Healers Have To Die

85 Blood Elf Priest
2260
Is that what people want? Fewer healers around?
I believe that's the case, yes.
100 Tauren Druid
21295
If I see a healer in a BG and call it out in /bg chat, that will mean everyone with a brain will target you. You can't tell whether or not that an addon allowed it, or just random player calling out healers.

I do this all the time. I see a healer, I call out which people in a BG to kill first esp in games like twin peaks / wsg.

Addon or not, people have been targeting and zerging healers for years. I know, I did a bit of resto pvp in wrath and you got insta targetted regardless of whichever form you were in. People hate healers in pvp.. so they will kill you.

No I don't use the addon, have no need to. I don't want to see other nameplate addons get broken though because of this one. I <3 my tidyplates.
88 Blood Elf Paladin
11335


A lie is a deliberate statement of something known to be false.

He may not be lying, but that doesn't mean what he is saying is true, or accurate. Rationalization will make people believe anything. For example, look at the poor people who insist on tax cuts for billionaires. Who is paying for the tax cut? Poor people. And they actually believe that it will make their lives better. LOL.


And what exactly am I saying that isn't true or accurate? This is something I would respect.


Well for one: your repeated claim that this is not a raid marker. Technically this is true since it is not one of the designated in-game raid markers provided by the default Blizzard interface. But functionally this is not accurate. Calling it not a raid marker even though it was designed to be used the same way and IS being used the same way is completely disingenuous.
100 Pandaren Priest
18070
So, who cares if it IS causing you to be targeted more?

What are you going to do? Whine about it obstinately instead of learning how to deal with it? Running to the devs to fix a problem that is inherently social (PVPers *finally* learning to target healers) is not a good solution.

If it was simple intelligence causing you to be targeted, then what? Beg for that to be disabled too?


Healers will simply stop PvPing. It's a big part of the game, and without it they may grow bored and simply stop playing WoW altogether. Is that what people want? Fewer healers around?

It's bad enough that healers were nerfed to the point where they can't really function solo day-to-day without shifting to a dps spec. Pretty soon the only place left for healers will be in 5-mans and raids. And the healers left will be worse too. PvP healing is a fantastic place for healers to become more skilled at their role. They learn to heal on the move, how to stay alive when under attack, the importance of terrain, triage (REAL triage) and improved spatial awareness. If a healer asks me how to get better, one of the main things I tell them is to heal in PvP.
No! That's not what I want. I want them to man up and find a solution of their own. Fight fire with fire, not tears.

If healers can't get their own team to defend them, then go dps instead and let your side lose due to lack of healers. It's what they deserve. If there's a train of dps blindly chasing down healers then that's a large number of enemies effectively taken out of the fight if they can't reach their target.

The only realistic technical fix I can think of is returning raidmarks, but allowing them only on friendly targets.
85 Blood Elf Priest
2260
03/10/2011 10:37 AMPosted by Reefermadnez
And @Sync, I'm still waiting to hear
I think you're a very silly person who is doing his very best to ignore a lot of what's been said, and since he doesn't want to address it, is instead latching on to this. :)

If you want answers, read back over this topic and stop pretending that multiple people haven't rebutted you and talked about the things you're still saying you're waiting on.
85 Blood Elf Priest
2260
03/10/2011 10:39 AMPosted by Orvain
No! That's not what I want. I want them to man up and find a solution of their own.
Just like the baddies who couldn't man up and find the solution on their own, they had to use an addon to effectively raid mark healers for them, right? Why is the burden on the healers? Place it where it belongs: on the terribads who are abusing this addon.

85 Tauren Paladin
2335
Let's look at this for a minute or two, shall we...

Druids:

A big John Travolta Saturday Night Live struttin' afro tree (or rotten broccolli) that's bigger than anyone around them -or-

A caster running around casting green heal spells and NOT in a boomkin or feral form....

Priests:

Any one of them NOT in a shadow form

Pallys:

A shield and a one handed weapon, but is standing off to the side NOT doing melee and casting spells

Shaman:

A bit trickier, but I think the floating rock around their bodies is MAYBE a clue...

You need an add-on to target these people?

The add-on in question, I agree, isn't anything game breaking, but to me, is the sign of a player who doesn't want to hone his/her skills in situational awareness. Going for a target because some add-on says you should is really lazy, if anything. Lazy does not a good player make and all the more reason why the REAL champions are the ones who make it to arena finals because the only ones you can use there are macros as add-ons are foreboden, even healing ones.


This. Especially that last part about the real pvp champions.
Edited by Layonhorns on 3/10/2011 10:49 AM PST
85 Blood Elf Priest
2260
The many folks saying that this addon improves their kill count of healers are also speculating, correct? Oh, wait. They're talking about using this addon to do exactly this.
03/10/2011 10:44 AMPosted by Reefermadnez
So you call me a liar with no examples of lies.
You have conveniently ignored the last many pages. You are STILL doing it.

