Is Old Content going to be Redone every patch

90 Blood Elf Rogue
6055
I'd like to elaborate upon my previous post. I suspect this uncovers a wider issue that shows a change in thought at Blizzard. Perhaps focus is now mostly upon the new development rumoured to be called Titan.

We have seen that Firelands isnt going to appear in patch 4.1 and I think that the misuse of heroic modes to extend content lifetime is responsible for this. My guild has completed all but one of the current raid encounters and so heroic modes are all that is left now. While they are challenging I remember when heroic modes weren't in the game and I think the reliance upon them is questionable. The present tier of content is arguable challenging enough with out heroic modes given how many people have yet to complete it all.

It was a wise move to update Azeroth because the older content was looking and feeling very tired. However, given I have gone through the leveling experience several times I am not interested re-rolling a new toon.. leveling is leveling and I and most people are interested in the end game. However, it is certainly positive for new players to the game. All of the resources and time spent updating Azeroth sadly lead to the end-game which is lacking in new innovation.

H SFK, Deadmines, ZA/ZG, etc.. are rehashed content. I havent had a poor experience in the former two but I have been there many times before. No doubt ZA and ZG will have some enjoyable and interesting encounters but the place isnt new and I cant get excited about it. I was excited about the ICC dungeons that appeared towards the end of the LK expansion. They were places I hadnt been to before and were epic no question.

I can sort of forgive redoing Ony for wows 4th anniversary as a fun extra but surely the poor old girl deserves to RIP.. Im looking forward to meeting new arch lore charcters that instill the same epic feeling as she once did.

I hope we are going to see something truly orignal and epic in the future because on present trends I cant help but think that Blizzard is letting itself down.. They have set such a high standard for themselves over the years and maybe its not always possible to do better.

Reply Quote
85 Draenei Warrior
11045
karazhan plz
Reply Quote
100 Gnome Mage
17310
You should only re-release instances which were hardly ever played. Naxx, deadmines, and shadowfang were good candidates. Onyxia was not.

ZA and ZG have been played to death.


Deadmines was hardly ever played? Umm what?????? lol
Reply Quote
6 Blood Elf Paladin
0
03/10/2011 3:50 PMPosted by Zarhym
BWL is arguably redone in BWD and molten core is about to be redone with firelands

Is your definition of rehashed content deduced to the names of bosses being the same? There will always be recurring characters in World of Warcraft, as there is in any fantasy story telling. :)


Sorry, I think many of us thought that the writers of the most successful mmo of all time had better story writers than the writer of snow white and the seven dwarves.
Reply Quote
85 Troll Shaman
5915
I wanted another shot at ZG and ZA since I never experienced them fully when they were initially released, and they aren't the same bosses, so really, your point is that they're using hte same area again. If Blizzard redid STV and put a murloc instance in the same spot that ZG was, would it be any different than having teh same instance with different encounters, which then makes it a different instance?
Reply Quote
85 Goblin Mage
3685
What they should do, is make ZA a BE trailer park, with 2 trolls running the trailer park, one can be called Mr. Lahey, and the other can be Randy, the trailer park assistant.

Then we can have 3 NPC's running around, an orc DK that walks around the park with a cup of rum n coke. A chunky goblin named Ricky, who loves to toke hash, chain smokes cigarettes and is in love with a goblin named Lucy. They can also have a good friend that backs them up in most heinous crimes they commit in and out of the trailer park, his name can be Bubbles, not sure which race to make him though. He has to be an engineer and always always wear goggles.

Make 2 undead dudes, one named Trever, the other name Cory. Then a Blood elf named Jamie, who goes by the name of J-Roc, and his best friend T (Tyrone).
Reply Quote
Community Manager
03/10/2011 4:47 PMPosted by Psî

We don't just pull resources from one project to give more attention to another in the sense you're suggesting.
Except that's exactly what you(Blizzard) have told us recently.
That you took a number of people that worked on WoW and have moved them on to Titan.
So really, yes, that does happen.


That wasn't at all the context of the post to which I was responded. That player was suggesting that a singular art team directs their attention away from WoW to work on art for our other games. That's not true.

Now, if an individual person does move onto a new project, their position is filled. Therefore, the resources are still there (which is why I said "in the sense you're suggesting"). This is how career advancement works at any company. How else do you account for a company's growth? You bring in new talent (or move them up from within the company) and train them under the current folks so they can eventually fill the vacancy.

This talk about losing WoW developers, or that WoW is left to a "B team" is getting tiresome. There is no finite pool of talent and we have every intention of making sure WoW development remains very strong.

All of this is practically besides the point anyway. All you've been told is some talented people who helped build WoW into what it is today have moved over to another project to help bring it to fruition. You don't know who those people are, what positions they held on the WoW team, or how many of them have moved onto other projects. Most of them, in fact, are programmers working to develop the systems and tech for a new project. And the programmers WoW has now are amazing. They've taken the original systems and improved upon them many times over.

