What are the caps for a protection Paladin

88 Blood Elf Paladin
7920
I have looked all over the net, as well as this forum.. and I can't seem to find out what are the caps for a protection paladin.

I know that most of them are soft caps but I would still like to know what I can take away or add more of ect.. more so when it comes to reforging so if someone could either A. Provide this information.. Or B. Post a link that provides this information I would be extremely grateful

:D
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
11100
Caps for what? There really arent any caps that you need to worry about right now. Just reforge as much as you can into mastery and try to keep you dodge/parry about even with each other. You arent likely to hit the 102.4 cap anyway. Dont bother with hit/expertise so you dont need to worry about those caps.
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
6055
avoidance : 102.4% combined avoidance (5% miss chance + block + parry + dodge) verus a boss level mob (88) 101.6% against a heroric boss mob (87)

hit: 8% for both melee and spell hit due to the free 9% spell hit you get from picking prot or ret

expertise: dodge cap (considered soft cap) 26, parry cap (considered hard cap) 58

Right now just focus on avoidance unless your running with dps who outgear you by a ton all the time(ie your in full 333 and they are in mostly 359), then you can consider getting expertise to soft cap, after that its not really worth it at the loss of avoidance.
Edited by Madel on 3/8/2011 12:55 PM PST
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Madel posted just about everything you need to know.
Also of note:

Dodge/Parry have diminishing returns.
There is a point where diminishing returns makes a point of mastery superior in every way to a point in dodge/parry.
That point is ~10%.
But that doesn't count base parry/dodge which don't suffer from diminishing returns.
So add that 10% to the base and you get:
15% parry
13.98% dodge (this will actually differ slightly based on your race. 13.98% is for Blood Elf)

Once you hit those values, mastery is STRICTLY better both in terms of covering the hit table AND in terms of overall mitigation/avoidance until you hit the avoidance cap.

Prior to those values, it's debatable which is better.
On one hand, parry/dodge provide more overall mitigation.
On the other hand; however, mastery covers more of the hit table to smooth damage. That has a positive effect ingame that's tough to quantify mathematically in a direct comparison vs avoidance.
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85 Human Paladin
5325
03/08/2011 11:50 AMPosted by Duckofdeath
Caps for what? There really arent any caps that you need to worry about right now. Just reforge as much as you can into mastery and try to keep you dodge/parry about even with each other. You arent likely to hit the 102.4 cap anyway. Dont bother with hit/expertise so you dont need to worry about those caps.



You need a at least a small amount of hit so that you can land a rebuke. Don't try to get hit capped, don't even worry if you're at or over 4%, but you at least need some.
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85 Human Paladin
3475
ooo thank you so much for the info.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
11100
03/08/2011 12:58 PMPosted by Rethelici
Caps for what? There really arent any caps that you need to worry about right now. Just reforge as much as you can into mastery and try to keep you dodge/parry about even with each other. You arent likely to hit the 102.4 cap anyway. Dont bother with hit/expertise so you dont need to worry about those caps.


You need a at least a small amount of hit so that you can land a rebuke. Don't try to get hit capped, don't even worry if you're at or over 4%, but you at least need some.


Rebuke will no longer miss in the upcoming patch. Taunts already dont miss. Really no reason to bother with hit.
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
2305
Yeah, not to derail, but why do we want dodge/parry at the same level? That doesn't make sense to me -- mitigation is mitigation, no? If anything, since parry resets swing timer (it still does that, right?) then wouldn't we want more dodge than parry? What am I missing?
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
11100
03/08/2011 3:29 PMPosted by Thracymachus
Yeah, not to derail, but why do we want dodge/parry at the same level? That doesn't make sense to me -- mitigation is mitigation, no? If anything, since parry resets swing timer (it still does that, right?) then wouldn't we want more dodge than parry? What am I missing?


