Welcome to Tol Barad!

90 Tauren Druid
0
Tol Barad Report
Icecrown
13DEC-0900st to 20DEC-0859st

67 battles

74.63% Horde controlled
25.37% Alliance controlled

30.00% Alliance wins Attack
11.76% Alliance wins Defense

88.24% Horde wins Attack
70.00% Horde wins Defense


Wishing everyone a very Merry Christmas...
Edited by Bitbyte on 12/27/2011 6:31 PM PST
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90 Tauren Druid
0
Tol Barad Report
Icecrown
20DEC-0900st to 27DEC-0859st

67 battles

71.64% Horde controlled
28.36% Alliance controlled

28.57% Alliance wins Attack
27.78% Alliance wins Defense

72.22% Horde wins Attack
71.43% Horde wins Defense


... and a Happy New Year!
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90 Tauren Druid
0
Tol Barad Report
Icecrown
27DEC-0900st to 03JAN-0859st

67 battles

77.61% Horde controlled
22.39% Alliance controlled

23.08% Alliance wins Attack
20.00% Alliance wins Defense

80.00% Horde wins Attack
76.92% Horde wins Defense


Did you know... "each time a member of your faction is killed in the immediate vicinity of a keep, [the] slider bar will move slightly in favor of the opposing faction."
source: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/blog/1159457
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90 Tauren Druid
0
Tol Barad Report
Icecrown
03JAN-0900st to 10JAN-0859st

68 battles

83.82% Horde controlled
16.18% Alliance controlled

15.52% Alliance wins Attack
20.00% Alliance wins Defense

80.00% Horde wins Attack
84.48% Horde wins Defense


Did you know... "Attacking forces will receive a 200% capture speed bonus when they control 2 keeps."
source: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/game/patch-notes/4-0-6
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So is the problem on the alliance side just that nobody's interested in TB anymore?

I want to know how come horde always has 2x to 3x the number of people in TB, not that it matters because alliance is just running around aimlessly most of the time. I thought it was supposed to be even numbers but someone said horde queues then leaves raid to get more people. If that's true is it an exploit that should be reported to blizz? Has it been?
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90 Human Death Knight
16240
u srsly gonna be a tb tryhard?
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Another question: How can horde take any pleasure or pride in their TB pwnage when alliance isn't even putting up a fight? Why not try to help get an alliance group together that's decent? You yourself said in your original post it's more fun when there's a challenging opponent...
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Bond: I am a TB tryhard, just on another toon.
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90 Tauren Druid
0
I want to know how come horde always has 2x to 3x the number of people in TB, not that it matters because alliance is just running around aimlessly most of the time. I thought it was supposed to be even numbers but someone said horde queues then leaves raid to get more people.

We do not leave raid, that "exploit" does not work. Dropping raid simply fractures communications, command and control.

However, there is a minimum of 5 players each side, thereafter it's balanced 1-to-1, for both Tol Barad and Wintergrasp. If your faction has less than 5 players in the battle, I recommend that you rally more people to join.

How can horde take any pleasure or pride in their TB pwnage when alliance isn't even putting up a fight? Why not try to help get an alliance group together that's decent?

Are you suggesting that if the Alliance chooses not to put up a fight, we should hunt them down instead?

I've mentored potential Alliance players who have approached me personally with visions of leading the Alliance side to victory with limited success. Time and time again, it has been most unfortunate that have been members in your community that have consistently chosen to disrespect their efforts, rip them apart and simply destroyed their spirit in them during battles, on trade chat and even on the forums.
For example: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3430807405
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>> Are you suggesting that if the Alliance chooses not to put up a fight,
>> we should hunt them down instead?

Beating up on the weak in real life proves someone's a bully -- not that they're better/stronger/whatever. I'm suggesting that such behavior translates to in-game and the only way to have a REAL sense of pride is defeating an actual peer.

I'm also recommending you avoid adding insult to injury and making yourselves look much worse by NOT camping the GY afterwards. Have some class and leave the TB fight at the bridge. There are poor winners just as there are poor losers.

By camping the GY you make it easy to infer that you also enjoy "pwning" against groups of uncoordinated rabble who can't even put up a fight. There's a term for people like that, and it's not "winner".