Just as an example, think back to how slowly UI improvements would be implemented in vanilla and TBC. Now there are scores of great UI improvements nearly every patch. That team is incredible and very experienced. Just the same, the class design team has hardly changed in years, save for a couple of additions (read: not subtractions).

Every department at Blizzard has expanded immensely over the years to accommodate the growing playerbase, as well as our ambitions for the future of the company. You can look at our job opportunities page just to get an example for the talent search we have constantly going on.

Bringing in new talent and growing the company from within is far from a bad thing. It's a great thing and has allowed us to develop several projects simultaneously without short-changing any of them. Anyone who says otherwise is working on an incredible amount of speculation and assumptions.

And even still, the WoW development leadership remains largely unchanged. Every time I stop by to chat with these people -- the same people I've been interacting with for years now -- I'm inspired by their creativity, their talent, and their dedication to making this game mega-awesomesauce. ;)
Reply Quote
85 Troll Druid
2670
I don't like when they remove the old content entirely. Big mistake.


This, to me, is the big thing. There is no reason to rip old content out by the roots in a fantasy RPG. Removed dungeons and deleted quest lines like Battle for Undercity can easily be left in with a hand waved, "A wizard did it" level explanation. The quest giver just has to mention some mumbo jumbo about a little person named Chromie having come by recently on an experiment and you've got your time travel raison d'être.

Something similar could be done with Outlands and/or Northrend saying it's stuck in some kind of Wibbly Wobbly, Timey Wimey, Dr. Who style field where it's stuck repeating events of a few years past.

Also, regarding "rehashed" content and it's percentage in the game. The entirety of Azeroth proper were redone for Cataclysm, I'd say it's a fairly decent percentage. Yes, some significant changes were made to the terrain, but it's largely the same. Yes some quest lines are totally new but most of them are the same or the same with a simple tweak to the number of items/kills needed. It's a vast rehash BUT it's AWESOME. The redesign of Azeroth was a part of the expansion that everyone, short of those that "level too fast" and complain, was a 10 out of 10, to me. Maybe 9.5 if I'm honest and allow for some room to improve. ;-)

Last thing I'd like to touch. ZA and ZG have to normal mode. Is this the first time in the history of wow a dungeon or raid exists solely in heroic mode? From an outsider perspective to development, it seems that making a Normal and Heroic mode is about the simplest thing there is. It's like a palette swap Abobo in Double Dragon, change a variable and you're done, essentially. With all the noise made about how players haven't even pushed their way sufficiently through current content to deserve new content, why are we again focusing on only more difficult and gated content?

03/10/2011 5:32 PMPosted by Zarhym
This talk about losing WoW developers, or that WoW is left to a "B team" is getting tiresome.


A blue has appeared while I was typing!
To me, I'd say, it takes two to tango. A decision to wildly change the focus of the game to a more difficult or hardcore or whatever you wish to call Cataclysms model was made. Radical changes have been coming in, to affect that change in model to the game. There have been some mistakes and some triumphs, some nerfs and some reversions. The development team isn't perfect and the community can be overly harsh. We can't expect players to like radical changes instantly, and we can't expect developers to be perfect, but we should try not to get upset at/by people for their feelings and having them. We must also respect that getting upset is also allowed.

Unfortunately a side effect of the "constant updates" model now being used is that folks aren't allowed to get comfortable with anything, good or bad. Unintentionally using the live realm as a test bed with constant hotfixes got a bit out of hand, and has been addressed by development. Bugs like the "Mangle sound effect for all" sat forever while "anti-fun" patches like Faded Wizard Hat, Older Dungeon Gold nerf, Cookies Tenderizer and Impetuous Query changes, Big Love Rocket drop rates for Love is in the Air reduced, Nitro Boosts fail rates, Elekk and Kodo forced on all Draenei and Tauren Paladins removing their horses, replacing cool flavor spells like Raise Ally with generic Battle Rez. Okay maybe a bit too many examples, sorry, but I felt it lacked gravitas to just list a couple and quit. The point being, the longer time between patches and updates meant that when some big changes came, and they are by nature fewer in number than little changes, they came alongside all the little stuff making it all feel more equally important, rather than a laser focus and lightning reaction on and to the small stuff.

Not that I'm advocating a return to the old style updates, mind you. This is simply another side effect. We're seeing it the world over as information disseminates faster and faster. You can't just change from one model to another and expect everyone to shout, "Hooray" and throw their hats in the air then roll to credits with Whitesnake blaring. =)
Edited by Marketnstein on 3/10/2011 6:04 PM PST
Reply Quote
62 Blood Elf Warlock
880
i don't know what the explanation is, but Cataclysm seems sub-par in terms of content, compared to other expansions. It seems like the vast majority of the content of this expansion was re-vamping the vanilla content - which we've already paid for once. This second time around it seemed like only about a third of what we paid for the developers to work on was 'new.'

