Old Wow

90 Human Mage
3530
Blizz, you write posts to explain how well u did with this expansion.

the MAJORITY, that doesnt visit these forums, they have busy lives...sort of. They arent interested in u catering for hardcore players only.

The whole damn reason u have to write blue posts is to say ur doing good. You are writing them because you are failing the majority. People vote with their money.

Sure, elitists are already bored. But they make up the 0.5% of all wow community. Loosing the majority means loosing ur profit.

Stop telling us, the game is fine. Stop giving bribes to under-represented classes. Make em fun to play. Make the whole damn game fun.

Want a real solution instead of rant? Make "Heroic 2" mode. Where the bosses have 1.9Billion health. Damage, Resistances, and healing are reduced by 98.65%

Anyway, dont listen to me. After all, you have been in business a long time. Time to start loosing profit because u turned ur back on majority. When you are bleeding 127,000,000USD a month because everyone left, Think.
85 Orc Hunter
5255
Well, last Tuesday in AV the Alliance summoned the boss. Let's just say rapage followed.
86 Night Elf Rogue
4675
Blizz, you write posts to explain how well u did with this expansion.

the MAJORITY, that doesnt visit these forums, they have busy lives...sort of. They arent interested in u catering for hardcore players only.

The whole damn reason u have to write blue posts is to say ur doing good. You are writing them because you are failing the majority. People vote with their money.

Sure, elitists are already bored. But they make up the 0.5% of all wow community. Loosing the majority means loosing ur profit.

Stop telling us, the game is fine. Stop giving bribes to under-represented classes. Make em fun to play. Make the whole damn game fun.

Want a real solution instead of rant? Make "Heroic 2" mode. Where the bosses have 1.9Billion health. Damage, Resistances, and healing are reduced by 98.65%

Anyway, dont listen to me. After all, you have been in business a long time. Time to start loosing profit because u turned ur back on majority. When you are bleeding 127,000,000USD a month because everyone left, Think.


you're the dumbest person in this thread so far. congratulations. also, you suck at typing. just wanted to to let you know that too.
86 Undead Rogue
8015
A lot of you people are delusional.

WoW has come so far since vanilla and is infinitely better. OP and like-minded people are just looking at vanilla through rose-colored glasses, forgetting all of the bad and elevating all of the good. What are some of the bad things that they seem to have forgotten?

Raiding was reserved for the top 5% or so of a server. Only those people had the dedication and skills to make it into a successful end-game 40 man raid guild. Sure, there were some pretender guilds who did the small 40 man raids, but they never had a chance of progressing into and through end-game content. If you think you're good enough to be one of those 5%, you're wrong. If you really are one of the top 5%, chances are you don't have the dedication to be in one of those guilds anyway (i.e. 40-80+ hours a week devoted to raids and preparing for raids), so again, no you're not 40 man raid guild material.

PvP was just as bad, with an algorithm made to forbid anyone but the top few percent of PvPers from accessing the top-tier PvP gear. You think you're one of the top few percent? Again, you're wrong.

PvE was just as bad. Example: I spent 3-4 weeks farming Tyr's Hand just to get 40 gold just so I could buy 2 Dawn's Edges, the best pre-raid hunter 1H weapons in the game. 4 weeks. For 40 gold. And the weapons were blue.

Talents. You want to play a hunter? Great! Want to be BM or survival? Too damn bad. If you wanted to be in a raiding guild, let alone an end-game raiding guild, you were forced to be MM. And not just MM, but a very specific build with no extra talent points anywhere else. Don't like it? Again, too damn bad. That's the way it was. All of the other classes were the same. Warriors were only prot. Pallys were only holy. Priests were only shadow (I think). Choosing a different class/build and being in a successful raiding guild were mutually exclusive.

The list goes on ad infinitum. The fact is that WoW is better now than vanilla and anyone who says different is forgetting what the game used to be.
85 Draenei Shaman
5800
04/08/2011 05:49 PMPosted by Bashiok
(I NEED A FAIRY MONK WITH A MAGIC LOCKPICK?)


I don't want one of those.... just an adaptation of the Bling Gnome, please!
85 Orc Warrior
2870
One problem.

You are doing the exact opposite with this expansion.

WotLK, exactly what you are talking about.