They suffer from diminishing returns. So lets say you have 20% dodge and only 10% parry. Your itemzation points on the dodge are being taxed by diminishing returns at a higher rate. So instead of getting more dodge it is better to get more parry until the gap between them is closer.
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
2305
Hey thanks :)
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85 Blood Elf Paladin
0
Everything duck said but just for info sake

Hit: 8%
Soft Expertise: 26
Hard expertise: 55

Block: 102.4% combined dodge/parry/miss/block
Dodge: 65.631440% Asymptotic requires infinity rating to reach
Parry: 65.631440% Asymptotic requires infinity rating to reach
Armor: 75% damage reduction or 97717.5 armor
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I can not remember where I got this from, but the numbers do hold up.

Just going to explain and prove that dodge/parry soft caps exist.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Part 1: Explanation

1% of Dodge/Parry grants 1% average mitigation as of 100% hits, theoretically you should receive only 99% of the total damage.
1% Block grants 0.3% AM or 0.4% if you keep holy shield active at all times.

Because of diminishing returns dodge and parry will become increasingly less effective.
At 10% Dodge/Parry you actually receive ~ 9.02%
At 102.4% Dodge/Parry (Impossible to actually reach) you receive ~ 40%

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Part 2: Diminishing Returns

The diminishing returns formula is as follows:
1/x = 1/c + k/y
x = Actual Dodge/Parry
c = Class dependent cap
k = Constant (0.956)
y = Displayed Dodge/Parry
1/c = 0.0152366

To calculate 10% Dodge you would have this:
1/x = 0.0152366 + (0.956/10)
1/x = 0.1108366
x = 1/0.1108366
x = 9.02229047%

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Part 3: Dodge/Parry Cap

1 Point of Mastery Requires: 179.28 Rating
1% of Dodge/Parry: 176.71899 Rating

100 Mastery Rating Gives: 0.5577867 Mastery Points
100 Dodge/Parry Rating Gives: 0.56587014% Dodge/Parry (Undiminished)

100 Mastery Rating: 0.50200803% Average Mitigation (0.5577867 x 2.25 (Block Chance per PT of Mastery) x 0.4 (Value of Block vs Dodge/Parry)
100 Dodge/Parry Rating: 0.56587014% Average Mitigation

1000 Mastery Rating: 5.0200803% AM
1000 Dodge/Parry Rating: 5.6587014% AM (Undiminished)
1000 Dodge/Parry Rating: 5.42947235% AM (Diminished)

2000 Mastery: 10.0401606% AM
2000 Dodge/Parry: 11.3174028% AM (Undiminished)
2000 Dodge/Parry: 10.0292573 AM (Diminished)

1990 MR: 9.9899598% AM
1990 D/P: 11.2608158% AM(uD)
1990 D/P: 9.9867416% AM (D)

1988 MR: 9.97991964% AM
1988 D/P: 11.2494984% AM (uD)
1988 D/P: 9.97823049% AM (D)

1986 MR: 9.96987948% AM
1986 D/P: 11.238181% AM (uD)
1986 D/P: 9.96971698 AM (D)

1985 MR: 9.9648594% AM
1985 D/P: 11.2325223% AM (uD)
1985 D/P: 9.96545972% AM (D)

Therefore the soft caps for Parry and Dodge are 1985 Rating each or 11.2325223% (11.23%)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Part 4: The Avoidance Cap
So with the avoidance cap at 102.4% displayed avoidance. The highest possible average amount of mitigation can be calculated.
5% Miss = 5% AM
11.23% Dodge = 9.96545972% AM
11.23% Parry = 9.96545972% AM
74.94% Block = 29.976% AM (5972 Mastery Rating)
Maximum Amount of Avoidance a Paladin can have is 54.9069194% (59.91%)

*It should be noted that both agility and strength contribute to dodge and parry respectively. Whilst you shall only gain agility with raid buffs and any +ALL STAT gems/enchants, strength will be on all your gear therefore you should have a higher amount of parry than dodge. Therefore you should be gemming more dodge than parry but still keep both as close to each other as possible without exceeding the respective soft caps. The soft caps will in no case be reached with that exact value of rating as Dodge gets approx 3.98% passive from base agility, and both parry and block get a base value of 5%. These increase with buffs, gear, gems, etc. To reach the soft caps you need to reach 11.23% not 1985 Rating.
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