i365 Vicious vs i371 Vicious - Comparison

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90 Gnome Death Knight
9235


so i would like to know what Z meant by



seems one part of Blizz doesnt talk to another. <em/> <em/>


This simply means we are looking into ways in which we could alleviate the current issue that makes sense and is still fair to as many people as this has affected. Currently, support is unable to provide any recompense. Should this change or further action be possible on our end, we will let you all know. We don't want to promise something we can't deliver on and exacerbate the current situation.

We haven't done any of this intentionally nor is our intent to cause any further issues.


Would it not be overly easy to change the item ID's of all i365 gear to reflect that of i371? Changing numbers in the system, doing a restart should allievate the problem. If the i365 gear is no longer valid anyways, then just change the ID's to reflect 371. Restart the servers and waa-laa done. Dead issue.

The community did not create this issue. The Devs did. As a small business owner, if the manufacturer we rep screws up, we are required within 24-48 hours to supply a corrective action statement to the customer. This has not been done to Blizz's customer. So to sit there and say that "Support is unable to provide any recompense" is complete BS.

There were 2 huge failures. Communication and implementation. No corrective action has been supplied by the Blizz devs. I am not buying Support's response here.
90 Gnome Warlock
6950
Exactly. People are crying bloody murder and its not even the people that should be angry (the ones that bought s9 during the season with cp)


time is still time no matter how you obtain your gear. While I agree that it is a slap to the face for those that were in arena to get gear it is still time spent for others to grind out for the gear.
Community Manager

sooooooooo what does that mean? Blizz hope you know that if you refuse to do nothing, you will lose subscribers. It might not mean much to you, but thik on this, all those unhappy people are going to pass on their experience to their friends, coworkers and family and you will not only lose current subscribers but future subscribers.


It just means that if we decide we can do something to help, we will. We just aren't in a position currently to tell you anything more at this point in time. This isn't from any lack of desire. Again, it's about finding a way to do something that makes sense in a way that's fair to as many people as possible. If we find that solution, we will let you all know.
Why are my orc shoulders so small?
85 Tauren Warrior
3265
This simply means we are looking into ways in which we could alleviate the current issue that makes sense and is still fair to as many people as this has affected. Currently, support is unable to provide any recompense. Should this change or further action be possible on our end, we will let you all know. We don't want to promise something we can't deliver on and exacerbate the current situation.

We haven't done any of this intentionally nor is our intent to cause any further issues.


Thank you Nethaera and I appreciate you clearing up the same thing I have said a few times now... that the link people found to the support page is the the current policy and only thing that can be said at this time.

I also understand that this is a complex situation with lots of issues and mechanics to address. There are players in Conquest S9, players with Honor S9 and now players in mixed Conquest S9/Honor S9/Honor S10 gear and even Ruthless in some cases now. How do you address all situations and fairly compensate the masses across such a wide gear spectrum that only continues to grow? That is the part players need to keep in mind with this situation.

Again, I appreciate your response to help with this discussion. Please do keep us informed as communication is what can keep this discussion on track.
90 Undead Warlock
6475
Just my 2 cents on my perspective of this. FYI, i have been playing wow continuosly since 3 months after release, and have been on ner'zhul since 6 months after release.

Firstly, I am not happy. I am an alt aholic, and due to my unstable schedule, the only thing i can do consistently is pvp. Que's are much shorter than dungeon finder, and the games are alot quicker than a dungeon. I purchased a grand total of 18 pvp items for my 7 lvl 80s, and thanks to the av weekend i was able to kit out my lock with a vicious weapon, which i promptly put a powertorrent enchant on. So, i am very unhappy that these items are now inferior. Regrinding 18 items worth of honor is not something i think i am going to do. If i had known this before hand, I would have done things differnetly. Which leads me to my second problem.

I'm not sure what it is, maybe this game has gotten to big, maybe the back room is suffering due to people being moved over to the titan project, or maybe it's somethign else. The constant rebalancing issues which put whole specs and classes out of favor from patch to patch, the degredation of the overall community, the real id fiasco form last year, and now this. Will this be the straw that breaks the camela's back, or is it just another one of the thousand cuts of death.

For myself, how this issue is handled will affect my playing the game on an ongoing basis in the future. Personally, my view is that everyone who bought the i365 items during the period between 4.2 launch and the start of season 10 should have their items upgraded. Whether or not this actually happens remains to be seem.
Edited by Felmoon on 7/8/2011 10:31 AM PDT
85 Blood Elf Paladin
6225

sooooooooo what does that mean? Blizz hope you know that if you refuse to do nothing, you will lose subscribers. It might not mean much to you, but thik on this, all those unhappy people are going to pass on their experience to their friends, coworkers and family and you will not only lose current subscribers but future subscribers.


