I'm Speaking from the Heart, Blizzard.

85 Draenei Priest
1755
Please. Everyone who is complaining about the Nerf. Or how easy Wrath was, and how Cata is becoming Wrath. Please post your H LK kill pre Buff date.


Thanks.
Community Manager
Plenty of people like the challenge, but not everyone has the ability or maybe even desire to be in a guild capable of tackling it right from the get-go.

It's always been our intent to offer new raid tiers in Cataclysm that are difficult to provide challenge to the raiding guilds, and then gradually allow older content to self-nerf as people gear up through VP, and then eventual literal nerfs to the content. That's something we've been communicating for some time.

Burning Crusade swung the pendulum one way, and Wrath of the Lich King swung it back too far the other. We're attempting to find that middle ground where there's still something brutally difficult for the cutting edge, but content gradually comes down until it's extremely accessible (ie PUGable) either simply through gear proliferation, or literal content difficulty nerfs.

There's always going to be two sides of the fence, some people want things more accessible for them and that's cool, we want it to be too, and some people think it should be difficult and always be that way because that's the way they had to do it. The fact of the matter is that as an MMO the end-game bar is constantly being raised, and progression content is in general not a place where we're going to purposefully gate prestige through difficulty. There are some exceptions of course, hard modes and unlockable bosses are purposefully there to be more difficult challenges, but as a whole our intent is to create a constantly moving ramp upward for Normal difficulty raids. That has to mean that the Normal raid content that was the hardest will one day be the easiest.

You will very likely see this same happen for Firelands when the raid tier above it is released.
85 Troll Hunter
12905
It's always been our intent to offer new raid tiers in Cataclysm that are difficult to provide challenge to the raiding guilds, and then gradually allow older content to self-nerf as people gear up through VP, and then eventual literal nerfs to the content. That's something we've been communicating for some time.


I don't believe blizz has ever truly supported literal nerfs to regression content for the sake of making it accessible ever. Nerfs to content were implemented on the cutting edge of raiding to allow for accesibility to endgame raiders, and then the content was simply doable by others as they geared up, particularly with gear from later instances. The only time non-cutting edge content has been nerfed is if somehow it remained cutting-edge, or if changes in class mechanics made the fight prohibitive.

Its in my opinion that the existing practice worked just fine, people can gear up in normal firelands/rep/valor and knock out the existing content easily. The nerfs being put in place are just complete overkill on top of that.
90 Orc Warrior
8205
As a pretty casual player, I'm not going to complain about having a chance to easily see more content. But I do understand where 'hardcore' people are coming from, when they are a little unhappy about seeing the content they struggled through is now being face-rolled by people who have no idea whats going on.

imo It's kind of like being happy with your salary from work, and then learning the new doofus they just hired has a bigger salary then yours; as a result, you are much less satisfied with your salary. Now I'm sure people in this thread would pop in and say "But your salary wasn't changed at all, you should still be just as happy with it!" I'm not saying that I disagree with their premise ('be happy with what you got, and don't worry about comparing it to the other guy') but I'm just pointing out that i understand where these other people are coming from even if i don't agree 100%.

Personally I'd prefer blizz just either put in a Icecrown buff-system or simply add an Easy/Training tier. That would much more clearly and systematically allow for more people to 'just see the content' without this sloppy and unpredictable super-nerfs to content after-the-fact. Again, even as a non-raider i definitely understand how a hardcore person could be a bit peeved by having his accomplishments & struggles devalued because every sloppy bad can now do it.
85 Orc Warrior
7005
05/24/2011 01:15 PMPosted by Hiricine
It's always been our intent to offer new raid tiers in Cataclysm that are difficult to provide challenge to the raiding guilds, and then gradually allow older content to self-nerf as people gear up through VP, and then eventual literal nerfs to the content. That's something we've been communicating for some time.


I don't believe blizz has ever truly supported literal nerfs to regression content for the sake of making it accessible ever. Nerfs to content were implemented on the cutting edge of raiding to allow for accesibility to endgame raiders, and then the content was simply doable by others as they geared up, particularly with gear from later instances. The only time non-cutting edge content has been nerfed is if somehow it remained cutting-edge, or if changes in class mechanics made the fight prohibitive.

Its in my opinion that the existing practice worked just fine, people can gear up in normal firelands/rep/valor and knock out the existing content easily. The nerfs being put in place are just complete overkill on top of that.


The over time stacking buff in ICC would like to disagree with you.
86 Gnome Mage
9665
05/24/2011 01:15 PMPosted by Hiricine
I don't believe blizz has ever truly supported literal nerfs to regression content for the sake of making it accessible ever.


30% ICC buff, anyone?
90 Troll Warlock
12860
Please. Everyone who is complaining about the Nerf. Or how easy Wrath was, and how Cata is becoming Wrath. Please post your H LK kill pre Buff date.


I couldn't agree more.

Same could be said about ToTc and Wrath-Naxx.

