Ask The Devs #8 - Firelands (Answers)

85 Dwarf Shaman
2975

That said, I'm also still kinda hoping that Abyssal Maw becomes a raid instead of just a 5 man.


That's what it sounded like to me when they talked about AM having some bosses and Firelands having less bosses. Seems to me that AM was to be a collection of one off raid bosses like Onyxia.
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85 Tauren Warrior
7090
Q: What happened with the Abyssal Maw dungeon that was supposed to come with Firelands? – Maryjanee (EU-EN), Espiritu (NA)


A: Our initial plan for this raid tier was to have fewer bosses in Firelands and a small number of bosses in the Abyssal Maw. As we looked more closely at Firelands, though, we realized that it deserved more bosses. We also got excited about designing item art (and set bonuses!) that were very fiery in nature, and the Molten Front questing area was turning out to be really cool, so we ended up piling more resources into Firelands. That led to the decision to focus on one strong theme (fire), rather than a more diluted fire-and-water theme.

The case for Abyssal Maw pitch was that we could reuse a lot of existing assets (the fights were to take place in a giant shelled demigod like Nespirah), and while we are willing to do that, we thought Abyssal Maw would just pale in comparison to the magnificence of the Firelands. So, we put all of our eggs into that one basket. We’ve decided for now that the Vashj’ir quest line along with the Throne of the Tides dungeon does a pretty good job of finishing the Neptulon story.


Focusing on a good Fireland's experience for this next content pack is very sensible.

If we really have already seen the end of the Abyssal Maw story thread, I am a bit disappointed. Vashj'ir was my favorite zone in Cataclysm questing by far, and it allowed for your art folks to really shine with the environment.

I have no doubt that you folks could come up with an imaginative and compelling continuation to that story arc, so here's to hoping Abyssal Maw gets revisited this expansion. :)
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85 Gnome Mage
5420
05/25/2011 10:11 AMPosted by Kaivax
A: The supposition that easier content is less appealing in the question is a bit puzzling given how few guilds have been able to finish the heroic 25 encounters. In any event, it wasn’t that we set out to make sure 10s and 25s were different. If anything, we wanted to make sure that 25s weren’t significantly harder, since many of the 25-player guilds were convinced we were trying to force them to become 10-player raiding guilds.

I kind of think the lack of people doing 25 man content is more related to the shared lockout than to content difficulty. It's just plain easier to get 10 people organized than it is to get 25 and when you have to decide which version you want to try each week guess which one most people go for.

Just my opinion though and it may not be worth the pixels required to reproduce it.
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90 Tauren Druid
5045
Diluted fire-and-water theme?

So that's the idea behind content patches now? Sacrificing more content to avoid contradicting the nature of the raids? Worst excuse I've ever heard for anything. Seriously

Can the patch you release in another 6 months be content themed?
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10 Dwarf Paladin
80
Their answer about the Abyssal Maw is rather vague, so I can't help but wonder if they changed their mind about it being a 5-man and turned it, at some point, into a raid. If so, and if they somehow plan to keep it that way, it makes me wonder what new 5-man may be coming in the future.

If they retune AQ20 (or 10, as it is now) to be a 5-man like I think they will (mere speculation but I wouldn't be surprised), that's something,b ut if they offer two more instances that are just retunes (AQ40 as well, maybe?), I imagine the reaction to that will be quite negative.

I tend to be optimistic but I am feel pretty sour about this.
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75 Tauren Warrior
1030
What the hell do you mean the Neptulon story is finished? You're seriously telling me him getting eaten by a giant squid is it? No Abyssal Maw raid?

God damn...
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10 Dwarf Paladin
80
You guys avoided all questions about engineering helms (aka goggles). >_<


Seriously? ...finishing? ...so that portal near Throne of the Tides entrance is gonna be left alone ...poor instance portal. Q_Q


Why are people conveniently overlooking the "for now" part of that quote? Are you people that desperate for something to whine about that you need to make something up?


For now can be quite a bit of time. It could be 4.3, it could be 5.0, it could be never. I mean, look at the Dance Studio. And then there's the fact that they view Throne of the Tides as a good "end" for it. It isn't.
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90 Human Rogue
6980
05/25/2011 11:38 AMPosted by Firenice
All this whining about everything, you guys realize that with 8.5 MILLION customers it is literally impossible for them to please everyone right?


The mantra of the lazy. We are not talking about making all 8.5 million living in nirvana with the game, but there are serious problems with cata, and mentioning them and asking for solutions is not petty.

Lets address one glaring problem here: that it is easier to get into Carnegie Hall than get your melee dps into a raid. Not pleasing everyone does not explain this incredibly lazy answer:

Q: A majority of the fights in T11 favored having little or no Melee DPS. Are there plans to fix this?Merissa (NA), Espiritu (NA)

A: We view this more of a class problem than an encounter problem. ... We recognize all of these problems, as do many players, but it’s challenging to address them quickly.