It just means that if we decide we can do something to help, we will. We just aren't in a position currently to tell you anything more at this point in time. This isn't from any lack of desire. Again, it's about finding a way to do something that makes sense in a way that's fair to as many people as possible. If we find that solution, we will let you all know.
Just give us a vendor that, when you pop in 365 PvP gear, out pops the honor that was spent on it and any gems/enchants that were cast on it. Problem solved for everyone.
Just my 2 cents on my perspective of this.

Firslty, I am not happy. I am an alcoholic, and due to me unstable schedule, the only thing i can do consistently is pvp. Que's are much shorter than dungeon finder, and the games are alot quicker than a dungeon. I purhcased a grand total of 18 pvp items for my 7 lvl 80s, which thanks to the av weekend iwas able to kit out my lock with a vicious weapon, which i promptly put a powertorrent enchant on. This enchant represents over 1000 gold in mat value on my server. So, i am very unhappy that these items are now inferior. Regrinding 18 items worth of honor is not something i think i am going to do. If i had known this before hand, I would have done things differnetly. Which leads me to my second problem.

I'm not sure what it is, maybe this game has gotten to big, maybe the back room is suffering due to people being moved over to the titan project, or maybe it's somethign else. The constant rebalancing issues which put whole specs and classes out of favor from patch to patch, the degredation of the overall community, the real id fiasco form last year, and now this. Will this be the straw that breaks the camela's back, or is it just another one of the thousand cuts of death.

For myself, how this issue is handled will affect my playing the game on an ongoing basis in the future. Personally, my view is that everyone who bought the i365 items during the period between 4.2 launch and the start of season 10 should have their items upgraded. Whether or not this actually happens remains to be seem.



It's amazing how reading one word wrong can make the whole post cooler.
Edited by Toys on 7/8/2011 10:31 AM PDT
86 Blood Elf Rogue
8115

sooooooooo what does that mean? Blizz hope you know that if you refuse to do nothing, you will lose subscribers. It might not mean much to you, but thik on this, all those unhappy people are going to pass on their experience to their friends, coworkers and family and you will not only lose current subscribers but future subscribers.


It just means that if we decide we can do something to help, we will. We just aren't in a position currently to tell you anything more at this point in time. This isn't from any lack of desire. Again, it's about finding a way to do something that makes sense in a way that's fair to as many people as possible. If we find that solution, we will let you all know.


Sorry for asking essentially the same thing twice, but when you say you're not in a position to tell us anything more, does that include explaining why certain solutions suggested by us are impossible? Like upgrading 365 pieces to 371, or allowing 365 pieces to purchase 371 items.

I think that information would go a long way, as many players are clinging to those solutions. If we can understand why that can't be done, we can provide better feedback and start brainstorming new ideas.
85 Draenei Paladin
6735


so i would like to know what Z meant by



seems one part of Blizz doesnt talk to another. <em/> <em/>


This simply means we are looking into ways in which we could alleviate the current issue that makes sense and is still fair to as many people as this has affected. Currently, support is unable to provide any recompense. Should this change or further action be possible on our end, we will let you all know. We don't want to promise something we can't deliver on and exacerbate the current situation.

We haven't done any of this intentionally nor is our intent to cause any further issues.


Wow really? no compensation? Blizzard was never this bad before...
85 Blood Elf Warlock
6680
It just means that if we decide we can do something to help, we will. We just aren't in a position currently to tell you anything more at this point in time. This isn't from any lack of desire. Again, it's about finding a way to do something that makes sense in a way that's fair to as many people as possible. If we find that solution, we will let you all know.


/sigh.

I'll say this: You CMs are in a bad spot.

From my end this appears to be a stalling tactic by the devs. It would seem that they are waiting for enough people to get bored/tired/unsubbed before they announce a similar resolution to the CP conversion mistake. That is to say: nothing.

Upon further reflection, I've realized that this issue is even bigger than I had previously thought. As annoyed as many of us are over the lack of communication regarding the new changes, It is the Arena Vets who lose the most out of this.

I lost gold, honour and a specific amount of time. On the whole; not overly terrible.
mostly just an opportunity cost. Although for the Arena vets, they also have the opportunity cost of future grinding for honour through BGs in order to hit the new baseline. They were specifically told that there would be no need for that.