Cata, exactly the opposite.
90 Orc Shaman
19875
Blizz is taking steps in the right direction. I'm not sure how I feel about forcing casual play out of people (namely the raid lockout system, which is only slightly better than T9 which was 6ft under rock bottom) but pretty much everything has been an improvement.

They understood and fixed a lot of things that companies like Square don't understand. Such as the difference between the words "difficult" and "inconvenient".

Completing a difficult and challenging task is more fun and rewarding than completing a long and tedious one. Not to say dauntingly long trivial tasks aren't also my cup of tea, it's just that there's a difference between making people jump through hoops to do something that should be easy, and letting them jump through hoops because they just have spare time.

The problem isn't the system, but the people that only do the bare minimum required of them and now find themselves with all this spare time they would have been spending jumping hoops, so they complain that they aren't required to anymore, or (my favorite) that other people don't have to anymore.

There are still plenty of hoops, just take some initiative and stop worrying about what other people are/aren't experiencing. There are plenty of ways to make the game more inconvenient for yourself still =P
86 Night Elf Rogue
4675
A lot of you people are delusional.

WoW has come so far since vanilla and is infinitely better. OP and like-minded people are just looking at vanilla through rose-colored glasses, forgetting all of the bad and elevating all of the good. What are some of the bad things that they seem to have forgotten?

Raiding was reserved for the top 5% or so of a server. Only those people had the dedication and skills to make it into a successful end-game 40 man raid guild. Sure, there were some pretender guilds who did the small 40 man raids, but they never had a chance of progressing into and through end-game content. If you think you're good enough to be one of those 5%, you're wrong. If you really are one of the top 5%, chances are you don't have the dedication to be in one of those guilds anyway (i.e. 40-80+ hours a week devoted to raids and preparing for raids), so again, no you're not 40 man raid guild material.

PvP was just as bad, with an algorithm made to forbid anyone but the top few percent of PvPers from accessing the top-tier PvP gear. You think you're one of the top few percent? Again, you're wrong.

PvE was just as bad. Example: I spent 3-4 weeks farming Tyr's Hand just to get 40 gold just so I could buy 2 Dawn's Edges, the best pre-raid hunter 1H weapons in the game. 4 weeks. For 40 gold. And the weapons were blue.

Talents. You want to play a hunter? Great! Want to be BM or survival? Too damn bad. If you wanted to be in a raiding guild, let alone an end-game raiding guild, you were forced to be MM. And not just MM, but a very specific build with no extra talent points anywhere else. Don't like it? Again, too damn bad. That's the way it was. All of the other classes were the same. Warriors were only prot. Pallys were only holy. Priests were only shadow (I think). Choosing a different class/build and being in a successful raiding guild were mutually exclusive.

The list goes on ad infinitum. The fact is that WoW is better now than vanilla and anyone who says different is forgetting what the game used to be.


I'm sorry that you spent 3-4 weeks farming 40 gold. maybe if you picked up leather working, you would have realized that selling devilsaur leggings and warbear woolies made a killing. I was able to sc#!## up that much god weekly and i was doing a Grand Marshal grind.

40-80 hours a week raiding? guilds would dedicate three to four hours every other night to raiding, and less if they were a well oiled machine.

top 5% on the server raiding 40 man content? maybe if you wanted to be at the end of nax, but even on an RP server, there were a few guilds that progressed into the end content.

news flash, MMOs back then were exactly what, as you term and is completely overused, rose tinted glasses wearers wanted. I'm sorry that you decided to pick up an MMO, and a LIGHT mmo compared to what was out there at the time.

any of you tried EQ? originAL SWG, even?

you know what you cupcakes want? you want to beat the game. MMOs aren't "beatable".

you want everything in your favor and the rules to be set by you. half the people playing this game are already bored! noone leaves stormwind for anything. they queu up, and boom they're in an instance. boom they're in pvp. theres portals to everywhere, despite you already having easy mode flying mounts that freaking break the sound barrier.

infinitely better? WoW now is the exact definiton of sloth and greed.

what you fools don't understand is we're not looking at old wow with "rose tinted glasses".

what BAD are we missing? is it back that most of us were completely content in not seeing the top end game content that was reserved for people who HAD the time and the dedication to do? what kind of player are YOU to decide this? are you a player that seeks server first/ world first but in order to do that you would have had to dedicate dozens of hours a week to wow which you honestly don't want to do?

give me a break. anyone who wants ANYTHING bad enough in a game is going to dedicate anything to get it done. and they won't complain about it afterwords.