i can only offer evidence in terms of what we received. TBC had 10 new levels and 7 new zones (8 if you count the elf island thingy that came late in the expansion). Wrath had 10 new levels and 8 new zones (9 if you count the zone under dalaran). Cataclysm had 5 levels and 5 zones. You could argue things like "southern and northern barrens being divided makes a new zone" but that is exactly what I'm saying: that's the revamping of old content. Any development in an area not suited for those between the level cap of the most recent past expansion and the current expansion is the redoing of old content - it's nice, but shouldn't be sold to us as a second time.
Edited by Search on 3/10/2011 5:54 PM PST
Reply Quote
100 Night Elf Hunter
11765
03/10/2011 1:20 PMPosted by Zarhym
There definitely is not a hard and fast rule about updating existing content. If we feel revamping existing content makes sense in the current state of the game and lore -- and we think it will be fun -- sure, it's a possibility. You definitely shouldn't expect this every patch though. In the grand scheme of World of Warcraft's history, we've reintroduced very little existing content per patch and expansion.


This is my biggest problem with some of the recent "new" content. You remove old content and redo it and introduce it as new with some new Lore to justify it.

Why not leave the old raids or instances and add new content based on the old content that the new Lore is establishing?


So you leave the old Deadmines for new players or established players who want to revisit it and have a new Deadmines where his daughter takes over and makes a new instance for capped players.

You leave ZA for people who want to run it as a level 70 raid and make a new heroic based on the new lore for capped players.

I guess I fail to see why this is not being done. It would seem to be a win win situation for everyone by allowing old content to remain for players while introducing new content for those same players.
Edited by Ariktu on 3/10/2011 5:52 PM PST
Reply Quote
85 Night Elf Priest
3585
i
Edited by Unfaithfúl on 4/15/2011 8:40 PM PDT
Reply Quote
62 Blood Elf Warlock
880
Seriously, I am actually feeling sorry for the folks at Blizzard. You nerds QQ about absolutely EVERYTHING! It's a game, and a good one at that, so really get a life and don't let it revolve around every tiny little flaw or disagreement you have with Wow, and just enjoy playing it.

I cannot believe people are crying about the thought of Devs being moved to a different project haha! Some of these posts are so pathetic it makes me actually want to quit the game because it reminds me about how sad some of the people that play it really are.

I for one, hope some of you don't QQ this much about real-life important things.
the forums are for providing feedback to blizzard. it doesn't really matter how insignificant you may feel the topic of the feedback is: it is still what the forums are for.

I'm sure blizzard knows how to prioritize their issues, in some sense at least. Obviously, they are going to put game-breaking class imbalances far above something like a menial graphics bug in a level 30 zone, but precisely because of that, there are very few game-breaking problems in the game, so that leaves mostly the menial things that remain to be sorted out.

As such, your complaint can be summed up as a disagreement with blizzard's intent of the forums. to paraphrase you: It's a forum, and a good one at that, so really get a life and don't let it revolve around every tiny little flaw or disagreement you have with the Wow forums, and just enjoy providing feedback on it.
Edited by Search on 3/10/2011 6:04 PM PST
Reply Quote
100 Blood Elf Paladin
12830
i don't know what the explanation is, but Cataclysm seems sub-par in terms of content, compared to other expansions. It seems like the vast majority of the content of this expansion was re-vamping the vanilla content - which we've already paid for once. This second time around it seemed like only about a third of what we paid for the developers to work on was 'new.'

i can only offer evidence in terms of what we received. TBC had 10 new levels and 7 new zones (8 if you count the elf island thingy that came late in the expansion). Wrath had 10 new levels and 8 new zones (9 if you count the zone under dalaran). Cataclysm had 5 levels and 5 zones. You could argue things like "southern and northern barrens being divided makes a new zone" but that is exactly what I'm saying: that's the revamping of old content. Any development in an area not suited for those between the level cap of the most recent past expansion and the current expansion is the redoing of old content - it's nice, but shouldn't be sold to us as a second time.



*sigh* We didn't pay for the redo of azeroth per say. At least as far as cata is concerned. That hit in a patch which people of all account types (i believe) got. For a 5 level not 10 level xpac Cata so far is ok on the amount of content. Quallity is another issue but im not going there.
Seriously people AM is still coming so they say, and Firelands next patch. They also haven't announced everything in 4.1 yet, least not that i am aware of. I also think they should revamp old content. Otherwise as someone put it it just sits and rots. Another person pointed out how its insulting to the people who originally created it to redo it. Actually i think that it's insulting that after the level goes by the content gathers dust and sits. And for you special snowflakes who are saying leave it, it's dead i did it soooo many times blah blah. Yea so did i and ya know what i'll be doing it a bunch more. Come off your pedastal a lot of things that made you special in past xpacs are going to get trivialized eventually. If you really are that "leet" what deems you special now in current content is what you should worry about. Though someone i doubt that you are special.
Reply Quote
85 Night Elf Priest
3585
yes
Edited by Unfaithfúl on 4/15/2011 8:41 PM PDT
Reply Quote

Please report any Code of Conduct violations, including:

Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.

Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.

Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.

Forums Code of Conduct

Report Post # written by

Reason
Explain (256 characters max)

Reported!

[Close]