They're called HONORABLE kills for a reason. Any other kind of kill, quite frankly, detracts from that. Just like real life -- if true battlefield honor matters to you then don't piss on graves of the defeated.
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01/17/2012 09:45 PMPosted by Bitbyte
I've mentored potential Alliance players who have approached me personally with visions of leading the Alliance side to victory with limited success.


That's been my experience as well. The only possible conclusion is that Alliance on this server simply don't (in the majority) care about TB anymore. There are a few people who show up consistently, but always a majority of random rabble who won't listen, etc.

More importantly, the "Kill All Healers" add-on has resulted in NO HEALERS for Alliance BG's -- especially TB since it's server-local. People don't consider it fun to have EVERY opposing player focused solely on them like a laser, with no defense from DPS on their own side. I'm not sure if the "not fun" factor can be overcome.

Regardless, I've been in TB enough to know a good half-dozen people who consistently show up and consistently do better -- even against ridiculously lopsided odds. If we could get half a dozen more and queue as a raid team, we could give you guys some good, real competition.

Unfortunately I don't know how to organize people for that. I have a job, family, obligations. I can help in-game and call out strategy, etc. but lack the ability to recruit because it takes so much time & effort.

And no I can't ask anyone from guild -- they all left months ago. Star Wars & Skyrim & COD I suppose. Note: not guild for Piaget but guild for my PvPer.
Edited by Piaget on 1/18/2012 7:37 AM PST
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90 Tauren Druid
0
I'm also recommending you avoid adding insult to injury and making yourselves look much worse by NOT camping the GY afterwards. Have some class and leave the TB fight at the bridge. There are poor winners just as there are poor losers.

Hard to imagine but that's what the Alliance put us through the whole of BC and WotLK, in Halaa and in Wintergrasp; we are simply returning the favor. But fear not, Blizzard said MoP focus would be on wPvP -- essentially returning to an open environment where numbers are not evenly matched; and you'll be back to your old ways of camping us at our GYs, claiming that it's tit-for-tat for Tol Barad. Mark my words.


Always remember, never forget...
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2112513383?page=5#96
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>> Hard to imagine but that's what the Alliance put us through the whole of BC and WotLK
No Alliance I know ever did that because it's dishonorable, but I've seen it done frequently by Horde regardless of which faction I was playing. So I'm familiar with the /bg gloating and hubris which accompanies their behavior. It's precisely the thing Horde is so fond of calling Alliance -- juvenile -- and it reflects poorly on them.

>> in Halaa and in Wintergrasp
I don't understand why people say TB is biased towards Horde -- it's biased towards the defender. Similarly, the previous ones weren't biased towards one faction or the other either, as they're scenario-based.

>> Blizzard said MoP focus would be on wPvP
Irrelevant when the topic is TB on Icecrown, where the problem is simply mismatched combatants. If anyone wants to change that, you know where to reach me...
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90 Human Death Knight
16240
clueless
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90 Tauren Druid
0
>> Hard to imagine but that's what the Alliance put us through the whole of BC and WotLK
No Alliance I know ever did that because it's dishonorable, but I've seen it done frequently by Horde regardless of which faction I was playing.

Did you participate in WG during WotLK, where raids were manually formed up in Dalaran as we waited for the portals to become active? Subsequently, when Tenacity was introduced and Horde side was able to easily get 20 stacks daily?

Those were probably the darkest times where the Alliance would swarm to our zone in point to camp our GY; bringing Catapults, Demolishers and Siege Engines right up to it to lay siege "adding insult to injury"!


>> in Halaa and in Wintergrasp
I don't understand why people say TB is biased towards Horde -- it's biased towards the defender. Similarly, the previous ones weren't biased towards one faction or the other either, as they're scenario-based.

The current Tol Barad is biased towards the attackers, otherwise it would almost never change hands. This can be observed from the weekly stats, where week after week, for both Alliance and Horde, there has consistently been a higher win percentage for attacking as opposed to defending.

The original Tol Barad 1.0 was biased towards the defenders, and during that time it was possible (and the Horde did successfully pull it off) to hold Tol Barad for a complete raid reset cycle; denying the attackers from BH for an entire week or more.

Halaa and Wintergrasp were essentially open environments with no upper limit (till much later during WotLK for WG) and were simply dominated by the Alliance through sheer numbers; outnumbering us by a large margin thus pushing us back and camping us at our GYs.
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90 Tauren Druid
0
Additional reading:
http://us.battle.net/wow/en-us/forum/topic/3881724802?page=2#29

The main problem with Tol Barad is that majority of the players do not understand the finer mechanics of the battle, hence the strategies of winning it. However, like random BGs, a good or poor mix of healers and DPS can still be a deciding factor.