I personally wouldn't do anther r14 grind, but thats mainly because i've been there, and i've done that.

you poeple that are complaining about the endgame not being accessable are the ones that STILL aren't even doing endgame right now.

everything is better for you now because everything yeilds rewards and free crap. everything is thrown at you. I'm sorry but pugging raids is not my idea of raiding. if raid content is easy enough for people to watch on youtube, run in and just get it done with 9 other people that they've never seen before and reap rewards that spill out of the pinata's belly, then sorry but I'll take my rose colored "remember the good, forget the bad" crap that you think i'm wearing.
100 Tauren Druid
10785
Blizz, you write posts to explain how well u did with this expansion.

the MAJORITY, that doesnt visit these forums, they have busy lives...sort of. They arent interested in u catering for hardcore players only.

The whole damn reason u have to write blue posts is to say ur doing good. You are writing them because you are failing the majority. People vote with their money.

Sure, elitists are already bored. But they make up the 0.5% of all wow community. Loosing the majority means loosing ur profit.

Stop telling us, the game is fine. Stop giving bribes to under-represented classes. Make em fun to play. Make the whole damn game fun.

Want a real solution instead of rant? Make "Heroic 2" mode. Where the bosses have 1.9Billion health. Damage, Resistances, and healing are reduced by 98.65%

Anyway, dont listen to me. After all, you have been in business a long time. Time to start loosing profit because u turned ur back on majority. When you are bleeding 127,000,000USD a month because everyone left, Think.


you're the dumbest person in this thread so far. congratulations. also, you suck at typing. just wanted to to let you know that too.


You seriously need to go have a beer or something. You're wound up way too tight.
100 Blood Elf Paladin
14350
i love how ALL of the people in this thread whining about the Old schoolers complaining are comepletely brain dead retards.

<cut for brevity>

these days, if you don't like it, don't worry. it'll be patchedand you can plow through it with no worries at all in the next update.

me? i personally don't even believe in progression anymore. whats the point? wait a couple months, it becomes trivial.

so, why are we upset, seriously? it used to be an RPG. AN RPG. THIS GAME IS NO LONGER AN MMO RPG.


So, because things were harder, it makes everyone a whiner? You are looking at vanilla through amazingly rose colored glasses.

Let’s go back to vanilla and have things like it was in Vanilla.

-Paladins and druids can’t tank or DPS. They heal
-Priests heal
-Shamans heal and/or off tank as enhance
-You only have one warlock in the raid, spec SM/Ruin. They use CoE, they have to make 40 healthstones for the raid. They need to farm soul shards for an hour or two before raid so they can go summon everyone.
-Mages have to be specced frost (for MC) and fire for everything else. They need to log in early so they can make water for the whole raid.
-On fear fights, you have to have a shaman or a dwarf priest, otherwise you don’t raid.
-In instances, you better have the right classes or you can’t CC the targets therefore you can’t finish the instance. Most classes did not have any CC, and if they did it was VERY ineffective.
-Shaman were massively OP in PvP, one decent shaman could take down a group of alliance with no issues.
-Warlocks were untouchable in PvP

For the raids, you needed, at level 60, to go back and run places like Mara over and over to get nature resist gear, you had to farm up fire resist gear. You had to run Onyxia enough times to be able to make the cloaks to be able to do BWL… you had no other options.

If someone new joined your raiding guild, you had to go back and redo all the old content over and over again so they could be attuned to the raid you were in, you had to go back to old content and farm all that resist gear to they would be able to raid.

Get over YOURself. You talk about “doing your time,” but most of what you had to do was simply grinding. I got my warlock to revered with Thorium Brotherhood for the enchants, I grinded rep for the Cenarion Circle and the Timbermaws. Yeah, I did my time killing mobs for hours on end so I could get the items to turn in for minimal amounts of rep. Guess what? It’s no more awesome than what I’m doing now with factions, I just actually get something for it and don’t have to kill a million furblogs or run BRD over and over and over and over.