In other words: sure you spent 3 years leveling your rogue...but fixing it sounds really hard, and we got lots of stuff to do, so suck it b#tch and roll up a mage or give up raiding.

Nice.
Edited by Desra on 5/25/2011 2:44 PM PDT
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85 Worgen Death Knight
12515
Q: What happened with the Abyssal Maw dungeon that was supposed to come with Firelands?Maryjanee (EU-EN), Espiritu (NA)

    A: Our initial plan for this raid tier was to have fewer bosses in Firelands and a small number of bosses in the Abyssal Maw. As we looked more closely at Firelands, though, we realized that it deserved more bosses. We also got excited about designing item art (and set bonuses!) that were very fiery in nature, and the Molten Front questing area was turning out to be really cool, so we ended up piling more resources into Firelands. That led to the decision to focus on one strong theme (fire), rather than a more diluted fire-and-water theme.

    The case for Abyssal Maw pitch was that we could reuse a lot of existing assets (the fights were to take place in a giant shelled demigod like Nespirah), and while we are willing to do that, we thought Abyssal Maw would just pale in comparison to the magnificence of the Firelands. So, we put all of our eggs into that one basket. We’ve decided for now that the Vashj’ir quest line along with the Throne of the Tides dungeon does a pretty good job of finishing the Neptulon story.


Did they say Abyssal Maw was scrapped entirely? No they didn't. Not at all. Just for 4.2 and only 4.2. Is reading comprehension that difficult for people?


People are more annoyed by that last bit. Where they think they did a good job of finishing Neptulon's story when he was sucked up by Ozumat. That's not an ending. That's a cliffhanger.
Edited by Varicose on 5/25/2011 2:44 PM PDT
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100 Dwarf Rogue
16435
05/25/2011 10:11 AMPosted by Kaivax
We’ve decided for now that the Vashj’ir quest line along with the Throne of the Tides dungeon does a pretty good job of finishing the Neptulon story.


Good job of finishing the story? Neptulon gets carried off at the end of Throne of the Tides and we're left wondering what happens. Hardly a good job of finishing the story. And yes I noticed you said for now, I still disagree.
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10 Dwarf Paladin
80



People are more annoyed by that last bit. Where they think they did a good job of finishing Neptulon's story when he was sucked up by Ozumat. That's not an ending. That's a cliffhanger.


Again I have to point out the qualifier "for now" as it implies it isn't entirely done forever and will never be addressed again. The cliffhanger wrapped up that part of the story and Abyssal Maw will continue it at some point. Why is that hard to understand? Blizzard isn't trying to wiggle out of doing new content they were simply explaining why Abyssal Maw is being moved to another patch. Has it occurred to you people that maybe we might get BOTH a 5 man and a raid out of it? I'm sure if that is the case there will be nothing but whining about some aspect of that as well.


The thing is, all they say is "for now." That's it. They don't say "We still plan to do a 5-man/raid for it, just not right now." All they say is a vague "for now." That's a point some, such as myself, are also annoyed with. If they had been a bit more clear about it, that'd be something, but instead it just seems almost flippant.

And then there's the fact that they mention that initially the Firelands had fewer bosses, when they were planning the Abyssal Maw along with it. Fewer bosses? Firelands already only has 7. That's not a large number to begin with (and also I seem to recall way back at Blizzcon they mentioned they wanted like 7 bosses there to begin with, so it makes me wonder when this even took place. B ack at Blizzcon, Abyssal Maw was still on track too).

I'm just annoyed by the exclusion of content. I am fine with a delay, if we can get at least an estimated timeframe for it (4.3, 4.4, 5.0, "In the next major content patch or two," something). But we just get "for now." For now can mean years from now. Or it could just be something to make us settle down so it can quietly vanish into the ether like the Dance Studio.

edit: By comparison, the delay for Firelands not being in 4.1 was pretty clear. Essentially "We want to spend more time on it, so we're pushing it back to 4.2 so we can put out 4.1 faster too." Instead, we get a "for now."
Edited by Gungnir on 5/25/2011 2:53 PM PDT
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85 Undead Warlock
7420


People are more annoyed by that last bit. Where they think they did a good job of finishing Neptulon's story when he was sucked up by Ozumat. That's not an ending. That's a cliffhanger.


Again I have to point out the qualifier "for now" as it implies it isn't entirely done forever and will never be addressed again. The cliffhanger wrapped up that part of the story and Abyssal Maw will continue it at some point. Why is that hard to understand? Blizzard isn't trying to wiggle out of doing new content they were simply explaining why Abyssal Maw is being moved to another patch. Has it occurred to you people that maybe we might get BOTH a 5 man and a raid out of it? I'm sure if that is the case there will be nothing but whining about some aspect of that as well.


If they were moving it to another patch why not just say so, instead of suggesting that they're happy with things as they are? If Blizz was making a Vashj'ir dungeon, or better yet an entire raid, why not just mention that they're planning on revisiting it in a later content patch? This shows every sign of being a big promise that gets completely scrapped, and everyone can see that.
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