forums), along with a note about why I've got so many links related to a spec that isn't even considered raid-viable. Any sub PvE rogues out there have feelings on which of the four guides I list is better or worse from a helpfulness/accuracy standpoint?

I've also added Ten Ton Hammer's broad overview of the entire rogue class. It's one of few umbrella-type looks at rogueness as a whole, and while it may be out of date in spots, it's still a great first step for anybody who's new to the class, considering rolling a rogue, or brushing off their rogues after a long hiatus.

Please reply with link recommendations or criticisms! This thread is still very light on Combat stuff.

p.s.: Truewann, quit changing the name of your PvP guide every other day. :P


Yeah I'll go back to starters guide rofl...
Truèwan
Misha
Truèwan
85 Human Rogue
3995
Edited by Truèwan on 2/22/11 11:04 AM (PST)
Voted for sticky, great job Rfeann, I can see how you really could be a reporter IRL.
Rfeann
Sentinels
Rfeann
85 Night Elf Rogue
7470
Edited by Rfeann on 2/22/11 12:35 PM (PST)
Ha! Thanks. Yeah, since I'm not cool enough to make the news (or start the great forum threads), I figure I might as well just report on it. :)

Hey Tru, I'm considering adding this still-new thread to the mix:

Combat?! PVP viable?
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2112233779

I figure that since Combat PvP tends to suffer from the same knowledge gap as Subtlety PvE, it helps to provide folks with a link to good discussions even if they're not comprehensive guides. But I also don't know Combat from a hole in the ground. In your opinion, is the info in that thread mostly helpful so far? (Celinne, if you're out there, I'd love your take as well.)
Truèwan
Misha
Truèwan
85 Human Rogue
3995
Edited by Truèwan on 2/22/11 1:00 PM (PST)
Ha! Thanks. Yeah, since I'm not cool enough to make the news (or start the great forum threads), I figure I might as well just report on it. :)

Hey Tru, I'm considering adding this still-new thread to the mix:

Combat?! PVP viable?
<a href="http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2112233779">http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2112233779</a>

I figure that since Combat PvP tends to suffer from the same knowledge gap as Subtlety PvE, it helps to provide folks with a link to good discussions even if they're not comprehensive guides. But I also don't know Combat from a hole in the ground. In your opinion, is the info in that thread mostly helpful so far? (Celinne, if you're out there, I'd love your take as well.)


Well my thoughts are somewhat long on combat pvp.

To start, consider, 99% of people that play WoW, PvE. Of this... .009% of people play subtlety rogue PvE. (which is 1 out of 11,111 people. If you went to the superbowl stadium, 6 people there would play subtlety PvE in seriously raiding guilds). People play subtlety PvE because it is fun to play or just like the idea of it.

The same applies to combat, in a certain sense. It is the underdog spec, I find that this is what attracts people to it. Such as myself, fiveshot and even Nitrion to those who remember him. While I think it would be a good idea to link the discussion about combat PvP, your thread's intent was to link "guides", so on this point I disagree.

But also, Like subtlety PvE threads on elitist jerks. Those that posted in that combat PvP thread mainly consisted of people that PvP as subtlety or mutilate PvP. The idea of talking about combat PvP is interesting to some, but it does not give actual feedback.

People will always say combat PvP is "bad", but there are those who would like to highlight its "good". TL:DR Just give an honorable mention that combat PvP does not have guides, but it does not need them either.

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