I got exalted with Argent Dawn… doing quests for attunement? No, more like getting groups for Strat, Scholo, and BRD so you could collect items for the repeatable turn ins. After doing all the quests, you still wouldn’t have the rep you needed for Nax.

Mounts? Yeah, it’s cheaper now, and you get it sooner. What value does it now add to walk until 40 and not get epic until 60? There’s 25 more levels after 60 now. There’s a lot still left in the game, and the game focuses on the end game content, not on taking a million years to level.

You talk about finding friends and not dealing with the queue… guess what? People still do that! They just have an option if they don’t want to wait for their friends to get online. The number of times I wanted to run an instance pre-LFD and couldn’t because no one was online and no one wanted to run that particular dungeon.

You talk about BGs, yet I still have fun when I do them, in fact I have more fun than I did at 60 because I wasn’t running around with a title and I would get one shot by those warlocks with T3 raid gear.

You talk of having to grind your 2 thousand gold or Commander for your land mount, big whup, again what is the value of spending that amount of gold on a mounts now? Epic riding is no longer the best way to travel. A new level 60 character (one without a main to fund them) still has to grind gold for flying at 60, cold weather flying, epic flying… and with the XP speed, it can be difficult to have that 500 gold by level 60.

you see... its not that things were "harder" back then. its the fact that WE never had to deal with whiny ****'s like your new generation. of course there were the guys who complained about anything and everything, but they always quit. ande they would play xbox, and prolly never did pick up an RPG in their life.


Yet, those people were the same ones that Blizzard listened to when TBC came out. You think they made the TBC expansion how it was because the majority of the player base enjoyed everything that you refer to? If the game was so perfect then, they would have kept things the same way.
me? i personally don't even believe in progression anymore. whats the point? wait a couple months, it becomes trivial.

I quote this again because it shows that you don’t play the game for the right reasons. You still have to get the gear to be able to do raids (and now heroics). Then you still have to get the gear to be able to succeed in those raids as the bosses get harder. And you still need to get that gear in order to progress to the next tier raid (once it comes out). The difference now? You won’t have to go back and do it all again if someone new joins your guild. You won’t be stuck doing the current tier raids again so your new tank can get the gear to be able to do the content your guild is up to.

You are the epitome of the elitists people talk about in these forums. You think that the “work” you did means you “deserved” the extra stuff. Yet, it wasn’t work, it was just time. They want us to be able to get to the actual content now, not hit 85 and spend the next month killing Furblogs or running around in EPL to collect scourgestones to get your rep up just to get IN to the raids.
90 Worgen Mage
8720
alkir 10 man is breaking guilds : ( harder then chogall for less valuable loot
90 Troll Hunter
10340
OP: I've been playing since beta and ive raided every instance and got full 40 man epics. I even have every rare mount and I sit on them in org to show off to other people. And now your telling me that someone who plays casually can have the same stuff as me? This is an outrage!!! I play 16 hours a day and now your telling me that this peasant is on the same level as me?
I swear all vanilla wow did was fill players egos to bursting limits
100 Tauren Druid
10785
OP: I've been playing since beta and ive raided every instance and got full 40 man epics. I even have every rare mount and I sit on them in org to show off to other people. And now your telling me that someone who plays casually can have the same stuff as me? This is an outrage!!! I play 16 hours a day and now your telling me that this peasant is on the same level as me?
I swear all vanilla wow did was fill players egos to bursting limits


"Same stuff"? No, at least not in a comparable time frame. Same fun, yes. I liked BC's raiding environment because while the more serious raiders were slogging through BT and Sunwell I was enjoying myself in Kara. WotLK did accessibility different in that we all went through the same stuff, which I can see as being less rewarding for a serious raider, but everyone got to see everything eventually.
90 Troll Hunter
10340
And another thing why do people get so nostalgic for Molten Core. All I hear is "omg mc was so fun it took months to get full tier 1, that was the best wow has ever been. Last time i checked MC is 90% trash mobs and 10% bosses....WoW awesome
90 Troll Hunter
10340
I was mainly referring to the serious players who get mad that non raiders can have epics as well. I honestly don't have a problem with it. It doesn't keep me from raiding and I didn't farm for the Zulian tiger because I wanted to feel special, I farmed for it because it looked awesome and match my troll.(Never got it though)
85 Tauren Shaman
3755
Imagine if blizz did change everything back to how it was in vanilla, and the vanilla players would be running around on a server with only 30 people online...
86 Night Elf Rogue
4675

So, because things were harder, it makes everyone a whiner? You are looking at vanilla through amazingly rose colored glasses.