One of the best things that Tarren Mill/Crossroads, Halaa, Sprit Towers, Wintergrasp, Tol Barad, BGs before cross realm BGs, killing faction leaders achievements before the insane Cata guard buffs, and even the new DMF Deathmatch, did was to promote faction unity. Fighting side-by-side with players from your realm on a daily basis (or simply regularly), banding together to kill notable players from the opposing faction of your realm, rallying players to band together, all helped to promote faction unity, binding the community at the PvP level.


There are a few reasons why the general community seems to prefer Wintergrasp over Tol Barad.

For most of WotLK, WG as not balanced with a 1-to-1 queuing system until the end of the expansion, as such the dominant faction that kept winning across every realm was simply the faction with the higher player population; this is actually a fairly big problem Blizzards needs to figure out especially with MoP, else like in WotLK, it will fuel faction transfers from the smaller player population to the larger player population, exacerbating the problem. Since the higher player population faction of every realm wins almost all of the time as they were able to dominate WG by sheer numbers, the majority of the player community loved WG as they were simply the larger number. The side effects were: the underdog faction queued less thereby enabling the dominant faction to be larger and win more often; players faction transferred to the dominant faction of the same realm or other realms exacerbating the problem of unbalanced realms.

Blizzard tried to roll out some fixes, however anything that hurt the dominant faction hurt the larger player community and their outcries were very very loud as they were the majority. The underdogs did complain, but in comparison their voices were literially drowned out by the majority. At the end, Blizzard introduced systems in which WG would flip back and forth regularly appeasing both factions, but it also introduced complacency, however it didn't matter because it was the end of the expansion cycle.

The objective of WG is singular with a straightforward path to achieve it, while the objective of TB is three-pronged and requires coordination. Because of the singular objective, many were able lead WG at the same time since their commands were in general all leading to the same objective. While in TB, because majority of the players do not understand the finer mechanics of the battle, everyone has a different idea of what needs to be done and where people need to be, as there are three objectives geographically distant from each other. Conflicting directions leading to confusion, disorganization, and losing is rather common in TB which has led to general unhappiness over their TB experience.

The 1-to-1 queuing system was a major step in balancing PvP in these battles, especially for unbalanced realms. It literally gave the underdogs of these realms a fighting chance, however it introduced a few problems for the faction majority... the inability to join due to the severe unbalance between the both factions; and the minority faction had a significant advantage as all their top PvP veterans could litterally be in every battle because their faction had fewer players in the queue compared to the much larger faction. For most realms, the tides started to turn in favour of the minority faction, the effect was the majority of the player community started to lose far more TB as compared to their WG days and their outcry that "TB is bad" and "WG is better" can still be heard today.

From my point of view, Tol Barad has a balanced map (since both faction starts at the same points and the same conditions in either role), the 1-to-1 queuing system is necessary (do you think it's fair if you played any BG today where the opposing faction outnumbered you? eg a 10 vs 15 WSG, 15 vs 20 AB, etc). Deciding factors are; faction unity and coordination; player composition, PvP experience and gear; leadership with a good understanding of both attacking and defending TB.
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90 Orc Shaman
13835
Ahhh I sorta do miss rolling into WG with 20 stacks of tenacity as ele. Just hide off tot he side and nuke a few people down....before they figured me out and stun locked me 10v1.

Anyways about TB. I think the major reason we win is because all of Horde knows Bitbyte now. We all listen to him and follows his directions to the letter. When he's not around, no one knows what to do and we have a much higher chance of losing.

Another factor is we have a number of really good healers who show up regularly to TB, and are always defending key points in big battles. Us healers like myself know that you alliance with target Bitbyte so we keep a good eye on him and our other fellow healers. We know healers are more important than the DPS.

Long live Bitbyte, Hero of the Horde!
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Great link Bit, thanks. Alliance definitely lacks any cohesion in this form, but it's pretty decent in raids. Still plenty of pointless bickering there too though.

TB has three nodes and defender only needs to hold one of them vs. three of them if you're attacker. That is by definition biased towards defender.
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85 Blood Elf Death Knight
4035
Haha 1st Night here!! And ally was just annihilated... Respec BitfknByte =)
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