Not only are you a liar, you're just nasty.
Edited by Syncline on 3/10/2011 10:46 AM PST
86 Night Elf Druid
6210
does it point out a healer befor a player themselves has seen them healing? if it does have a threshold (baring in mind that it has been said to work on combat logs, which i as i know you only get why your opnent is close) it would be fairly easy to tell the difference between a feral and a resto.
i cant use cat from to trick an opponent in battle being that combat can be a bit crazy. so i think it would be easy to prove that the add-on does give an advantage. unless every player watches there logs, considering in even 5 on 5 an awful lot can be happening.


No, it does not mark a player before your personal combat log detect them healing. The addon is very easily tricked into marking players as healers.

And @Sync, I'm still waiting to hear about where I lied? Or barring that even a response to the fact that you are merely speculating that your deaths now can be attributed to this addon as opposed to the same old focus the healer strategy that had been around since forever. But I'm guessing since you were losing that argument you just decided to ignore me, right?


i said they themselves seen me, there log can in fact see me, but the players that can take advantage of that would be few and far between. if im on the other side of a rock, that player can only make assumptions on my healing ability. when i come into there veaw. if i was to stop and change into cat. i would still be marked out. its not players making that designation but an add-on.

and thats why i ask, how do you trick the addon? if my feral friend are healing just to stop me being picked out easly. then the add-on has changed how the game has to be played.
65 Orc Rogue
1150
03/09/2011 2:47 PMPosted by Rhiza
That's funny. I thought the game UI prohibited raidmarking opposing force players.

QFT
If you can't spot the guy casting the green/sparkly spells, you're bad. End of discussion.
88 Blood Elf Paladin
11335


Healers will simply stop PvPing. It's a big part of the game, and without it they may grow bored and simply stop playing WoW altogether. Is that what people want? Fewer healers around?

It's bad enough that healers were nerfed to the point where they can't really function solo day-to-day without shifting to a dps spec. Pretty soon the only place left for healers will be in 5-mans and raids. And the healers left will be worse too. PvP healing is a fantastic place for healers to become more skilled at their role. They learn to heal on the move, how to stay alive when under attack, the importance of terrain, triage (REAL triage) and improved spatial awareness. If a healer asks me how to get better, one of the main things I tell them is to heal in PvP.
No! That's not what I want. I want them to man up and find a solution of their own. Fight fire with fire, not tears.

If healers can't get their own team to defend them, then go dps instead and let your side lose due to lack of healers. It's what they deserve. If there's a train of dps blindly chasing down healers then that's a large number of enemies effectively taken out of the fight if they can't reach their target.

The only realistic technical fix I can think of is returning raidmarks, but allowing them only on friendly targets.


Basically, you're asking healers to go into a lose-lose scenario. It's actually double-loss for healers: not only do they have to play in their non-preferred role, they have to lose as well to try to make a point to a bunch of strangers? How many times will this "point" have to be made? The correct answer is infinite. DPSers won't step up to save healers. They'll just complain that no one heals them in a BG and tell healers things like "man up".

Blizzard can neutralize individual addons without breaking the rest. They did it to Gearscore without having to break the ability of mods to transfer data to the client. Worst case they can break nameplates in BGs only.
85 Worgen Druid
4965
03/10/2011 10:45 AMPosted by Ugarok
That's funny. I thought the game UI prohibited raidmarking opposing force players.

QFT
If you can't spot the guy casting the green/sparkly spells, you're bad. End of discussion.
85 Blood Elf Priest
2260
03/10/2011 10:44 AMPosted by Amanone
and thats why i ask, how do you trick the addon? if my feral friend are healing just to stop me being picked out easly. then the add-on has changed how the game has to be played.
Changing how the game has to be played is the point of this addon, yep.
88 Blood Elf Paladin
11335
03/10/2011 10:44 AMPosted by Reefermadnez
I think you're a very silly person who is doing his very best to ignore a lot of what's been said, and since he doesn't want to address it, is instead latching on to this. :)

If you want answers, read back over this topic and stop pretending that multiple people haven't rebutted you and talked about the things you're still saying you're waiting on.



So you call me a liar with no examples of lies. I've been trolled? Wating on an example of one of my lies still. Already read the whole thread. No one has shown me to be a liar anywhere.


I won't call you a liar because I am not psychic: i can't tell what you actually believe or not.

I can, however, tell you that you are wrong.
85 Blood Elf Hunter
4765
I don't see much of a point in the addon unless it's a large 40 vs 40 BG and everyone is close together, even then it wouldn't help much. You either know what the healers casts look like or not, they're pretty easy to spot.

I'm a healer most of the time in BGs and I don't see it making that big of a difference.

Unless it turns you into a Tauren, PvPers who aren't smart enough to kill the healer first still won't. Everyone knows Alliance targets the cows first.
85 Blood Elf Priest
2260
Odds are a healing priest in an unrated BG IS Shadow. I almost never see holy priests in them, in part because the lack of resilience as one is gearing up means that forgoing shadow's extra CCs is fairly suicidal.
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