You didn't jump in and kill Anub and K.T the first try, or 3, when it first came out.
Edited by Zukia on 5/24/2011 1:27 PM PDT
64 Goblin Priest
RED
520
The people who wanted a challenge had 5 months + time until 4.2 to complete it. If you haven't done it by that point then you either didn't care enough to run the instance every week or two or you weren't capable of clearing it on that difficultly. Either is fine. WoW is full of people with all varieties of skills and schedules.

I'm sitting about 2/3 of the way through the hard mode content and I'm completely fine with everything being nerfed with firelands comes out. The guilds who have completed the current content on normal or heroic mode will be moving onto firelands and clearing the newly challenging content at their own pace. The ones who didn't finish t11 may decide to wrap that up first in order to get a few pieces of gear. The ones who couldn't find the time to organize themselves into a raid group or just didn't have the ability to clear content at its current difficulty will get their chance to see it.

The system works fine for me. The only thing was how shocking the number of changes were. But it mostly is the long winded way of saying "We're adding a 20% damage/healing/stamina buff to the entire tier" without actually doing it.
90 Tauren Druid
7055
05/24/2011 01:15 PMPosted by Hiricine
It's always been our intent to offer new raid tiers in Cataclysm that are difficult to provide challenge to the raiding guilds, and then gradually allow older content to self-nerf as people gear up through VP, and then eventual literal nerfs to the content. That's something we've been communicating for some time.


I don't believe blizz has ever truly supported literal nerfs to regression content for the sake of making it accessible ever. Nerfs to content were implemented on the cutting edge of raiding to allow for accesibility to endgame raiders, and then the content was simply doable by others as they geared up, particularly with gear from later instances. The only time non-cutting edge content has been nerfed is if somehow it remained cutting-edge, or if changes in class mechanics made the fight prohibitive.

Its in my opinion that the existing practice worked just fine, people can gear up in normal firelands/rep/valor and knock out the existing content easily. The nerfs being put in place are just complete overkill on top of that.


Did you miss all of ICC? 30 percent buff is a much bigger nerf to the relative difficulty of that content than this nerf is.
90 Human Paladin
14550
05/24/2011 01:26 PMPosted by Zukia
You didn't jump in and kill Anub and K.T the first try, or 3, when it first came out.


Normal modes? Sure did.
90 Troll Hunter
16610
If Firelands is to receive the same treatment then there has to be some sort of reward that players get out of it for doing it when it is actually difficult, and not nerfed to the ground. Simply having the gear and getting a headstart for the next content patch isn't enough, - when everyone is going to be handed the gear and kills eventually. People will struggle and work hard on bosses, only to have it handed to other people eventually, which won't feel right regardless of if its a tier behind.

There were no sweeping 20-30% nerfs to Naxxramas, Ulduar or ToC/TOGC, so why now? Other than the loss of 600k subscribers, I don't see a rationale for this new course of action of trivializing every raid that people put effort into to a puggable 5-man level. If they want to see the fights that bad but refuse to actually participate in a raiding guild, then watch a youtube video of the fight.
85 Night Elf Druid
7870
05/24/2011 01:29 PMPosted by Attaral


I don't believe blizz has ever truly supported literal nerfs to regression content for the sake of making it accessible ever. Nerfs to content were implemented on the cutting edge of raiding to allow for accesibility to endgame raiders, and then the content was simply doable by others as they geared up, particularly with gear from later instances. The only time non-cutting edge content has been nerfed is if somehow it remained cutting-edge, or if changes in class mechanics made the fight prohibitive.

Its in my opinion that the existing practice worked just fine, people can gear up in normal firelands/rep/valor and knock out the existing content easily. The nerfs being put in place are just complete overkill on top of that.


Did you miss all of ICC? 30 percent buff is a much bigger nerf to the relative difficulty of that content than this nerf is.


The buff started as 5%, then went 10%, 15%, etc. over time. They didn't just make a 30% buff and throw it in. Did YOU miss all of ICC?
85 Undead Rogue
10520
Sure, Bashiok, that's all fine and dandy, but did Magmaw really need nerfing? C'mon now.
I understand the Blue response and think it's a decent medium. Some people just can't be happy.

But seriously. Don't make firelands and a TB-like daily hub for only new content for the next four months. =/

Look, it's not that I don't want players who want an easier experience to experience the raid content. It's just that difficulty of raid content is part of the experience.


The people that are capable of clearing the content will have done so by the time 4.2 hits. Let's give the people that are incapable of clearing it at the current difficulty a chance, once everyone else has moved on to 4.2.

You got your cookies from the bag when they were fresh, stop being selfish and pass the stale ones along to the hungry orphans.
90 Human Paladin
14550
05/24/2011 01:35 PMPosted by Penguintamer
If Firelands is to receive the same treatment then there has to be some sort of reward that players get out of it for doing it when it is actually difficult


No they don't. Access to the gear earlier is your reward.
This topic has reached its post limit. You may no longer post or reply to posts for this topic.

Please report any Code of Conduct violations, including:

Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.

Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.

Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.

Forums Code of Conduct

Report Post # written by

Reason
Explain (256 characters max)
Submit Cancel

Reported!

[Close]