I have my doubts regarding any sort of compensation. Even the wording of the last two Blue posts have shifted closer and closer to "nothing can be done"

I also have no doubt that the beancounters have already calculated the loss of x% subscriptions vs. developement cost of a fix. I suspect, due to where pvp falls in the big picture, that they will be willing to take the loss. So be it.
Edited by Esoteryx on 7/8/2011 10:45 AM PDT
90 Human Priest
2935
I'll say it again, customer equity and loyalty...both are precious commodities...especially in times such as these. While this may be minor in the grand scheme of things, it chips away at it. My god, this is such an opportunity for the company to make a grand gesture that is positive for this client segment.
85 Draenei Paladin
6735


Again, it's about finding a way to do something that makes sense in a way that's fair to as many people as possible. If we find that solution, we will let you all know.


So basically your saying that you guys(Blizzard) are worried that if you give compensation to those that wasted game play hours in BGs that some people will say its unfair? I dont see any 6 forums saying how compensation would be unfair to those players who wasted hours of game play. Correct me if Im wrong but thats the kind of thought that you are giving me..
Edited by Germino on 7/8/2011 10:38 AM PDT
33 Undead Mage
350
the point of this change was to make you grind. by removing the grind, it would remove the point of the change. No? correct me if I'm wrong.

90 Human Mage
18615
They have no information whether this issue is on a high alert/escalation because maybe they don't have any control or communication with the development department.

They can just let these be and let time calm everyone. The only thing that will make Blizz feel this issue is when they lost a lot of subscriber, which might not happen.

Anyway, a word to you CM: I appreciate all the help but for your sake (since you're the one who's responding to this post) is to push the development department to come up with a plan. Whether the plan will be implemented or not, that can be discussed later in the future. As of right now, after days, everyone is still in the dark if or when the development department is working on this.

If it is too late to do anything on this season, let this be a learning experience for the next season. See if a lot of arena/rBG players like the way you create the better-newer-season-but-same-name gear. Don't try to balance PVP gears like PVE (if this is the main reason for season 10 Conquest). Let PVP be PVP.
90 Night Elf Warrior
5305
It just means that if we decide we can do something to help, we will. We just aren't in a position currently to tell you anything more at this point in time. This isn't from any lack of desire. Again, it's about finding a way to do something that makes sense in a way that's fair to as many people as possible. If we find that solution, we will let you all know.


The longer you wait to implement a solution, the fewer people the solution will be fair for as the people who were screwed over by buying s9 gear are now just grinding the honor to buy the s10 gear anyway.

The window of opportunity to make this right is closing quickly and the longer you do nothing, the more people believe you won't do anything.
85 Troll Druid
2295

sooooooooo what does that mean? Blizz hope you know that if you refuse to do nothing, you will lose subscribers. It might not mean much to you, but thik on this, all those unhappy people are going to pass on their experience to their friends, coworkers and family and you will not only lose current subscribers but future subscribers.


It just means that if we decide we can do something to help, we will. We just aren't in a position currently to tell you anything more at this point in time. This isn't from any lack of desire. Again, it's about finding a way to do something that makes sense in a way that's fair to as many people as possible. If we find that solution, we will let you all know.


Thanks for responding.

However, why not disable the timer for an honor refund on the 365 items? That way, those that want a full honor refund can get it. Those that want to hang onto their 365 items, for whatever reason, may do so. It doesn't address those that blew a bunch of gold on enchants, but this solution would at least be better than nothing. Plus I would guess this type of solution could be implemented without that much hassle on your end, whereas other solutions may not be feasible for technical reasons or fairness.
85 Troll Hunter
Nyx
5885
I do have a question. I would like to know why a simple upgrade to the 365s bought during that week isn't feasible. For example, I vendored a relic right when cata came out because I didn't know that my totems were replaced by relics. When I discovered this fact it was three weeks after I vendored the item. I opened up a ticket and talked to a GM describing the situation. They were able to go back and look and restore my item even though three weeks had passed. So it's obvious that data logs are kept. I think this would be the easiest and fairest solution to the community.


This is true. Hell the website even shows recent activity showing when PVP items were acquired! You all have the data. You could revert those actions through maintenance. Realm by realm rolling restarts like you do for all the hotfixes that are implemented.

But no. A lot has happened after these two weeks of people playing under false pretenses. Thats a lot of data to sift through and change and thats why ultimately nothing could be done. The best sollution so far is to whip up an NPC vendor for conversion, much like the old Golbin currnency exchange, only this time for items and honor. That would be the way to go.
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