Let’s go back to vanilla and have things like it was in Vanilla.

<cut for quotability>

You are the epitome of the elitists people talk about in these forums. You think that the “work” you did means you “deserved” the extra stuff. Yet, it wasn’t work, it was just time. They want us to be able to get to the actual content now, not hit 85 and spend the next month killing Furblogs or running around in EPL to collect scourgestones to get your rep up just to get IN to the raids.


at last, someone that actually knows everything that went on, yet disagrees.

let's dissect the phrase 'rose colored glasses' first of all. according to people definition, its looking back nostalicly while remembering the 'good' and forgetting the 'bad'.

unfortunatly, this "bad" is what the people in this thread that are opposing the others, are clamoring for.

we want these things. thats what we enjoyed. also, misuse of the word elitest. i don't think i'm better than anyone. i call people idiots that are.. well idiots, but not to say i'm not an idiot.

I understand full well that hanging on to something i love and that has passed on makes me a complete idiot. that doesn't mean that this new player base isn't filled with whiney brats that want everything further nerfed, and further given to them. its a bore! most of these people that haven't even accomplished anything in-game have that better than thou mentality, too.

i never did say that walking until level 40 was better. hoever, i did say that everything felt more rewarding when you got it.

does it matter to me about "how many mounts" i have or how much crap i have? no. in fact, i still only have my old commander mount, which bugged out when i used it, so i still have the original mount in my bank with the tool tip "requires riding level 40" or whatever on it. so yea, i have a total of... what three mounts. my panther, a hippogryph and the non epic flyer.

do i don't flash that stuff in peoples faces. i don't care, what i do care about is the enjoyment of the time i invest and how rewarding things feel, how epic the adventure feels during and whether or not I'll be standing around doing nothing all the time.

Atunement was wow's way of keeping you busy. waste of time for many, but to many others, it was what kept us busy. that was our game. if you were hardcore, you would get your attunement. you would farm for your resist gear in Mara ( i do remember that too. me and my druid buddy would farm all day for that and in BRD for fire resist) .

but for the casual, guess what? there was content too! AQ 20 and ZG were great content for these players, and even myself before i went over the top andbecame more of a hardcore investing player.

players would be able to invest time and get the Knight lt blue pvp gear and mix and match D1 set pieces (which did take time to get) and such. then you could got into UBRS, which was your entry level raid (well after scholo and strat became five man)

so casual gamers had their stuff too. there was a ton of content back then and nothing truly felt linear. you went across the globe for EVERYTHING and the entire world was part of the game. all the things about raiding you listed were for those who seriously wanted to invest their time into raiding. that option was there. and now that option is what, heroic versions of the same thing? same drops, diff color? achievements? where's the fun in just getting a bunch of purples that are scattered along the road that you walk straight through to get to that "hardcore" content?

the things we miss aren't coming back. we know that.

but you all are missing the point that we're not just talking about end game raiding.

also, no. noone uses anything but the LFD tool. in fact i bet 80-90% of the population now barely even knows where the dungeons are located. people look on trade and LFG channel for old school dungeons for achievements and mounts but thats it, the questing has gotten so quick that people barely even group to quest anymore.
64 Goblin Mage
400
pretty much blizzard is saying is that they need to make the game easier so more people play and they get paid more instead of sticking with MMORPG.. now you just sit in the city waiting to group with random people you dont know who where asshats on thier heads because they believe out of 2 million players they are the best. welcome to the crappy wow.
92 Tauren Druid
8755
Vanilla was better in that there was more of a local community of people on the server for PvE and what little there was for PvP.

TBC brought about X-realm BGs and that started a slow disintegration of the local server community since you could queue up and not even bother to talk to people too much.

Wrath brought that on even more when the X-Realm stuff went to PvE as well as PvP.

Between Wrath and Cataclysm it's interesting to watch the bribery going on to get people to queue up. The X-realm tool was a mixed blessing, yes you could find groups but you can do it without socializing and getting to know people. At least not like you had to with local server only groups and the social factor declined to anonymity and the mess that is here today.
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